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Dr. Hilary Cass - report re trans.

(433 Posts)
Urmstongran Tue 09-Apr-24 14:32:37

This, from Suzanne Moore today in The Telegraph:

“ When Dr Hilary Cass was commissioned to report on standards of care within the NHS, it was as if finally an adult had stepped into the room. She and her team have looked at the evidence and practices that have evolved the affirmative model (designed to support and affirm an individual’s gender identity) and found much wanting. She also signalled the high levels of comorbidities with gender dysphoria. A high proportion of girls who did not want to be girls were autistic. Many had troubled childhoods or had been in care. Many were gay. All of this resulted in the unravelling of Gids and a ban on puberty blockers.

In the full report, due to be published this week, Cass is not only concerned with medical intervention but is also expected to come out against “social transition”. This is not something that happens within the health service, but it is, she says, an “active intervention because it may have significant effects on the child or young person in terms of psychological functioning. There are different views on the benefits versus the harms of early social transition… it is not a neutral act and better information is needed about outcomes.”

Some believe that socially transitioning kids locks them into an identity and medical pathway that is detrimental. Cass says that gender expression is indeed fluid and changeable for adolescents and that many may take till their mid-20s to settle. In other words, leave these kids alone.”

Maybe, just maybe, we are turning a corner regarding this topic. I hope so.

valdavi Thu 18-Apr-24 21:59:41

Mental Health assessments for children , and inpatient treatment of children with mental health disorders, are very time-consuming & expensive in staff resources compared to purely physical medicine (if there is such a thing).I think this is a factor, as well as the lack of funding, in services just not being able to cope with the increase in demand for those services. & it certainly makes it hard to see how there's going to be a quick fix for CAMHS services.

Wyllow3 Thu 18-Apr-24 23:27:42

Doodledog

I'm not disagreeing that the job is not done, but as Iam says, all children (and adults, for that matter) with MH problems need to get help - I can't see why the closing of the Tavistock means that this particular issue should be prioritised when children with all sorts of problems are waiting. I'm not saying it should be ignored or pushed to the back, either, for avoidance of doubt.

I think that if the advice for adults in positions of influence to stop affirming gender change is followed, and puberty blockers are not allowed, there will be fewer problems. Obviously I can't be sure about this, as even experts disagree, but it seems to me that there must be an element of mass hysteria behind this, as the numbers of children saying they are 'in the wrong body' have grown so exponentially.

Hi - just on your second paragraph and "fewer problems". I spoke to an NHS psychologist yesterday on the issues.

She said that for a large number of young people its - in their perception - "made it worse".

Enough saw blockers as "solving" a problem and its not open to them now and neither is counselling available. So as in no where left to turn.

Doodledog Thu 18-Apr-24 23:33:30

Is that the young people who have a perception that it's been made worse, or the psychologists?

If the former, then I'm not surprised. Anyone having something taken away will feel deprived, whether it's for the worse or the better. The point though, is that young people aren't in the best position to diagnose or prescribe about their own MH problems. That decision has to be objective.

Wyllow3 Thu 18-Apr-24 23:35:48

I was referring to young people - the psychologist was concerned with meeting needs.

Mollygo Thu 18-Apr-24 23:37:26

The viewpoint you get will depend on which NHS psychologist you talk to about this. They, like others have their own perceptions of what constitutes a mental health problem.

Doodledog Sat 20-Apr-24 12:01:18

But if it's a MH issue, doesn't that mean that being 'born in the wrong body' makes no sense? I don't think the 'wrong body' idea makes sense anyway for social and biological reasons, but if gender confusion is a mental illness then it suggests that there is no biological basis.

Iam64 Sat 20-Apr-24 12:57:19

Dr Cass interviewed in The Times today says she no longer feels safe using public transport. Since the publication of her report she’s been threatened and harassed

Iam64 Sat 20-Apr-24 13:01:52

Doodledog

But if it's a MH issue, doesn't that mean that being 'born in the wrong body' makes no sense? I don't think the 'wrong body' idea makes sense anyway for social and biological reasons, but if gender confusion is a mental illness then it suggests that there is no biological basis.

There is an exponential increase in the number of children of celebrity parents announcing themselves as trans. Ben Affleck’s female born child introduced herself as Finn when speaking at their grandfather’s funeral

Galaxy Sat 20-Apr-24 13:55:30

Yes I thought hilary cass would be targeted, it was fairly predictable.

Glorianny Sat 20-Apr-24 14:06:52

As regards the "mass hysteria" would you attribute the increase in the number of people identifying as homosexual to the same cause?
An estimated 3.1% of the UK population aged 16 years and over identified as lesbian, gay or bisexual (LGB) in 2020, an increase from 2.7% in 2019 and almost double the percentage from 2014 (1.6%)

The threats to Doctor Cass are deplorable.

Doodledog Sat 20-Apr-24 14:43:02

As regards the "mass hysteria" would you attribute the increase in the number of people identifying as homosexual to the same cause?
No.

Galaxy Sat 20-Apr-24 14:43:59

It was I think an 1000 % increase in girls identifying as boys and there wasnt the same increase in the boys. Men have always been the ones who dominated the gender dysphoria figures then it altered. That's curious and anyone with any kind of academic curiosity should have asked questions.
We should have asked questions about autism in relation to boys/girls differences but we didnt and it was a mistake.

Glorianny Sat 20-Apr-24 14:54:35

Doodledog

*As regards the "mass hysteria" would you attribute the increase in the number of people identifying as homosexual to the same cause?*
No.

But trans identity has only recently become accepted and public.
Homosexuality has been legal for almost 50 years.
Why should numbers suddenly double?
Why do you attribute trans increases to mass hysteria but not homosexuality increases?

Doodledog Sat 20-Apr-24 15:33:22

I don't see them as parallel at all. one is about sexuality and the other about so-called 'gender'. I object to them being yoked together, and so do many in the LGB community.

Glorianny Sat 20-Apr-24 19:00:05

I'm by no means "roping them together" I'm simply asking why the increase in transpeople is regarded as "mass hysteria" whereas the increase in homosexuality is not.
It's quite judgemental to claim mass hysteria, although I suppose it is equivalent to the idea once very common that dominant mothers made boys homosexual.

Mollygo Sat 20-Apr-24 20:18:03

Mass hysteria is sometimes referred to as jumping on the bandwagon.
We typically refer to people or others “jumping on the bandwagon” to mean that they've joined a trend that has recently become popular. (Of course popularity doesn't make something good).

Iam64 Sat 20-Apr-24 20:32:13

I may be wrong of course as we lack research but - it’s easy to conclude the rise in trans children amongst the children of Hollywood royalty isn’t in some way linked to trends

Doodledog Sat 20-Apr-24 22:00:55

Glorianny

I'm by no means "roping them together" I'm simply asking why the increase in transpeople is regarded as "mass hysteria" whereas the increase in homosexuality is not.
It's quite judgemental to claim mass hysteria, although I suppose it is equivalent to the idea once very common that dominant mothers made boys homosexual.

It really is not equivalent grin. I know that TRAs would like it to be - after all, Stonewall hitched the trans cause to the LGB wagon, but there are huge differences between sex, sexuality and gender.

Urmstongran Tue 23-Apr-24 20:36:54

Nooo!

In The Telegraph:

“ A controversial LGBT charity which is influential in hundreds of Scottish schools has described puberty blockers as “wonderful” and believes children should have “autonomy” to decide whether to take them.

LGBT Youth Scotland, which runs a controversial education charter scheme followed by a majority of Scottish secondary schools and dozens of primaries, is under fresh scrutiny after it denounced the findings of the Cass Review.”

😱

Urmstongran Tue 23-Apr-24 20:40:00

Fools. These are virtue signalling zealots who should not be allowed anywhere near children. They have no qualifications whatsoever. If one more talks of learned experience, I shall scream. They’re talking about children!

The Scottish Government have today confirmed that £9 million will be paid on this nonsense over the next 5 years.

These weirdos should be in prison. If it's an offence to tattoo an under 18yo how can it be legal to chemically mutilate them?

Callistemon21 Tue 23-Apr-24 20:41:15

Urmstongran

Nooo!

In The Telegraph:

“ A controversial LGBT charity which is influential in hundreds of Scottish schools has described puberty blockers as “wonderful” and believes children should have “autonomy” to decide whether to take them.

LGBT Youth Scotland, which runs a controversial education charter scheme followed by a majority of Scottish secondary schools and dozens of primaries, is under fresh scrutiny after it denounced the findings of the Cass Review.”

😱

It's Scotland, innit! Different government, different ideas.

I'll await the brickbats and rants.

Rosie51 Fri 26-Apr-24 11:42:34

www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2024/apr/26/cass-review-gender-identity-services-report?CMP=Share_iOSApp_Other

An article by David Bell with his opinion of The Cass review.

Grantanow Fri 26-Apr-24 11:55:21

Too much ideology and weaponizing.

Namsnanny Fri 26-Apr-24 15:17:13

Callistemon21

Urmstongran

Nooo!

In The Telegraph:

“ A controversial LGBT charity which is influential in hundreds of Scottish schools has described puberty blockers as “wonderful” and believes children should have “autonomy” to decide whether to take them.

LGBT Youth Scotland, which runs a controversial education charter scheme followed by a majority of Scottish secondary schools and dozens of primaries, is under fresh scrutiny after it denounced the findings of the Cass Review.”

😱

It's Scotland, innit! Different government, different ideas.

I'll await the brickbats and rants.

Will the legislation actually go through now that Hamza Useless is likely to go?

Callistemon21 Fri 26-Apr-24 15:32:44

Even more brickbats approaching from astern 😯