Should Starmer sue Sunak?

Mollygo

Quite easily Maisie. I said earlier on the thread that Sunak adding the mention of Starmer’s inability or unwillingness to acknowledge what a woman is to the list of his U turns was not a good idea.
But who mentioned Brianna, or Brianna’s mother?
Starmer or Sunak?
Starmer made it about her.

Number 10 however were clearly very agitated at Sunak’s performance and saw the whole debacle as a result of his abysmal lack of political astuteness .

Sunak simply isn’t a good political performer, he can’t think on his feet and is tin eared.

He is just reminding everyone what a slippery person Starmer is. He takes advantage of any opportunity for personal gain, whatever the ethics. At the moment he's fishing for votes and says whatever he thinks will gain the support of the electorate. I'm sure anyone who votes Starmer into office will soon realise how duped they have been.

Duped in what way? curtaintwitcher

Curtaintwitcher, just replace 'Starmer' from your post with 'Sunak' and see how well it reads.

Greta

Curtaintwitcher, just replace 'Starmer' from your post with 'Sunak' and see how well it reads.

Starmer has ethics

Mollygo

Quite easily Maisie. I said earlier on the thread that Sunak adding the mention of Starmer’s inability or unwillingness to acknowledge what a woman is to the list of his U turns was not a good idea.
But who mentioned Brianna, or Brianna’s mother?
Starmer or Sunak?
Starmer made it about her.

What a sad and twisted way of interpreting the incident.

Keep saying that. MaizieD. It won’t change who said what.

But the fact is it’s a sad twisted way to look at it without acknowledging that Starmer made it about Brianna by drawing attention to Brianna’s mother.
Sunak, though I think he was wrong to add that u turn to the list on that day, was pointing out the harm done to females including all those females who were in the House, (including Mrs Ghey) that day, by someone who is head of the Labour Party.

It’s the only way to interpret the incident, and any twisting is done just by you MaizieD.
Starmer was clearly rattled by the accusations on his flip flopping and indecisiveness on certain things and quickly spotted a way to try and turn it around by bringing Mrs Ghey into it.
I know there’s an election coming up and I’ll be voting for him to become the next PM, with a few reservations it has to be said, but seeing him do this made me cringe.

He has handled the issue badly, I mean in general not specifically in this instance, but let's face it, it's quite rare that people handle the issue well. I was relieved to see the Lords discussing it as adults yesterday.

Oreo

It’s the only way to interpret the incident, and any twisting is done just by you MaizieD.
Starmer was clearly rattled by the accusations on his flip flopping and indecisiveness on certain things and quickly spotted a way to try and turn it around by bringing Mrs Ghey into it.
I know there’s an election coming up and I’ll be voting for him to become the next PM, with a few reservations it has to be said, but seeing him do this made me cringe.

I don’t understand though how people can excuse Sunak for making that particular jibe when he had previously been informed that Brianna’s mother would be there. He’s either deaf, or tone deaf. That isn’t any more okay than Starmer raising to the bait.

Rising not raising

Galaxy

He has handled the issue badly, I mean in general not specifically in this instance, but let's face it, it's quite rare that people handle the issue well. I was relieved to see the Lords discussing it as adults yesterday.

Who handled the issue badly?

The PM who didn't have the nous to leave a potentially sensitive jibe out of his script or the LOTO who was clearly taken aback and disgusted by the inappropriateness of it?

If Mollygo and Oreo seriously think that Starmer is in any way rattled by Rishi's accusations they have clearly never watched PMQs. It has happened week after week ever since Starmer became LOTO. It's a boring irrelevance.

Starmer has handled the sex/gender issue poorly, I am a labour and a Starmer supporter but I can cope with acknowledging that. Sunak is not interested in womens rights or the rights of trans people.
To be fair to Starmer he has moved his position on womens single sex spaces but many people are wary because of labours position in the past.

I don’t think KS was rattled. I think it was deliberate when he drew attention to Brianna-trying to take the heat out of allegations of u turns- especially when you look at the Green pledge u turn arriving the next day.
Voting Labour at the next election is a no choice option, but I wish it wasn’t KS in charge.

Mollygo

I don’t think KS was rattled. I think it was deliberate when he drew attention to Brianna-trying to take the heat out of allegations of u turns- especially when you look at the Green pledge u turn arriving the next day.
Voting Labour at the next election is a no choice option, but I wish it wasn’t KS in charge.

I ave watched plenty of PMQs. I have heard these litanies of Starmer's 'shortcomings' repeated time after time. It's just part of the weekly game. Johnson did it, too. I have never seen Starmer look in the least bit worried by them . He's a KC, for gods sake. Years of practice in appearing unconcerned in court cases.

This time, the shock on his face was palpable. He was lost for words for a few seconds. I have never seen him look so angry.

I agree MaizieD. I always watch PMQ, I’ve never seen Starmer visibly blanch before. He was furious. Even GB News saw that.
www.gbnews.com/politics/pmqs-hoyle-starmer-sunak-brianna-ghey

We’ll just have to agree to differ then. I think he typically saw it as a chance to make mileage, you don’t. Not a problem for me.

Perhaps Starmer should send Sunak a letter telling him if he persists with these lies, he will be hearing from his lawyers. I am sure Starmer being a barrister can set out his case clearly.

Not more duped than the Conservative government that has been in power for 14 years. Never seen the country in such a mess. It was bad before the pandemic and Brexit so no excuses.

Personally I think both Sunak and Starmer are out of touch. Sunak has got it wrong about so many things and I am not sure what Labour under Starmer stands for any more as the policies change constantly, presumably to make them more election friendly. I have never forgotten Starmer’s hesitancy to define a woman though! Worrying to say the least considering the massive influence the (minority) trans lobby seem to have achieved in a society where a great many more women struggle to hang on to their rights, hard won in the first place.

Oreo

It’s the only way to interpret the incident, and any twisting is done just by you MaizieD.
Starmer was clearly rattled by the accusations on his flip flopping and indecisiveness on certain things and quickly spotted a way to try and turn it around by bringing Mrs Ghey into it.
I know there’s an election coming up and I’ll be voting for him to become the next PM, with a few reservations it has to be said, but seeing him do this made me cringe.

Oreo, I agree with you but still will be voting Labour as it's the lesser of two evils. How many pledges has Sunak not completed? One out of five and the inflation going down was nothing to do with him. Starmer and Reeves should not have made that pledge as they won't know what state the Treasury will be in if they took office. I think this uturn is being cautious as there are bigger issues facing this country. The UK is only responsible for 1% world pollution so I am wondering what difference at this stage our green initiative will make unless the major polluters like China and India can get on board.

Germanshepherdsmum

Brianna’s mother was not in the gallery at the time.

And yes, a lot of people know nothing about the cab rank principle. Does that make them ‘thick and stupid’?

Starmer does his fair share of repeating his favourite anti-Conservative tropes too.

Brianna's Mother wasn't there at the time only because she was late. That doesn't stop her knowing what has been said. I was gobsmacked when I heard Sunak say what he said. It took me a while to close my mouth & I had no idea Brianna's Mom was due to attend. The statement just wasn't clever or right.
Get rid of the Rich, Out of Touch Bsrds. They don't represent me or most of the population they should never have been elected in the first place!!

Germanshepherdsmum

Brianna’s mother was not in the gallery at the time.

And yes, a lot of people know nothing about the cab rank principle. Does that make them ‘thick and stupid’?

Starmer does his fair share of repeating his favourite anti-Conservative tropes too.

It doesn't matter whether Brianna's mother was in the gallery as it would have been brought to her attention anyway. The offence was still there.

Just a reminder that this thread isn't about the Brianna incident. It's about Sunak accusing Starmer of supporting terrorists because he has been the defence barrister in a number of cases involving terrorists.

It is not only an unjustified slur, it is also part of the tory attack on the justice system's duty to uphold the law.

It would not necessarily have come to her attention. Sunak always trots this out but it was Starmer who made it about Brianna, purely to score points.