Court of appeal supports asylum seekers challenge

Whitewavemark2

I note that bastion if the right wing and Braverman supporter -Steve Baker- can no longer stomach Bravermans culture wars and has withdrawn his support.

www.theguardian.com/politics/2023/jul/02/steve-baker-withdraws-support-for-suella-braverman-over-grooming-gangs-rhetoric-says-ally?CMP=share_btn_tw

It will be tragic. I hope there are more.

Unless the Tory party completely loses it’s marbles, i can’t see her standing a snowballs chance in hell of becoming the next leader.

It has lost its marbles, very much encouraged by the likes of Braverman, Howard, Anderson et al, and shows no signs of recovering them

conservativehome.com/2023/07/03/our-survey-seven-in-ten-conservative-activists-believe-that-the-uk-should-leave-the-echr/

Maremia

And now you can relax. New Conservatives, with Lee Anderson, has announced their 12 point plan to reduce immigration.

Oh my goodness. Thirty P Lee.

Message deleted by Gransnet. Quotes a deleted post.

MaizieD

Whitewavemark2

I note that bastion if the right wing and Braverman supporter -Steve Baker- can no longer stomach Bravermans culture wars and has withdrawn his support.

www.theguardian.com/politics/2023/jul/02/steve-baker-withdraws-support-for-suella-braverman-over-grooming-gangs-rhetoric-says-ally?CMP=share_btn_tw

Steve Baker is an evangelical Christian. Reminds me of the evangelical Christians in America who support Trump. I really don’t understand some people.

I still can’t get over Lee Anderson being MP in Dennis Skinners old constituency…

“However, I don't think it is at all clear, from the statistics of the percentage eventually granted assylum, in our oh so slow system, that the majority are not genuine. I wonder what led you to form this idea?”

The fact that a great many that arrive in the UK deliberately destroy their passports so they cannot be returned adds testament to that, they are abusing our liberal system.

Message deleted by Gransnet. Quotes a deleted post.

Katie59

“However, I don't think it is at all clear, from the statistics of the percentage eventually granted assylum, in our oh so slow system, that the majority are not genuine. I wonder what led you to form this idea?”

The fact that a great many that arrive in the UK deliberately destroy their passports so they cannot be returned adds testament to that, they are abusing our liberal system.

That’s not how it works. I have explained already that there is a robust process used by assessing staff for undocumented asylum seekers (and other potential immigrants).

Please provide evidence to back up your claim that “many, probably a majority, are not genuine asylum seekers”.

Katie59

“However, I don't think it is at all clear, from the statistics of the percentage eventually granted assylum, in our oh so slow system, that the majority are not genuine. I wonder what led you to form this idea?”

The fact that a great many that arrive in the UK deliberately destroy their passports so they cannot be returned adds testament to that, they are abusing our liberal system.

I think they are told to do that by the people who they believe their lives depend on.

If they could go to the embassy in the first safe country and apply for assylum in the country they want to move to, they would stiĺ have their passports. We don't facilitate any "safe routes" any more.

MayBee70

I still can’t get over Lee Anderson being MP in Dennis Skinners old constituency…

It's very Sparticus. Will the real Conservstive party please stand up.

I wonder where his backing is coming from?

DAR there are many reasons asylum seekers don’t have documents (passports are just a part of it): they don’t have them to start with (passports are for the affluent); they are destroyed in an act of war; they’ve been seized by the authororities, and lots more. Plus many embassies in war zones are closed.

Of course, safe routes matter, and require staff who are trained in assessing undocumented claimants.

And don’t get me started (again, I’ve written reams on here before) on the UK’s lack of interest in investing in correctly implementing the Carrier Sanctions Directive 2001/51/EC, which would make a massive difference.

I haven't seen your posts on that! I'll look it up.

11:17Siope

DAR there are many reasons asylum seekers don’t have documents (passports are just a part of it): they don’t have them to start with (passports are for the affluent); they are destroyed in an act of war; they’ve been seized by the authororities, and lots more. Plus many embassies in war zones are closed.

If only the affluent have passports how can the illegals on the dinghies pay thousands of pounds to get here, let me think most are really economic migrants🤔

Siope
So how many migrants do you think this country should accept, because there are many countries where minorities are persecuted, wrong tribe, wrong religion.
All countries have identity documents I don’t believe cost is an issue

To find out if people are genuine asylum seekers or economic migrants, you would need to have in place an effective, efficient, properly funded, resourced and peopled system of border control. Did we used to have such a thing in place? If so, what became of it?

DaisyAnneReturns, yes. Amazing that he used to be a Labour politician.

Yes, Braverman is now on a shoogly peg. Is Anderson touting for her position?

nicenanny3 Selectively highlighting to reinforce your own prejudices is weird. The rest of what I wrote matters equally.

they are destroyed in an act of war; they’ve been seized by the authororities, and lots more. Plus many embassies in war zones are closed

The latter matters because a) those without passports but with the means to buy one can’t get them; and b) many countries require either exit or entry visas to travel, and these can’t be obtained if embassies or consulates aren’t open.

At that point (stay with me here, it’s not complicated) travel by major carrier becomes even more problematic because of lack of training and investment in implementing the Carrier Sanctions Directive 2001/51/EC, in particular Recital 3 of the directive which states that signatories have to apply the directive “without prejudice to the obligations resulting from the 1951 Geneva Convention”, which includes the prohibition of refoulement

Nicenanny3

11:17Siope

DAR there are many reasons asylum seekers don’t have documents (passports are just a part of it): they don’t have them to start with (passports are for the affluent); they are destroyed in an act of war; they’ve been seized by the authororities, and lots more. Plus many embassies in war zones are closed.

*If only the affluent have passports how can the illegals on the dinghies pay thousands of pounds to get here, let me think most are really economic migrants🤔*

Quite right. These are not poor people coming on these boats they are paying many thousands to travel in these rubber dinghies.

To pretend otherwise is just plain stupid. We all know what the people smugglers charge them.

They are told to get rid of ID, passports etc. We have heard this from their own mouths when they are interviewed on TV.

Katie59

Siope
So how many migrants do you think this country should accept, because there are many countries where minorities are persecuted, wrong tribe, wrong religion.
All countries have identity documents I don’t believe cost is an issue

Still waiting for you to substantiate your earlier claim.

Not all countries accept id cards as travel or entry documents. I know of no country where passports are free - can you enlighten me? Are they countries whose citizens need asylum?

Last year 13000 Albanians arrived in small boats, all economic migrants of the rest many were from safe countries, even those from so called unsafe countries are not all refugees they are using the cover to get in.

Very few get returned even to Albania.

We don’t know how many Albanian arrivals last year were economic migrants because processing is so far behind. We do know that in previous years (when Albanian arrival numbers were much lower) c57% of claims were granted, 88% of those successful were women. Although the home office don’t publish reasons for successful asylum claims, the high percentage of women suggests they were victims of trafficking.

So, as far as the data, allows, you’re wrong about Albanians.

Please provide evidence for your claims - majority turned down, and now ‘many of the rest are from safe countries…’.