Unfolding news, attack in Nottingham

Since it’s in the public domain that this man was both on drugs and also, allegedly, a dealer of drugs, how do we know this if he’s not got a criminal record? How did the police know that he has been violent previously? They did know that because it was announced by the media whilst it was all happening. I’m afraid I’m puzzled by all this. Was he known to the police for previous violence or not?

maddyone

Since it’s in the public domain that this man was both on drugs and also, allegedly, a dealer of drugs, how do we know this if he’s not got a criminal record? How did the police know that he has been violent previously? They did know that because it was announced by the media whilst it was all happening. I’m afraid I’m puzzled by all this. Was he known to the police for previous violence or not?

Was he known to the police for previous violence or not?

I think he must have been. I read that they had been "called out" to incidents in which this man was involved.

How much violence and drug-dealing / taking is one allowed to get away with before the Law decides that it's had enough? Because the general public I think have already had enough.

I remember, years and years ago now (drugs and knife crime are not a new thing are they) a black youngster - only about 11 or 12 I think - being pulled off his bike and stabbed to death. His mother was the neighbour of a friend of mine... she promised her son that if he did well in school, her and his father would buy him a new bike. He took it out on his birthday for his first ride - and never came home. A gang of thugs involved in drugs wanted the bike. It's thought he refused, so they dragged him off it and stabbed him. I think he died before he even got to hospital. This was in Peckham. The parents never came to terms with the tragedy and went into a decline. He was their only child.

I thought about them when I saw the two fathers at the vigil. Eventually, the public will forget (when the next act of violence makes the headlines) and the poor parents will be left to cope with their grief as best they can. It doesn't bear thinking about. And that poor man, who will never enjoy his retirement.

The 'war' on drugs and its associated violence doesn't ever seem to get anywhere does it? When that young boy in Peckham was murdered - this was back in the 6os - there was much wringing of hands and talk along the lines of "something must be done", but here we are decades later with a trail of murders associated with drug-dealing, and yet more families torn apart with grief. The problem seems to be escalating, but I don't know what the actual statistics are.

Just unbelievably tragic.

I have read that the man arrested was NOT known to the police.
Can someone please post a link to where they say he was?
Thanks.

Like maddyone I want to separate facts from speculation.

After all the speculation above, I too would like to know for certain that this man was known to the police or not (for violence, that is)a lot of people are walking around known to have some drugs connection).

NotSpaghetti

I have read that the man arrested was NOT known to the police.
Can someone please post a link to where they say he was?
Thanks.

I've read that he was - that they'd been "called" to incidents in which he'd been involved. But I cannot remember which media it was.

I'd also like to see a link - if I can find it, I'll post it.

21:41growstuff

Nicenanny3

Yes we gave our own British born criminals without importing more. The fact remains if he hadn't been allowed into our country these people would still be alive.

But people in other countries might very well be dead. Don't they matter?

Seems to me they matter more to you than the 2 young students and this older man who were killed by this migrant with this awful uncaring comment.

Dickens
The knife crime in this country is extremely worrying. There was also the case of little Daminola (excuse spelling, not sure about it) a few years ago and countless killed since then.
With this latest attack, I really would like to know the true circumstances of the situation. If he was known to the police, why was he still on the streets? If he was known for drug offences why was he not deported? Why as a country can we not get to grips with drug offences? With knife offences? With criminal and other undesirables being given leave to remain? Although deporting criminals who are not citizens wouldn’t solve the problem obviously as we have plenty of our home grown criminals. But when I read recently of a convicted rapist being pulled off flight as he about to be deported, I despair of any sensible decision ever being made.
I’m still feeling very sad about these senseless murders, but not even a fraction of the sadness and grief the victims families are feeling.

The Daily Telegraph reported on June 14th that
A man questioned by the police in connection with the triple killing in Nottingham is understood to be a migrant from West Africa with a history of petty drug dealing.
The 31 year-old lived at a series of rental properties close to the scene of the first attack.
Sources claimed the man, who was still being questioned late last night, was a low-level drug dealer who was known to police but did not have a criminal record.
He was described as 'a very quiet guy' but someone who had a history of mental problems.

From the BBC website today. June 15th.

What do we know about the suspect?
The 31-year-old suspect in custody is originally from West Africa but had been in the UK for many years, official sources have confirmed.
He is not a British citizen but he had settled status, meaning he had permission to stay in the country for several years.
He did not have a criminal record and was not known to the security services
It is also understood that the man has a history of mental health issues.

I do not know if security services includes the police.

eazybee

The Daily Telegraph reported on June 14th that
A man questioned by the police in connection with the triple killing in Nottingham is understood to be a migrant from West Africa with a history of petty drug dealing.
The 31 year-old lived at a series of rental properties close to the scene of the first attack.
Sources claimed the man, who was still being questioned late last night, was a low-level drug dealer who was known to police but did not have a criminal record.
^He was described as 'a very quiet guy' but someone who had a history of mental problems.^

... "petty drug dealing". The terminology makes it sound less harmful doesn't it...

with a history of petty drug dealing
Euphemism for "with a history of wrecking lives, not just those of the addicts".

Nicenanny3

21:41growstuff

Nicenanny3

Yes we gave our own British born criminals without importing more. The fact remains if he hadn't been allowed into our country these people would still be alive.

But people in other countries might very well be dead. Don't they matter?

Seems to me they matter more to you than the 2 young students and this older man who were killed by this migrant with this awful uncaring comment.

You'd be wrong.

Today the police have said he had been a student at the University of Nottingham..

"The suspect is a former University of Nottingham student but this is not believed to be connected with the attack."

Dickens

eazybee

The Daily Telegraph reported on June 14th that
A man questioned by the police in connection with the triple killing in Nottingham is understood to be a migrant from West Africa with a history of petty drug dealing.
The 31 year-old lived at a series of rental properties close to the scene of the first attack.
Sources claimed the man, who was still being questioned late last night, was a low-level drug dealer who was known to police but did not have a criminal record.
^He was described as 'a very quiet guy' but someone who had a history of mental problems.^

... "petty drug dealing". The terminology makes it sound less harmful doesn't it...

‘Sources claimed’ wasn’t the police I don’t think, they haven’t released any information about him being a drug dealer or drug taker. It was probably some guy he knew down the pub who said it, when the media don’t know, they quote ‘sources’. It may be true, it may not.

I think 'sources claimed' usually means doorstep comments that can't be immediately verified. A girl living in Ilkeston Road said he used to have a room in the same house but had left because of frequent visits from the police; she also claimed they had kicked the door in and searched his room. (I think that was the BBC website.)

Just been released he’s an engineering graduate named Valdo something - sorry can’t remember the surname.

Valdo Calocane. Sounds Italian.

@growstuff

Re: ‘ There are plenty in all cities from all backgrounds.’

I would advise you to investigate the risk factors associated with the imbibing of “Skunk” and extreme violence (especially knife related violence).

The assertion that these factors are ubiquitous in society is manifestly untrue.

A very cursory google trawl will confirm this for you.

An informed view of risk and how to mitigate it might save you - and your loved one’s - live one day.

He was an engineering graduate.

The suspect in the Nottingham attack was known to MI5 because he turned up to the agency's London headquarters and tried to get in.
According to 'a source who told The Sun'.

Just wanted to say how heartbreaking to see the poor parents, comforting each other, distraught at the
needless loss of their lovely children, who should have had all their lives before them. Just so so sorry and also for the older man who was also murdered.

I'm agreeing with Martin regarding skunk having recently read a book that encompassed psychiatrists' overview of the drug, several professionals were of the opinion, more harmful than heroin as to the lasting damage it can do to the brain. Not to mention the associated crime that goes with it. Nothing like the stuff that was around in the 60s I gather.

Did you mean to say "The assertion that these factors are ubiquitous in society is manifestly TRUE ." Martin?
The very cursory Google trawl seems to suggest that Most cannabis in the UK is 'high-risk' super-strength skunk, study finds

It is indeed heartbreaking. For some reason the pictures of Charlie, Barnaby's brother, clutching a picture of him particularly got to me.

The parents have said 'Look after each other, and love everyone'. They must be special people to find such words at this time.

Just read these posts back and see all the speculation and misinformation posted I cannot see why people would post without knowing the facts, it’s wrong. Just saying I heard it somewhere but can’t remember or someone told me but don’t remember who is just making trouble.