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Crucifixion Cartoon in the Times on Good Friday

(112 Posts)
Granny23 Sat 08-Apr-23 13:41:10

I, am absolutely horrified after seeing today's 'cartoon' in the times which has been posted on Face Book. It depicts the Crucifixions of the current 1st Minister of Scotland, his predecessor and her husband. I am not a relative of these 3 nor even a close friend, but I do know them personally - all lovely kind and caring people - they do not deserve this. Also an insult to Christians on this, the holiest day in the calendar. In addition, it seems to be lacking the basic requirement of a cartoon, i,e, It is not funny. Any last vestige of decency or respect oot the windae.

Glorianny Sat 08-Apr-23 16:20:13

Apparently only 31% of the population is Christian now, so it would seem Easter although still a national holiday has little significance for the majority. It isn't in any case using the traditional christian cross, so the only real reference is the three crosses.
I think it's quite clever and funny.
When I was much younger I remember a joke being told that would probably offend Christians.
Teller stands with arms outstretched, head slightly to one side-"What a way to spend Easter. Still there's a good view of Jerusalem" (Sorry!!)

maddyone Sat 08-Apr-23 16:21:26

It is certainly offensive to Christians, but I believe that free speech and expression is a right that we don’t want to curtail, and therefore the fact that it is offensive is legally acceptable. Whether or not it s acceptable to offend some groups in society is questionable. Legally yes, it’s okay; in terms of respect, well it’s disrespectful, and some people believe that it’s not good form to be disrespectful.

In terms of disrespecting other religions, that is considered by many to be unacceptable. I don’t think we’d see a cartoon depicting Allah in such a way. Whether or not it’s okay to disrespect some religions but not others is certainly worth discussing. What has brought about the situation where the Christian religion can be mocked but not other religions?

maddyone Sat 08-Apr-23 16:23:06

I agree that the cartoon is most certainly clever.

volver3 Sat 08-Apr-23 16:27:06

Serious question - why is is offensive to Christians?

Its a picture of three people being crucified.

Is the film "Spartacus" offensive to Christians?

I don't know what offends you and you don't know what offends me. I can't be responsible for making sure you are not offended.

Since the cross is not part of the Muslim religion, (I think), you'd be very unlikely to see Allah depicted this way. But Muslim people are offended by portrayal of people (I think).

Are you suggesting that Christian people should behave like religious zealots to stop people doing things which upset them?

Baggs Sat 08-Apr-23 16:27:43

What has brought about the situation where the Christian religion can be mocked but not other religions?

Tolerance.

NotSpaghetti Sat 08-Apr-23 16:33:48

Well said Baggs.

NotSpaghetti Sat 08-Apr-23 16:34:47

... however I don't actually see this as mocking.

Ziplok Sat 08-Apr-23 16:35:42

Well, it’s certainly in very bad taste.

Namsnanny Sat 08-Apr-23 17:46:50

Baggs

Shocking. Poor taste. But a good cartoon. All these things can be true at once.

Shocking and poor taste are the whole point of political cartoons. I often really dislike the Times cartoons but I believe in freedom of expression so I just move on swiftly after seeing one.

All good points.

Aveline Sat 08-Apr-23 18:10:43

I don't actually think it is a good cartoon. If it was, and it was funny I'd like it but it isn't and I don't.

Ashcombe Sat 08-Apr-23 18:26:24

It is insensitive towards the people depicted and to the feelings of Christians, given that it was published in Holy Week. I don't find it at all funny.

volver3 Sat 08-Apr-23 18:36:03

Still nobody has told me why a depiction of crucifixion is offensive to Christians.

Once again, political cartoons are not meant to be funny. Is it because Christians think we're laughing at them that they get offended?

Ailidh Sat 08-Apr-23 18:59:48

Next week, I'd have thought it mildly funny and rather clever, especially the St. Andrew's cross/voting cross, which didn't at first dawn on me.

For Good Friday, it's tasteless.

volver3 Sat 08-Apr-23 19:00:51

Why? WHY? WHY?

I must be difficult to offend...

Germanshepherdsmum Sat 08-Apr-23 19:02:43

Or deliberately stupid and argumentative.

Ailidh Sat 08-Apr-23 19:07:07

I'm not offended, I just find it tasteless. It may well be that there is only David Dickinson's sheet of Bronco that separates the two feelings but there is a difference for me.

Tasteless - fart jokes.
Offensive - poverty.

Allsorts Sat 08-Apr-23 19:19:45

It is disrespectful and mocking and I find it in very poor taste. I am not surprised a few on here find it fine, confirms what they are like. I abhor the percentage of people who bring a lot of things down to the gutter, as the people who sang in the theatre so that the show was cancelled early and spoilt the night for the hardworking cast and decent audience.

valdali Sat 08-Apr-23 19:20:29

Ailidh

Next week, I'd have thought it mildly funny and rather clever, especially the St. Andrew's cross/voting cross, which didn't at first dawn on me.

For Good Friday, it's tasteless.

Exactly how I feel.

maddyone Sat 08-Apr-23 19:27:11

I don’t know if I can explain, and others may be able to explain better, but for me, the crucifixion of Christ is not something to be mocked, made light of, laughed at, and included in tasteless jokes/cartoons. The crucifixion of Jesus (and others) was horrendous, the worst torture anyone could imagine. To turn this into a joke, a satire, make light of it, include it in jokes or satires about others, whoever they may be, is simply in very poor taste, and yes, as it appeared on Good Friday, remembered as the day of Christ’s suffering, it makes it worse. Any other time of year might not evoke such a strong reaction, but to choose this day, sacred for many people, to display a crass and insensitive cartoon, shows a complete disregard for the feelings of other people to whom it may be at best in poor taste, at worst completely offensive.
I don’t think I can do any better, maybe someone else can.
Incidentally I’m not really a regular church goer, and I’m certainly no born again Christian, but I have a quiet feeling of the presence of something more important than ourselves, and I believe that Christ gave us a code for living, which we should try to bear in mind.
Do unto others as you would have then do unto you.
Love thy neighbour as thyself.
And so on.

volver3 Sat 08-Apr-23 19:33:44

Germanshepherdsmum

Or deliberately stupid and argumentative.

Stupid.

Nice.

Wyllow3 Sat 08-Apr-23 19:35:18

Aveline

I saw that cartoon and thought it was in very poor taste. I'm surprised that an editor would sanction its use.

Yes, my feelings.

Step too far despite cries of subtle cleverness.

If I were muslin, would find it out offensive actually.

Oh how funny ha ha ha they've "crucified" a muslim.

grannyrebel7 Sat 08-Apr-23 19:36:44

Sick!

volver3 Sat 08-Apr-23 19:38:26

maddyone

I don’t know if I can explain, and others may be able to explain better, but for me, the crucifixion of Christ is not something to be mocked, made light of, laughed at, and included in tasteless jokes/cartoons. The crucifixion of Jesus (and others) was horrendous, the worst torture anyone could imagine. To turn this into a joke, a satire, make light of it, include it in jokes or satires about others, whoever they may be, is simply in very poor taste, and yes, as it appeared on Good Friday, remembered as the day of Christ’s suffering, it makes it worse. Any other time of year might not evoke such a strong reaction, but to choose this day, sacred for many people, to display a crass and insensitive cartoon, shows a complete disregard for the feelings of other people to whom it may be at best in poor taste, at worst completely offensive.
I don’t think I can do any better, maybe someone else can.
Incidentally I’m not really a regular church goer, and I’m certainly no born again Christian, but I have a quiet feeling of the presence of something more important than ourselves, and I believe that Christ gave us a code for living, which we should try to bear in mind.
Do unto others as you would have then do unto you.
Love thy neighbour as thyself.
And so on.

Thank you for taking my question seriously maddyone.

I don't think the cartoon makes light of the crucifixion.

Do unto others as you would have then do unto you.

First found in texts from Ancient Egypt, about 300BCE.

Aveline Sat 08-Apr-23 19:46:25

Looks like you just don't understand how others feel.

nexus63 Sat 08-Apr-23 19:46:59

it would depend on your sense of humour, it might be funny to some people, it is a political joke ....and so what if you know them....and yes i am a supporter of the snp and always have been and from what i have read nicola has a sense of humour.