Has the penny dropped (as fast as the Pound)- Brexit is a disaster

GrannyGravy13

I honestly do not recognise the U.K. Fleurpepper consistently posts about.

I can only guess that FP frequents dodgy areas, shops and restaurants when they visit the U.K.

Me neither - the UK is not suffering as a result of Brexit, it is suffering from a completely inept government - and I have no faith that Labour will be any better. Both government and the opposition are largely populated by morons, unfortunately. We deserve better.

vegansrock

In the past people ate less meat, it is factory farming and greed that has led to the cruelty of industrialised production. People who eat meat should reduce the quantity. We were told that leaving the EU would lead to higher welfare standards. The opposite has happened. Standards have been relaxed. Few inspections mean farmers and abbatoirs can break the law knowing there will be no sanctions. Not sure how we got onto that one, but it’s another Brexit promise undelivered

Really?

I've only bought free-range British bacon for a long time because the way it is mass-produced in Denmark is disgusting.
Not to mention mink farms there too.

Songbird trapping in Spain and Malta? Still goes on.
Hens are still kept in battery cages in EU countries because the time given for farmers to change ( 12 years) means that the legislation is just meaningless and they hope it will be forgotten.

Laws are only any good if they are enforced.

The EU did make laws but perhaps only the British adhered to them.

We should not let our standards drop now, though, I agree.

Fleurpepper

GSM, yes, we in the UK.

What has Switzerland got to do with Brexit and the UK and the EU? The Law in Switzerland requires that all meat is sold stating provenance, so the customer has the choice, this in restaurants too, not just butchers' and supermarkets. And Switzerland is not in the EU, so why mention it? How weird, it seems to be a bit of an obsession with some of you, somehow.

Switzerland is mentioned because of their unique position (along with Norway and Iceland) of decisively rejecting membership of the EU in a referendum but agreeing certain treaties which benefit them.

I can't see much wrong with that myself so questions are asked about the benefits of such arrangements to both sides and could it be something for the UK to work towards?

I think that should have been an option in the first place. It was Mrs May's government which pledged to leave the Customs Union, a big mistake imo.

Switzerland is mentioned because it’s where you live isn’t it FP?

Shortages of staff is a universal problem all over Europe, not due to Brexit. If I hear the words employment crisis, lack of man power, recruitment difficulties once more here in France ....... it's everywhere.

I was just thinking, it would be good when discussing Europe if posters could display flags of the country in which they are in!! There have been many interesting contributions from 🇩🇪 🇮🇪 🇨🇭 🇫🇷, but it is all getting a bit confusing when posters aren't clear where they are.

Switzerland has been negotiating trade deals continually and the EU has got nowhere the Swiss only want the parts that suit them. They do grudgingly accept freedom of movement but only on a limited basis, so although you can travel through without checks, commercial goods do go through a customs barrier
It is not the same as Norway and the other EFTA members, there is no way the EU will allow a “Swiss deal”, we could probably agree a Norway deal but that means accepting a lot of their rules.

Joseann

I was just thinking, it would be good when discussing Europe if posters could display flags of the country in which they are in!! There have been many interesting contributions from 🇩🇪 🇮🇪 🇨🇭 🇫🇷, but it is all getting a bit confusing when posters aren't clear where they are.

Hello! 🏴󠁧󠁢󠁷󠁬󠁳󠁿

🇬🇧🏴󠁧󠁢󠁥󠁮󠁧󠁿

Germanshepherdsmum

The EU accepts beef from cows reared and transported in terribly cruel conditions from the destroyed rainforests of South America, so don’t pretend that only the UK ‘accepts just anything’.

Anyway, what’s with this ‘we have no idea what’s coming in’? I thought you live in Switzerland?

Perhaps Fleurpepper means “We, when in the UK…” as she has said before now they keep a flat in the East Midlands for use when visiting their daughters and grandchildren.
She spoke of possibly letting it a while ago, so perhaps she has no plans to visit as frequently.

If the EU decides that for chocolate to be called chocolate, it has to have a garanteed percentage of cocoa mass, for instance, then the UK has to produce chocolate that adheres to those standards, and not Hersheys sugar and palm oil mix! Or not export at all.

Hersheys is American, produced in America, so why that should be a consideration is 🤔

Cadburys is made in the EU now, unfortunately, thank you Kraft.

I think European chocolate deserves 🇪🇸 or even 🇮🇹.
Wasn't it introduced to Europe in the sixteenth century by Christopher Columbus? He carried back cacao beans to Spain from his voyages in America.

Me neither - the UK is not suffering as a result of Brexit, it is suffering from a completely inept government

Perhaps, Saetana, you should ask yourself why we have this inept government. I'm old enough to remember that it was voted in specifically to 'get Brexit done'. Perhaps if voters had looked past the ends of their noses they might have noticed that Johnson booted out all the competent tory MPs and filled his post 2019 cabinet with Brexit loyalists, chosen not for their ability but for their adherence to Brexit.

So, I would say that, because of this government, the UK is suffering badly as a direct result of Brexit...

Foxygloves

Germanshepherdsmum

The EU accepts beef from cows reared and transported in terribly cruel conditions from the destroyed rainforests of South America, so don’t pretend that only the UK ‘accepts just anything’.

Anyway, what’s with this ‘we have no idea what’s coming in’? I thought you live in Switzerland?

Perhaps Fleurpepper means “We, when in the UK…” as she has said before now they keep a flat in the East Midlands for use when visiting their daughters and grandchildren.
She spoke of possibly letting it a while ago, so perhaps she has no plans to visit as frequently.

We British people, and on a site which is mainly made up of British people. This thread if about the UK, and Brexit, the demise of the Pound - and NOT about Switzerland, quite simple to understand.

British chocolate used to be amazing- and some of the best, Rowntree, Cadbury's, Fry's, and some more. Currently, it contains far too much palm oil, other fats and sugar to be deamed to be chocolate in EU terms- which require no palm oil and proper cocoa made from real cocoa beans. Just one example.

I only like Lindt chocolate.

Does Lindt Balls Contain Palm Oil? Exploring The Use Of Palm Oil In Lindt Balls And Alternatives To Reduce Consumption
6 Feb 2023 — Unfortunately, the answer is not clear-cut, as some Lindor chocolates do contain palm oil, while others do not. It is important to note that ..

Oh no 😥.

Callistemon21 I didn’t say animal welfare in the EU was good - it’s horrible everywhere, although the country with the highest (enforced) welfare standards is an EU member. But we were told animal welfare laws would be tightened up in the U.K. - they haven’t been. Another non Brexit benefit.

Saetana

GrannyGravy13

I honestly do not recognise the U.K. Fleurpepper consistently posts about.

I can only guess that FP frequents dodgy areas, shops and restaurants when they visit the U.K.

Me neither - the UK is not suffering as a result of Brexit, it is suffering from a completely inept government - and I have no faith that Labour will be any better. Both government and the opposition are largely populated by morons, unfortunately. We deserve better.

Me neither - the UK is not suffering as a result of Brexit, it is suffering from a completely inept government

That's an interesting observation.

About 3 years before the Referendum, Boris Johnson penned an article for The Telegraph in which he opined that "if Britain left the EU, we would have to recognise that most of our problems are not caused by Brussels but by chronic British short-termism, inadequate management, sloth, low skills, a culture of easy gratification and underinvestment in both human and physical capital and infrastructure"

Although accusing the populace of a culture of "easy gratification" (I am assuming that it was us all he was referring to), is a bit much coming from a man who appears to suffer from the same 'culture'!

Going by his logic, that could explain why so many people say that they have not noticed any particular problems since we left, and that life goes on as before. Maybe the problems we had, or most of them anyway, were not after all caused by our membership?

In his article published on 12 May 2013, Mr Johnson said that he would support the legislation, but warns that Britain’s problems will not be solved by simply leaving the EU as many of his Conservative colleagues apparently believe. Well, he seems to have got that bit right!

So why did we leave?

You said, and I have no faith that Labour will be any better. Both government and the opposition are largely populated by morons, unfortunately. We deserve better.

I tend to the same conclusion. Though I don't think our politicians are morons, rather they are self-serving incompetents.

Starmer, for me, is disappointing. He may have some good ideas, but he does appear to be something of an 'appeaser'. He also did what Johnson did (and which many of us criticised him for) - got rid of those who opposed him in his party. Which I don't think is very healthy for a democracy.

And I instinctively do not trust politicians who are fervently in favour of a particular cause, argue fiercely for for it, and then flip-flop- it's a bit Groucho Marx... Those are my principles, and if you don’t like them…well I have others!

Ironically, the only two politicians who I really disliked, were and are, at the same time, the only ones who did not, and have not deviated from their beliefs... Thatcher and Farage.

Johnson, Truss and Starmer - they are all flip-floppers in my book. We've seen the results brought about by Johnson and Truss equivocating, I'm not over enthusiastic to see what the Starmer-effect will be.

British chocolate used to be amazing- and some of the best, Rowntree, Cadbury's, Fry's, and some more. Currently, it contains far too much palm oil, other fats and sugar to be deamed to be chocolate in EU terms- which require no palm oil and proper cocoa made from real cocoa beans. Just one example

As I said earlier, much of Cadbury's chocolate is made in the EU now since it got taken over by Kraft.

The EU hasn't banned palm oil in food products, it did, however, rule that it must be labelled as such and not as vegetable oil.

Since leaving the EU, the UK has followed suit:

15 March 2018:
UK Government statement

Products containing palm oil must be labelled as such – the vegetable oil ingredient of food must now indicate the vegetable origin of the oil.

vegansrock

Callistemon21 I didn’t say animal welfare in the EU was good - it’s horrible everywhere, although the country with the highest (enforced) welfare standards is an EU member. But we were told animal welfare laws would be tightened up in the U.K. - they haven’t been. Another non Brexit benefit.

iswym

It's only been seven long years ...

To cut a long story short- the UK cannot export its goods to the EU, unless it agrees to follow the same rules and standards.
The UK can choose to change and lower standards, if they wish- but NOT if they want to export to EU.

The UK can, and has done, decide to accept lower standards (see Australian trade deal, for instance), and has chosen not to do checks on most goods or foods imported from EU- in fear of more chaos at the ports and empty shelves.

I would NOT call this 'taking back control' personally.

Oh, not Australian beef again! 😁

British chocolate is made in the EU - if it's not up to EU Standards are the factories making illegal products then?

Why not Australian beef again- as standards are very different from those imposed on UK farmers, be it on husbandry, antibiotics and feeds, etc.

GSM, yes, we in the UK

Not to put too fine a point on it, but I don’t think you can say “We in XYZ ..” unless you are “in XYZ”
It’s misleading and before you off on one about having UK citizenship, I think we got the message.

I’m sure we’d all like to thank Fleurpepper for the above information RE uk trading with the eu.
Information there that we’d never heard or read.