The Refugee Ship

I would expect a newly converted and unoccupied barge to look clean, it's just been painted. Would some people prefer someone to go round spreading filth before it's used just to satisfy the demands of some that migrants should be housed badly? My daughter's uni accommodation was filthy and expensive but she had her own tiny bathroom, somewhere to put her belongings and somewhere to study plus a shared kitchen. She soon got it "shipshape" if you excuse the pun .

In my opinion Braverman does not want to speed up Home Office processing (which would on historical evidence result in about 70% being granted refugee status) because hotels, barges, etc., enable whipping up of anti-immigrant feeling.

I hope there is a zero tolerance policy of any bad behaviour with these migrants, both on board and when they are roaming around ashore unsupervised.
Any complaint, any incident of bad behaviour should result in them being sent home pronto.

Of course there is a problem there. So many of these devious characters destroy their passports and paperwork so they can claim to come from a war-torn country like Syria.

Very sensible post, Dickens

Some people have spent years in refugee camps, refugees from some countries have spent generations.

Is the world ever going to solve the problems of war, persecution, drought?
I can't see it happening any time soon.

09:33Joseann

I follow a man on Facebook obviously I can't give his name he says he's a channel observer he's usually accurate, he has said this morning that a boat got into difficulties in French waters and was escorted back to Calais.

Thanks Dickens for your contributions

So it's the boats that are not fit for purpose, the state of the sea is pretty irrelevant. They been to be stopped before more lives are lost in a horrific manner.

Callistemon21

Very sensible post, Dickens

Some people have spent years in refugee camps, refugees from some countries have spent generations.

Is the world ever going to solve the problems of war, persecution, drought?
I can't see it happening any time soon.

I can't imagine how depressing it must be to contemplate that your whole life, or a large part of it, might be lived in one of these refugee camps.

The older generation might be resigned to it - knowing that they'll never see their homeland again - too sad to even think about it.

I can understand why young, or younger, men decide to 'move-on' towards Europe. We've all only got one chance at life. If they are watching their families disintegrate and they are used to being previously active in the workforce... well, who wouldn't want to try to improve their and their family's life?

Is the world ever going to solve the problems of war, persecution, drought?
I can't see it happening any time soon.

A thousand curses on war-mongering tyrants who, for no other reason than ego, self-aggrandisement, narcissism and blood-lust, want to start and engage in a war.

No, I can't see it happening any time soon, either.

Callistemon21

Very sensible post, Dickens

Some people have spent years in refugee camps, refugees from some countries have spent generations.

Is the world ever going to solve the problems of war, persecution, drought?
I can't see it happening any time soon.

If they’ve spent “years” in refugee camps how come they can pay thousands of € to people smugglers.

I hear this excuse time and time again “oh well their families help them out”. I can hand on heart say that there have been many times in my life when I could not have borrowed that amount of money from anybody in my family because neither I nor they had any money! They are clearly better off than I was some years ago.

Primrose53

Callistemon21

Very sensible post, Dickens

Some people have spent years in refugee camps, refugees from some countries have spent generations.

Is the world ever going to solve the problems of war, persecution, drought?
I can't see it happening any time soon.

If they’ve spent “years” in refugee camps how come they can pay thousands of € to people smugglers.

I hear this excuse time and time again “oh well their families help them out”. I can hand on heart say that there have been many times in my life when I could not have borrowed that amount of money from anybody in my family because neither I nor they had any money! They are clearly better off than I was some years ago.

The people who have spent years in refugee camps are presumably not the people who want to come here Primrose!

www.habitatforhumanity.org.uk/blog/2016/09/refugees-asylum-seekers-migrants-crucial-difference/

www.unhcr.org/refugee-statistics/

journals.sagepub.com/doi/full/10.1177/0306422015569438#:~:text=However%2C%20one%20of%20the%20oldest,home%20to%20some%207%2C000%20people.

The oldest camp was probably the one set up in 1947 after the partition of India.

With global warming how come they can’t settle previously very cold places that must now have become habitable? The Arctic being one of them.

nanna8

With global warming how come they can’t settle previously very cold places that must now have become habitable? The Arctic being one of them.

I think you’re being ironic here

nanna8

With global warming how come they can’t settle previously very cold places that must now have become habitable? The Arctic being one of them.

Mmmm 🤔 I don’t think you’ve thought that suggestion through, have you?

nanna8

With global warming how come they can’t settle previously very cold places that must now have become habitable? The Arctic being one of them.

Or even Antarctica (eventually) - though the angle of the sun might be a bit of a problem for growing 'stuff'! So we might have to airlift in a few packed lunches .

MerylStreep

nanna8

With global warming how come they can’t settle previously very cold places that must now have become habitable? The Arctic being one of them.

Mmmm 🤔 I don’t think you’ve thought that suggestion through, have you?

And the nearest neighbour might want to eat you for breakfast...

o.aolcdn.com/images/dims?quality=100&image_uri=https%3A%2F%2Fs.aolcdn.com%2Fhss%2Fstorage%2Fmidas%2Fd6792631767f188ec73521b05d12c21d%2F204995298%2F498047592-ed.jpg&client=cbc79c14efcebee57402&signature=d68b3a4ec0781301f2cc65c8fe23998f043ccab4

nanna8

With global warming how come they can’t settle previously very cold places that must now have become habitable? The Arctic being one of them.

Well, that's where the boats and barges could come into their own!!

Dickens

nanna8

With global warming how come they can’t settle previously very cold places that must now have become habitable? The Arctic being one of them.

Or even Antarctica (eventually) - though the angle of the sun might be a bit of a problem for growing 'stuff'! So we might have to airlift in a few packed lunches .

I have pondered this before now and, if climate change became as extreme as has happened previously or another asteroid were to hit then yes, Antarctica could become habitable, couldn't it?

From what I've seen from a filmed internal tour of the barge, it certainly isn't five star, but it isn't a Dickensian prison hulk either. I would imagine that compared to the accommodation many asylum seekers have left in their home country, and have experienced en route across Europe, it will represent a welcome, safe, warm, dry and relatively comfort refuge, for which they are paying nothing. So no frills seems reasonable to me under these circumstances. Beats a tent in Syria or elsewhere, anyway.

Can't believe some of the comments on here painting single, male refugees as potential criminals and rapists, and suggesting that women in the area are somehow suddenly more at risk of attack. No-one here has actually used the "r" word yet, but the inference is clear. As someone said earlier, Donald Trump and his Proud Boys obviously have some support here for those views about immigrants. Leaves a bad taste.

MayBee70

Apologies if this has been mentioned before ( I’m flitting in and out today) but someone said on tv the amount of money being spent on the Rwanda scheme, which obviously isn’t working as a deterrent, could be better used to help provide accommodation or employ more people in processing migrants. And people don’t seem to realise that a lot of the money being used regarding migrants is coming from our overseas aid budget, which, under this government has already been drastically reduced.

Rwanda is not in the equation yet.

ethelwulf

From what I've seen from a filmed internal tour of the barge, it certainly isn't five star, but it isn't a Dickensian prison hulk either. I would imagine that compared to the accommodation many asylum seekers have left in their home country, and have experienced en route across Europe, it will represent a welcome, safe, warm, dry and relatively comfort refuge, for which they are paying nothing. So no frills seems reasonable to me under these circumstances. Beats a tent in Syria or elsewhere, anyway.

Can't believe some of the comments on here painting single, male refugees as potential criminals and rapists, and suggesting that women in the area are somehow suddenly more at risk of attack. No-one here has actually used the "r" word yet, but the inference is clear. As someone said earlier, Donald Trump and his Proud Boys obviously have some support here for those views about immigrants. Leaves a bad taste.

Have you seen the news reports of some asylum seekers doing just this. One rapist from Somalia even taken from a deportation flight because of some ill judged petition signed by of course lot of Labour Mps, and other deluded individuals. So he's free to roam again. Disgusted by this.
We don't know who these people are,where they come from, not a good idea to welcome them with openers until we do.

Barge publicity and photos will be used by people smugglers to attract more customers.

The government is classing the cost of housing asylum seekers as part of Overseas Aid. They are also recouping substantial amounts in VAT
www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2023/jul/23/hundreds-of-millions-in-uk-aid-returns-to-treasury-in-vat-on-asylum-hotel-bills
There's lies, damned lies, statistics and government accounting!!!

Glorianny

The government is classing the cost of housing asylum seekers as part of Overseas Aid. They are also recouping substantial amounts in VAT
www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2023/jul/23/hundreds-of-millions-in-uk-aid-returns-to-treasury-in-vat-on-asylum-hotel-bills
There's lies, damned lies, statistics and government accounting!!!

I would be more worried if the Government was avoiding paying VAT on its bills.

The article does say that under international rules that money spent on asylum seekers in their first year can come out if the overseas aid budget, so nothing illegal about that either.

GrannyGravy13

Glorianny

The government is classing the cost of housing asylum seekers as part of Overseas Aid. They are also recouping substantial amounts in VAT
www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2023/jul/23/hundreds-of-millions-in-uk-aid-returns-to-treasury-in-vat-on-asylum-hotel-bills
There's lies, damned lies, statistics and government accounting!!!

I would be more worried if the Government was avoiding paying VAT on its bills.

The article does say that under international rules that money spent on asylum seekers in their first year can come out if the overseas aid budget, so nothing illegal about that either.

The Government doesn't pay VAT the hotel owners do. 20% on rooms to begin with then 10%.
Yes they are behaving within International law (for a change)/ The point is that the huge amount people are complaining about is not all money that would be spent in the UK. It's money which would go overseas. And some of it is recouped in VAT.
Of course the rest is going into the pockets of UK hotel owners.

Hoteliers charge VAT on rooms.

The Government will therefore be paying VAT on its bills for the hotels it has commandeered.