The majority of Israeli Jews do not want to occupy Gaza.

Of course most Israelis don’t want to take over or live in Gaza, they want to live peacefully in Israel.
It’s not surprising tho, that they want Gaza to be handed over to an International Force rather than the Palestinian Authority.

“Most Israeli Jews want Gaza to be handed over to an International force,”

No surprises there, make controlling Gaza someone else’s responsibility, get rid of the problem.

Egypt could take responsibility for security in Gaza but they won’t because they believe that the whole of Israel is Arab land. We have seen since October they want nothing to do with Gaza other than allowing aid in, its a red line for them and however much pressure the US puts on them it’s not going to change.

It’s going to be much more likely that pressure can be put on Israel to stop the expansion into Palestinian land, only the US can do this, if they want security guarantees they have to change their policies.

For Gaza the way forward is remove Hamas and elect a moderate government with security supervised by Israel to ensure terrorists don’t take over again

They voted for Hamas

Yes, they did, but in 2006. At that time Hamas had a civil wing as well as a military one. Just saying - lots changed since then.

Given the situation in Gaza I dont think the Palestinians will ever accept "Security" by Israel - hence international suggestions. Not just because of recent events but because of settlement issues.

foxie does the article mention the settlement of Israeli citizens in Gaza?

An international force?

This has been suggested by the Palestinians and the USA for a few reasons.

Firstly it will sideline terrorist groups.

Secondly it will help to bring the Palestinians together under one umbrella.

Thirdly it will have international support.

I don’t think the Netanyahu government supports it, as it is not in the far right interest, who are keen to expand Israel into Palestinian territory, but when the war ends(🙄) and presumably Netanyahu goes we must hope for a more sensible government who will accept the possibility of peace in the area with a two state solution. There will be pressure from the Israeli population except the illegal settlers.

At the moment, neither Hamas nor the current Israeli regime accept a 2 state solution.

We can't begin to get there until Palestine is accepted internationally and fully as a State, which Israel was in 1948.

Internationally a 2 state solution is seen as the only viable one for peace.

I just posted this other thread as it - as far as I can see - the first historical narrative of "how things came to be as they are now"
www.history.com/topics/middle-east/palestine

sorry not the first historical narrative - predictive text - but the "fairest"

Egypt's Sadat knew what he was doing when he handed Gaza to Israel in 1979. He knew that the land would be the cause of trouble. Since then, Egypt has had peace with Israel.

These days, Egypt most certainly doesn't want to have anything to do with Gaza (apart from letting aid through) because it has enough internal problems with Muslim Brotherhood, who are allies of Hamas. Moreover, Egypt has almost half a million Sudanese refugees and doesn't want any more.

Hmm! I wonder who would be in this international force? Russia? China? Iran? How would it be financed? There aren't many countries who would be prepared to cough up the billions which it's going to take to rebuild Gaza. I guess some of the Gulf states might have the money, but I can't see Israel accepting them.

growstuff

Hmm! I wonder who would be in this international force? Russia? China? Iran? How would it be financed? There aren't many countries who would be prepared to cough up the billions which it's going to take to rebuild Gaza. I guess some of the Gulf states might have the money, but I can't see Israel accepting them.

I did read how it would be composed - I must try to dig it up.

Wyllow3 There are settlers on the West Bank who want Israel to takeover Gaza (and the West Bank for that matter), get rid of the Palestinians completely and subsume both into an expanded Israel, fortunately they are very much in the minority. When the war ends Gaza is going to need strong leadership in order to rebuild, again fortunately it seems the majority of Israelis don't want Israel to do that job. Hamas, won't be completely destroyed, that's an impossible task, but perhaps with an International force in place they can be kept in check and Gaza can be rebuilt. Israel's greatest threat is Hezbollah, which is much better armed and supported than Hamas but with it's base in Lebanon it's going to be difficult for Israel to deal with them and not start a much larger war. This is a real problem for them so the sensible move should be to be able to focus their defence there rather than get bogged down in Gaza. However, who knows which way Netanyahu will go, he's trying to stay in power by supporting some very unpleasant (Ben Givr and Smotrich) people who want to expand Israel. It's of note that the US has recently sanctioned the Netzah Yehuda battalion (the only one the Haredi will serve in) because of it's unacceptable behaviour.

The USA is walking a complicated tightrope. It has funded

(quote wiki)

"Since Israel's founding in 1948, it has received $158 billion in military aid from the United States, making it the greatest recipient in history."

Presumably as the major ally in the region.
However as you mention, its trying to set boundaries about what it's used for. Demonstrations around this have been a great deal more fierce in the USA than the UK and the USA has you mention has tried to set some military boundaries.

A great number of countries have been involved in humanitarian aid to Gaza for some time including the UK and the USA.
But its seems to me its all about containment rather than solutions?

I suppose if Israel had received no support it wouldn’t exist so it isn’t that straightforward. Historically, the Jewish people lived in that area since biblical times, as in the Bible. It hasn’t always belonged to Palestinians anymore than anyone else. The Egyptians used to be overlords of the Israelites at one stage . And Romans.

In 1948 there were Jews, Arabs, and Christians living in the area under the British Protectorate rule.

I did support the setting up of a haven for Jewish people after WW2 and appropriate support for that - after the 1967 occupations into non Israeli territory many more ?? marks

nanna8

I suppose if Israel had received no support it wouldn’t exist so it isn’t that straightforward. Historically, the Jewish people lived in that area since biblical times, as in the Bible. It hasn’t always belonged to Palestinians anymore than anyone else. The Egyptians used to be overlords of the Israelites at one stage . And Romans.

Slight correction. The area was inhabited by Jewish people in biblical times, but not since. As you have written, it's belonged to all sorts of people over the centuries.

The ideas of Hamas cannot be extinguished but the can be controlled, there are terrorist groups across the globe that would cause trouble if they could.

Who will provide security for Gaza, forget the US they would be continual hostility Arab Terrorists hate the US almost as much as Israel. The UN have never been effective against terrorists and I dont see Israel trusting any Pan Arab force.

So we come back to Israel having to do it themselves, once the war is won Netanyahu will go, then it’s up to Israel to elect a moderate government. Just like Europe after WW2 the 2 sides will have to learn to get on with each other or we will just be back to square one in 20 yrs time

Oreo

Of course most Israelis don’t want to take over or live in Gaza, they want to live peacefully in Israel.
It’s not surprising tho, that they want Gaza to be handed over to an International Force rather than the Palestinian Authority.

This.

maddyone

Oreo

Of course most Israelis don’t want to take over or live in Gaza, they want to live peacefully in Israel.
It’s not surprising tho, that they want Gaza to be handed over to an International Force rather than the Palestinian Authority.

This.

The majority do but unfortunately that is not true of them all or there would not have been a very significant number of illegal settlements in the West Bank or groups planning settlements in Gaza. I'm sure you are aware of this, it has been widely reported.

The illegal settlements and land occupation begun in 1967, and grown.

Will Israel pledge under international rule to stop the settlements?

Other wise talking about peace and resolution in the region is pointless. If the current regime think that the international community is there just to keep order and feed refugees/build homes whilst Palestinians have no powers to decide their own destiny then is this going to work?

The war is about to be taken to Rafah, imminently - plans afoot as in

www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-middle-east-68888299

(Rafah is the very southernmost city right on the border with Egypt)

The majority of Jews do not want to occur Gaza just as we are told the majority of Palestinians are not Hamas supporters.

Sorry, occupy, meaning live there

Katie59

The ideas of Hamas cannot be extinguished but the can be controlled, there are terrorist groups across the globe that would cause trouble if they could.

Who will provide security for Gaza, forget the US they would be continual hostility Arab Terrorists hate the US almost as much as Israel. The UN have never been effective against terrorists and I dont see Israel trusting any Pan Arab force.

So we come back to Israel having to do it themselves, once the war is won Netanyahu will go, then it’s up to Israel to elect a moderate government. Just like Europe after WW2 the 2 sides will have to learn to get on with each other or we will just be back to square one in 20 yrs time

The two "sides" in Europe after WW2 had a shared cultural background, The two sides in the Middle East never did get on with it - in fact, the creation of the state of Israel on former Palestinian land made things worse.

My father flew RAF transport planes into Palestine (when the UK still had the mandate) until 1947, when the state of Israel was declared by the Israelis when no agreement could be reached. He saw what was going on and reckoned it was more dangerous than a bombing raid over Germany (which is saying something). A cousin of his was murdered by Zionist terrorists. The situation has been controlled (usually) by American money, but I really can't see a solution.

No international force is going to pour billions into Gaza and the West Bank without something in return, which could be political power and a say what happens in the region. Israel distrusts the UN, so any grouping would have to be politically and ideologically neutral and be respected. I really can't think of any countries which would be acceptable to Israel and Palestine. The US and Europe haven't exactly covered themselves in glory by treating the Middle East as an oil field with populations who don't matter.

foxie48

maddyone

Oreo

Of course most Israelis don’t want to take over or live in Gaza, they want to live peacefully in Israel.
It’s not surprising tho, that they want Gaza to be handed over to an International Force rather than the Palestinian Authority.

This.

The majority do but unfortunately that is not true of them all or there would not have been a very significant number of illegal settlements in the West Bank or groups planning settlements in Gaza. I'm sure you are aware of this, it has been widely reported.

That’s why I used the word most
I’m as aware as anyone else what has been reported but a few blowhards dreaming of a luxury apartment by the sea in Gaza fortunately don’t get to set their agenda.

“No international force is going to pour billions into Gaza and the West Bank without something in return, which could be political power and a say what happens in the region. Israel distrusts the UN, so any grouping would have to be politically and ideologically neutral and be respected. I really can't think of any countries which would be acceptable to Israel and Palestine. The US and Europe haven't exactly coveredthemselves in glory by treating the Middle East as an oil field with populations who don't matter.”

The one, possibly the only country willing to spend money is the US, not for tangible gain but to keep the peace, that’s pretty much what they are doing now. As you say I really dont see any foreign country wanting to get involved in policing Gaza or indeed the West Bank, the moderates on both sides have got to work together for peace.