Newspapers influence on voting in the EU referendum of 2016

Urms said recently she was taking a break from GN dickens.

Galaxy

Urms said recently she was taking a break from GN dickens.

Yes, and she’s in Malaga

volver3

As I have been known to say in the past...

A majority might be in favour of the death penalty but that doesn't make it right.

Ahh, volver, but what about 'the will of the people'?

After all, we repeatedly told that that was the reason we absolutely must implement the result of an advisory referendum which would have been rerun had it been mandatory.

If a majority are in favour of the death penalty then surely the 'will of the people' must be carried out?

FGS Fleurpepper I don’t know about proof reading your own posts but how about reading mine properly.
Then you needn’t worry about asking me for Brexit benefits since I didn’t vote for it.Or thinking I’m bothered by insults either since I don’t get any as I’m not one who voted to leave the EU.
See what I mean here?
I suspect Galaxy means much the same as I do btw in that there’s insults directed at DM readers and Leave voters calling them thick by any other name yet some patronising sympathy also directed at the working classes at the same time.As long as they stay in their place tho I bet.

If a party's manifesto included a return to the death penalty and they won an election what would you suggest as an alternative system.

I'd emigrate.

Well yes I might too but it would be the 'will of the people' and that is the best system we have. Referendums are a different matter I think.

We would never be given a referendum on bringing back the death penalty, so it won’t happen.

Somebody, anybody - can you copy this please and note the date? Just for future reference...

The death penalty question is complex, there are nuances and unintended consequences involved, and so it is not a question that should ever be the subject of a yes/no question in a referendum. It is all too easy for a single appalling murder to be highlighted to whip up emotion.

The question of the UK membership of the EU is infinitely more complex and should never have been the subject of a referendum. The most ridiculous mantra we've heard repeated many times is "we knew exactly what we were voting for".

Nobody knew.

People had to be consulted on leaving the EU but not on any other matter.
I believe more people would be against the death penalty than for it it any case. Don’t worry tho, won’t happen, nor will bear baiting or otter hunting or legal dog fights or legal bare knuckle boxing.

Dickens

Has anyone seen Urmstongran around?

I only mention this because she usually pops up on the N&P threads and I haven't seen any posts from her recently.

She might be on holiday of course, but I always worry slightly when a well-known poster seems to disappear.

Urmstongran is absolutely fine and dandy enjoying spending time with her family.

She is not in Malaga FannyCornworth she is in the U.K.

varian

The death penalty question is complex, there are nuances and unintended consequences involved, and so it is not a question that should ever be the subject of a yes/no question in a referendum. It is all too easy for a single appalling murder to be highlighted to whip up emotion.

The question of the UK membership of the EU is infinitely more complex and should never have been the subject of a referendum. The most ridiculous mantra we've heard repeated many times is "we knew exactly what we were voting for".

Nobody knew.

Blimey, I find myself in total agreement with you volver3

David Cameron rolled over to appease the right of the Conservative Party by giving the U.K. the referendum, they never thought it would achieve a leave vote.

It is obvious now that they were not prepared in any way for the result, which is in my opinion the reason David Cameron ran for the hills immediately.

Sorry premature posting.

It’s well known in here that I voted to leave. It’s a work in progress which has been hampered by a global epidemic, war in Ukraine and two hapless PM’s.

I am not asking anyone in particular to give a list of Brexit benefits. Anyone who can provide a list that makes any sense will do. We have been asking and asking again for a very long time. And all we get is being told off for asking again and being persistent.

Galaxy

Well yes that's a point against referendums which I would agree are bad things.

Mixed feelings about referendums. But one thing is for sure, is that any Referendum has to be put with very precise terms of what it would mean and actually be- with all pros and cons clearly put forward and fact checked by all main parties and every household provided with such, and Press and outside powers not allowed to print and put forward clear lies.

And NO PM shoud be able to promise that a decision based on a stupid YES/NO Referendum, without any of the above implemented, and legally only adivisory- should be implemented.

Two hapless PMs, GG13?

Which 3 of the 5 Tory Prime Ministers since 2016 were not hapless? And how have they improved the UK’s post-Brexit position?

Galaxy

Well yes I might too but it would be the 'will of the people' and that is the best system we have. Referendums are a different matter I think.

So how would you square that with the current government if restoring the death penalty had been on their manifesto?

Because far more of 'the people' voted against them than for them.

Well because that's the current democratic system we have in this country.

Galaxy

Well because that's the current democratic system we have in this country.

It's equating our current FPTP system with 'the will of the people' that bothers me. Who are 'the people'? the minority who voted 'for' or the majority who voted against?

I would accept that under our current system of democracy the manifesto promise could legitimately be executed. What I don't accept is that it would be 'the will of the people' when the pro vote was that of a minority.

I think 'the will of the people' is a very dangerous concept.

Benefit of Brexit - treating the Australians like people who might be worth trade deals with instead of letting them down as they did in the past ? A free trade deal signed in 2021 but on past experience I wouldn’t trust it at all .

Oreo

Just tellin’ it how it is on forums VioletSky and has been for the last 7 years.

Why do you think that is?

GrannyRose15

Greta

Oreo, "the permanently pissed off "will eventually include the whole nation. Brexit isn't finished yet. Will you be proud of the legacy you'll be leaving your children, grandchildren and future generations? They will certainly want to know what on earth possessed 52% of voters to sign up to this madness.

No they won’t. Because by the time my grandchildren are grown they will understand the value of being an independent sovereign state that can stand up for freedom everywhere.

The UK is now a nation that used to punch above its weight but can no longer do so. It is shrinking in the eyes of the rest of the world - witness Biden's 24 hours in Northern Ireland of which apparently 9 hours were spent asleep. Biden only managed to drink a cup of coffee with Sunak.

nanna8

Benefit of Brexit - treating the Australians like people who might be worth trade deals with instead of letting them down as they did in the past ? A free trade deal signed in 2021 but on past experience I wouldn’t trust it at all .

That’s not, of course, a benefit for the UK. In fact the terms are such that it’s bad news for
British farmers, our environmental protections, and our animal welfare standards.

And its economic benefit is minuscule for us, both absolutely and relation to losses caused by Brexit.

In my opinion Brexit has been a disaster and it will take years to repair the damage. I don't blame those who voted for it regardless of their reasons or feelings for so doing but it's clear to me there is a growing realisation that it was a mistake. I do, however, think our elected politicians were shabby in passing the buck to the population when they are so well-paid to take decisions on our behalf, pay which has easily risen ahead of inflation. And I blame the politicians who used the Brexit debate to feather their own nests.