Charitable status and private schools

Apparently removing charitable status is complicated and wouldn’t necessarily make any difference, but charging VAT on fees is an easier possibility. (I read that somewhere.) I agree, anything that looks like a u-turn is unfortunate.

He probably thought through the consequences of potentially thousands more children flooding the public sector schools. I think it's better to see politicians willing to change their minds in the light of further info.

I'm pleased about this. My non rich inlaws put their child into a private school, because the state school was c... . Bullying rife, no help, so out they came and what a difference. Massive improvement in confidence, and excellent GCSE results. Choice is paramount. Their sacrifice worth it. Let's not bring everything down to the lowest, let's up the state schools game.

I'm not sure if Starmer's pragmatic u-turn on removing charitable status, when the objective of making them liable for VAT can be achieved without it, is as unfortunate as being a PM who supports a racist Home Secretary, u-turns on Net Zero and is prepared to write off £billions of fraudulently acquired public money (among other things.)

I'm puzzled as to why this has even been deemed newsworthy...

Backtracking on pledges is not uncommon in Uk politics in these times - the electorate is becoming more aware and less believing of all politicians post Blair and BJ!
Although I think Starmer is still in the process of trying to feel out what policies are popular and will get him elected to number 10. The actual policies are unimportant.

As a result of Tory austerity, funding of state school pupils has dropped dramatically when compared to those children in fee paying schools, who are subsidised by the tax payer.

Labour is looking to redress this imbalance and try (AGAIN) to get the education budget back up to where it should be as it did during its last term in office.

From the IFS report.

The Labour party has proposed a package of policies to remove tax exemptions from private schools. Most importantly in revenue terms, it has proposed levying VAT on private school fees. The revenue raised would then be used to increase state school spending and would be targeted at pupils from disadvantaged backgrounds.

In 2022–23, average private school fees across the UK were £15,200 in today’s prices (net of bursaries and scholarships). This is £7,200 or nearly 90% higher than state school spending per pupil, which was £8,000 in 2022–23 (including day-to-day and capital spending). The gap between private school fees and state school spending per pupil has more than doubled since 2010, when the gap was about 40% or £3,500.

I'm puzzled as to why this has even been deemed newsworthy

Because MaizieD we have had thread after thread on GN with posters saying it would happen, so just setting this to right.

It would be great to have a voucher scheme which could be spent by parents to pay for state or private education. Thus enabling more children to attend private schools…… true equality?

Joseann

^I'm puzzled as to why this has even been deemed newsworthy^

Because MaizieD we have had thread after thread on GN with posters saying it would happen, so just setting this to right.

I can understand that, but why the conclusion that it is an 'unfortunate u-turn'?

( I thought you'd be delighted by the news...)

ronib

It would be great to have a voucher scheme which could be spent by parents to pay for state or private education. Thus enabling more children to attend private schools…… true equality?

I’m not sure you have thought this through😄😄😄

I can understand that, but why the conclusion that it is an 'unfortunate u-turn'?

Eh? Not my comment.

ronib

It would be great to have a voucher scheme which could be spent by parents to pay for state or private education. Thus enabling more children to attend private schools…… true equality?

No ronib, true equality would be the whole lot attending state schools.

Though if acceptance of your 'vouchers' were to be made obligatory ( and assuming that they are offered to all parents) it could be highly amusing to see how the private schools coped with a massive influx of bolshie disaffected children... What a shock for all those teachers who thought they had escaped the hurly burly of the state sector for the calm of the private...

At the moment you have the ridiculous situation where parents are having in some cases to do 3 jobs just to get food on the table or resorting to food banks to feed their children.

Their tax is subsidising parents who can afford to pay fees of on average £15000 for each child to attend school.

That isn’t morally right or fair.

Joseann

^I can understand that, but why the conclusion that it is an 'unfortunate u-turn'?^

Eh? Not my comment.

Not quite your comment, I admit, but this seems to convey the same message

backtracking on his pledge doesn't look good.

I am not delighted or bothered either way because the actual benefit of charitable status to schools isn't very much anyway.
I just think too much time has been spent promising this when even my pea brain with no legal training knew it would need nigh on impossible.

oops *be not need

I am a bit disappointed by your response to vouchers. It would make private schools less elitist and gain a wider social mix. Also it would make more places available in the sought after state grammar type schools.
Not all state schools have problem children- some single sex state schools are very focused.

I seen to remember a voucher scheme being offered undervtha Thatcher government. What happened to that?

I've worked in a state school in a deprived area. Actually, we liked our children, but some certainly had 'attitudes' that the private sector would find problematic... especially if they had a large number to deal with. State sector is obliged to take these children, I wonder how the private sector would cope if they had the same obligation.

We put our children into the Private sector at Junior level as the local schools were not the best. We struggle to pay the fees but I feel it was worth it. Only did it until they were 11 as we wanted the good foundation to see them into the senior sector.
So No not every parent is Rich and we by no means the only ones to do this, it was quite common in our era about 20 years ago.

So Vat on Private Schools, so will they do that to University fees as well? Same diffence? Although didn't they bring in Uni fees?

So Vat on Private Schools, so will they do that to University fees as well? Same diffence?
And the Royal Ballet School and others for example where most of the pupils receive bursaries?
And as boarding schools come under "childcare", how will VAT there be fair all round?

Joseann looks like somebody is trying to no platform you😉

It isn’t a good look for Starmer to row back on promises so early on.

Sir Starmer has seen the light and has decided to leave fee paying schools alone, well done 👏👏👏

*At the moment you have the ridiculous situation where parents are having in some cases to do 3 jobs just to get food on the table or resorting to food banks to feed their children.

Their tax is subsidising parents who can afford to pay fees of on average £15000 for each child to attend school.

That isn’t morally right or fair.*

This!
I have never minded paying tax in order to contribute to a fair, equitable society. But I do object to part of my taxes subsidising an elitist education system for a tiny minority of the country. Perhaps, if allchildren were educated within a state system that truly reflects the society in which we all live, there would be greater empathy and understanding amongst citizens. My personal opinion is that private education should be abolished completely - unpopular with some posters, I’m sure. I think it would serve all children well - both rich and poor - to be educated together.

MaizieD

I seen to remember a voucher scheme being offered undervtha Thatcher government. What happened to that?

I've worked in a state school in a deprived area. Actually, we liked our children, but some certainly had 'attitudes' that the private sector would find problematic... especially if they had a large number to deal with. State sector is obliged to take these children, I wonder how the private sector would cope if they had the same obligation.

They and their parents would be warned about their behaviour.If discipline still failed they would be suspended and maybe expelled.They wouldn’t have the obligation of continuing to educate them that state schools have.I’m not surprised that teachers enjoy their jobs at private schools.