Emergency Aid To Gaza Halted Because Israel Says So?

GrannyGravy13

Glorianny I believe in Israel’s right to defend itself against terrorists.

Unfortunately Hamas hide amongst the population of Gaza.

I feel immense sympathy for all who have lost loved ones, who are maimed and who are living in fear in the region.

If and when a ceasefire is agreed on it will take years to rebuild the relationship between Israel and Palestinians.

I cannot see a place for Hamas in Gaza or the West Bank…

You assume Israel want a relationship with Palestinians. I'm not sure they do.
As for defending themselves, they have a duty in war to protect the civilian population, in both the type of munitions they have used (huge bombs with inaccurate targeting and large areas of destruction), and their instructions to the civilian population (go south you will be safe there, but they are still bombed) Israel has not met that duty.

Israel has an absolute right to defend itself, but natural justice insists that it does so with proportionality, and in my view as well as millions around the world, it is failing the natural justice test.

With regard to Hamas - they exist in numerous countries around the Middle East and none of those countries view them as terrorists, so they are welcome if not actively supported. So by getting rid of them in Palestine, they will still exist.

Violence is simply not the way to achieve anything.

Israel not only has a duty to protect civilians during war, it has a double duty, because it is an occupying force.

Whitewavemark2

CNN

More than 800 officials from the United States and Europe have signed a scathing criticism of Western policy towards Israel and Gaza, accusing their governments of possible complicity in war crimes.

In a statement obtained by CNN, the officials say there is a “plausible risk that our governments’ policies are contributing to grave violations of international humanitarian law, war crimes and even ethnic cleansing or genocide.”

They accuse their governments of failing to hold Israel to the same standards they apply to other countries and weakening their own “moral standing” in the world.

Among them are around 80 United States officials and diplomats.

BBC

More than 800 serving officials in the US and Europe have signed a statement warning that their own governments' policies on the Israel-Gaza war could amount to "grave violations of international law".
The "transatlantic statement", a copy of which was passed to the BBC, says their administrations risk being complicit in "one of the worst human catastrophes of this century" but that their expert advice has been sidelined.
It is the latest sign of significant levels of dissent within the governments of some of Israel's key Western allies.
One signatory to the statement, a US government official with more than 25 years' national security experience, told the BBC of the "continued dismissal" of their concerns.
"The voices of those who understand the region and the dynamics were not listened to," said the official.
"What's really different here is we're not failing to prevent something, we're actively complicit. That is fundamentally different from any other situation I can recall," added the official, who spoke on condition of anonymity.
The statement is signed by civil servants, diplomats and government officials from the US, the EU and 11 European countries including the UK, France and Germany.

This was also on the BBC website yesterday and IMO shows the extent to which the actions of Israel and the support being given by some countries is being questioned by people with much more experience of Middle East politics than anyone posting on this thread. World opinion has turned against Israel, few people can stomach seeing innocent women and children being slaughtered, especially when there is no clear end in sight. If the world had been able to see what was happening in Nazi Germany, I have no doubt that Hitler would have been stopped but information was not as freely available then. However, it's different now. We know what is happening in Gaza, we've seen the devastation caused by the IDF's bombs, we know that innocent women and children are being killed in their thousands and we know what the aims of the Israeli right wing government are ie exactly the same as Hamas, no peace, no two state solution and the obliteration of the Jews or the Palestinians. Where this will end is anyone's guess but one thing is for sure, this is not the way to give Israelis a safe place to live!

foxie48

Absolutely.

There is mountains of experience behind that letter, we must listen to these people and not make the mistake that the German people did in the 30s.

No I wont make the mistake of the German people. We have different views of the links between then and now.

Galaxy

No I wont make the mistake of the German people. We have different views of the links between then and now.

If we do compare there were quite a few people in the UK in the 1930s who thought Jews were unacceptable. The people I know who support Palestine are very clear they have no issues with Jews.
Those condemning Hamas however seem to have problems with Muslims in many countries.
So I do wonder who is most at risk?

I am indeed condemning Hamas.

Jews

This is worth watching, Obama on the situation and his and Trump's views about Netanyahu. Something is really starting to change in the US www.youtube.com/watch?v=rBLjOXkKAnE

Glorianny Thanks for posting this, I doubt many will bother to watch it but I did and it summed up a lot of what I believe. Opinion in the US is changing very rapidly, just as it is all over the world. Currently, thousands of Palestinians are being killed by the IDF, Gaza is being turned into a wasteland and we are no nearer to peace than we were on 8/10 /23, in fact we are further away. The only person who is benefiting from this carnage is Netanyahu. The Pro -Palestine march in London yesterday was attended by Jewish groups. Netanyahu and his vile right wing government do not speak for all Jews but I worry that the uninformed bigots in this world will use what is happening in Gaza and The West Bank to justify their anti-semitic ravings and stoke up hate towards Jews, who have absolutely no sympathy whatsoever with what Netanyahu is doing to the Palestinians.

It is clearly not in Netanyau’s interest to cease the war. If the war does indeed cease, it is certain that there will be an election and Netanyahu will be chucked out.

The reason that he is desperate to hold onto the premiership is because he is shielded from the bribery and corruption charges brought by the Israeli police, because he recently forced through a law that prevents the courts from enforcing him to recuse himself from government in order that he attends trial.

If found guilty -and his actions seem to suggest that he thinks he will be- he will serve at least 10 years in prison.

There’s a lot of war mongering going on in this country, too. My grandsons school had someone from the army giving a careers guidance talk the other day: told them being a soldier was less dangerous than being a farmer or working for the NHS. My daughter told the school that maybe it was safer because we aren’t deploying our troops anywhere.

If we think the current hostilities are bad imagine what happens if Iran gets directly involved, currently that’s not very far away. They could close the Gulf easily crippling oil supplies we need a solution to Gaza quickly now.

The world needs to impose a two state solution on Netanyahu - it is the only way to achieve peace.

Netanyahu, like all right wing leaders thinks nothing of his country, only of himself.

Israel deserves to live in peace.

Palestinians deserve to live in peace.

WWM2I don’t believe the world can bring about a solution. The world might in fact delay one.
Also the world doesn’t seem to be on the same page in this crisis.
And how would a left wing leader have reacted differently?

Absolutely. My feelings exactly.

One good thing for people of Jewish faith, is that the world is finally understanding the difference between faith and state.

The state of any nation including Israel, is rightly criticised when it behaves with abomination, but the faiths contained within that nation should be free to practice their faiths without criticism.

Anti-semitism and anti- Islam is growing around the world and this should always be separated from the state. To reduce criticism of the state to criticism of the faith does a disservice to all people of faith.

ronib

*WWM2*I don’t believe the world can bring about a solution. The world might in fact delay one.
Also the world doesn’t seem to be on the same page in this crisis.
And how would a left wing leader have reacted differently?

Can you expand what you mean please?

Wwm2. I was hoping you could expand on your original comment….
It did spark a train of thought.

IMO when it comes to Israel, the "world" is the US because without the US, Israel would just be a very small country with little in the way of resources.The US has given Israel $318 billion since the end of World War II,” which has enabled it to develop a more sophisticated economy than it's neighbours despite having few natural resources and a huge army with the best weapons supplied and paid for by the US.
globalaffairs.org/bluemarble/how-much-financial-assistance-has-us-given-israel

In the past, there has been strong support for Israel from Jews living in the US but that support was being questioned even before the incursion into Gaza, the majority of American Jews do not support Netanyahu and because they are more likely to vote Democrat than Republican, with an election in sight, Biden needs to keep his Jewish voters as well as his Muslim/Arab voters on side. I think we are going to see a change in the support given by the US that will hopefully lead to Netanyahu's downfall and the election of a more rational Israeli government.

Interesting analysis foxie.
You could well be right.

I think you are absolutely right foxie48 one of the interesting things is to look at US news coverage. It is being much more sympathetic towards Gaza. CNN had a very moving piece from the first press people into Gaza and an interview with a nurse who had just got out. Both were very sympathetic.
I do worry that the UK who hang on US coat tails haven't actually started to move in the same way.

I was also interested to read that Trump dislikes Netanyahu immensely.

It takes some doing to attract so much dislike from so many quarters.

foxie yes I certainly agree about the USA but their authority would be that much greater if they had the world on their side.

foxie yes I certainly agree about the USA but their authority would be that much greater if they had the world on their side.

If the US moves away from giving Israel, what has at times seemed like, unquestioning support, it will bring the UN closer to agreement. The US only needs to abstain and it would be possible for the UN to vote for an immediate ceasefire. Israel, of course, would not comply, but it would give Netanyahu a clear message that American support has strings that could be cut, it would also give a very strong message to Israeli's that they could end up on their own surrounded by hostile countries unless they are prepared to negotiate and it's very clear that Netanyahu and his right wingers will block any attempt at negotiating peace, so they will have to go.