Anybody else who doesn't know who to vote for?

Labour will open the flood gates they have no immigration policy Yvette Cooper is useless she says she will do this and that but it's all been said and tried before at least Sunak is trying to Stop the Boats with the Rwanda plan which is working because migrants/illegals are going to Ireland because of the threat of being sent there (it's a deterrent). Labour have voted 100 times against plans to stop/curb immigration, The House of Lords mainly Labour and Lib Dem peers trying to stop this legislation at every turn. Now we have the so called human rights lawyers trying to stop every deportation and Starmer saying they will cancel the Rwanda plan, how stupid would that be if it's shown to be working perhaps once a human rights lawyer always a human rights lawyer, leopards don't change their spots do they.

I see a lot of posters here stating they don’t wish to vote Conservative, for a variety of reasons, but that they “don’t trust Keir Starmer”.

My question is why?

Also, of course he’s unproven, he’s only ever been in opposition, of course he wants to be in power, as does any party leader. I don’t buy that he u-turns any more than any other leader and we are not voting for Starmer, or any other party leader, we are voting to put a party into power whose policies/beliefs/ethos most closely align with our own.

Every political party is about so much more than their leaders, who are, as we all know only too well from the last 14 years, very easily replaced.

AGAA4

I am left with the choice of which of the parties will do the least harm.

You and many others I suspect, myself included.

Well besides not trusting Starmer I don't trust Angela Rayner she's not fit in my opinion to hold the position of Deputy Leader and she is being interviewed under caution by the police.

So many people saying they "don't trust Labour". Can you explain why? What did you trust the Tories to do that they have delivered on? What would you trust the Tories to do in future that will benefit the average voter ?

Nicenanny3

Well besides not trusting Starmer I don't trust Angela Rayner she's not fit in my opinion to hold the position of Deputy Leader and she is being interviewed under caution by the police.

As have many Tory MPs including the ex PM.

It’s the “why” I’m interested in?

Re flood gates and immigration.

In 2010 annual net migration - approx. 252000. This composed many EU workers filling care, hospitality, NHS, pickers and building posts.

After the Tories took over they promised to reduce immigration to the 10s of thousands.

Result? Immigration has risen existentially ever since.

Ironically it rose enormously after we took back control of our borders post Brexit!

It now stands at 672000, which of course does not include EU migrant workers.

So there is zero evidence that the Tories will take control of immigration - in fact evidence shows that the reverse is true.

Nicenanny3

Labour will open the flood gates they have no immigration policy Yvette Cooper is useless she says she will do this and that but it's all been said and tried before at least Sunak is trying to Stop the Boats with the Rwanda plan which is working because migrants/illegals are going to Ireland because of the threat of being sent there (it's a deterrent). Labour have voted 100 times against plans to stop/curb immigration, The House of Lords mainly Labour and Lib Dem peers trying to stop this legislation at every turn. Now we have the so called human rights lawyers trying to stop every deportation and Starmer saying they will cancel the Rwanda plan, how stupid would that be if it's shown to be working perhaps once a human rights lawyer always a human rights lawyer, leopards don't change their spots do they.

This part of Labours most recent policy re immigration.

“ Labour's immigration policy will reduce the reliance on overseas workers, address home-grown skills shortages and ensure that hard work is rewarded with proper wages and conditions. Labour supports a points-based immigration system that works for workers and businesses.10 May 2024”

Does that really seem like “opening the floodgates”

Not existentially 😡. Exponentially

I want to vote Tory because Labour will get us into a greater mess than we are now. The tax hikes are going to be crippling under labour. I trust them less than the status quo.

btw, of course the LP have an immigration policy! Unproven of course and will it work? That’s only something that can be answered if, and when, they get the opportunity to implement it.

To simply suggest there is no policy, or it, or they cannot be “trusted” is just a wild, unproven statement. At least explain the “why” behind your comments and provide some kind of evidence.

GSM has very strong views about the LP immigration policy and she’s explained “why” and given some (loose) evidence about how she’s reached this conclusion. I don’t necessarily agree with her, but at least she’s providing reasons for her views.

Freshair

I want to vote Tory because Labour will get us into a greater mess than we are now. The tax hikes are going to be crippling under labour. I trust them less than the status quo.

Evidence?

09:49Cossy

You can't trust Labour or Starmer hence 'Better the Devil you Know'.

Nicenanny3

09:49Cossy

You can't trust Labour or Starmer hence 'Better the Devil you Know'.

Meaningless statement and you don’t appear to be able to explain “why” or evidence your reasons?

I see no real evidence of Rwanda "working". All that money and time spent. The cost of sending 1 person is huge.

And Sunak has dodged the issue further by saying no one will be sent to Rwanda until the election, which is totally disingenuous. Labour have voted not against curbing immigration but the Rwanda plan specifically.

Immigration proper is to recruit people who are suitable and skills we need - ie the points system.
The migrants who turn up - we need to process far more quickly.

But this isn't just an "our little island" problem. Its European wide and we aren't working hard enough with European partners to tackle people smuggling.

LovesBach

AGAA4

I am left with the choice of which of the parties will do the least harm.

You and many others I suspect, myself included.

This, in a nutshell.

For the first time I’m uncertain and need to do some proper reading of proposed policies. LD locally have plunged our council into considerable debt with unviable housing plans decimating the countryside, so they don’t even get a look in.

Wyllow3
You can’t say something isn’t working when it hasn’t happened yet.
Of course Sunak will link the Rwanda flights with the election as if Starmer becomes PM he will scrap it.
That’s why the election has been called so early.

Cossy

Nicenanny3

09:49Cossy

You can't trust Labour or Starmer hence 'Better the Devil you Know'.

Meaningless statement and you don’t appear to be able to explain “why” or evidence your reasons?

FGS we’re not in court!

09:49Cossy

It's not meaningless to me I don't trust Starmer or Labour to do what they say in their manifesto and it seems a lot of other posters feel the same hence their uncertainty on who to vote for.

Nicenanny3

I don’t trust the Tories. I don’t trust them because they’ve lied (Partygate), they screwed the mortgage rate/housing market (Truss), they allowed people to die needlessly during Covid (throwing care home residents out of hospital, failing to act quickly enough at the beginning to stop large events, “eat out to help out”, nurses and PPE), I don’t trust them with finance because they’ve spent ££££ in “wasted” schemes (track and trace, money given to the French, the entire Rwandan debacle), they’ve backtracked on climate change.

These are just a few of the many many examples of why I won’t be voting Tory ever again (yes many years ago I supported them and voted for them!)

It’s great we are a democracy, able to choose who we want to trust, who we vote for and the freedom to debate and express views/beliefs/ethos on sites like this.

I respect your right to your own opinions, I’m simply asking “why”?

Many people go with the better the devil you know feeling when it comes to politics.

Freshair

I want to vote Tory because Labour will get us into a greater mess than we are now. The tax hikes are going to be crippling under labour. I trust them less than the status quo.

What tax hikes?

The ones coming down the line to pay for public services probably.

Jaxjacky

For the first time I’m uncertain and need to do some proper reading of proposed policies. LD locally have plunged our council into considerable debt with unviable housing plans decimating the countryside, so they don’t even get a look in.

Many many councils across England, I believe almost 50%, run across all parties, have a deficit budget, much of this is due to central govts cuts and a massive increase in costs of social care. Yes, a few, as with Thurrock, are guilty of poor financial planning and ill-thought out investments.