Oops! Sir Keir drops a massive 45 points in the opinion polls.

Smileless2012

I'm not denying there's a problem Casdon but I would like a detailed account of the 22 billion black hole.

He can`t give that, he was asleep for most of his long relaxing time in opposition

karmalady not asleep all the time - planning his new avuncular look.

I honestly cannot believe that any man would allow another man to pay for his wifes clothing especially when that man is a multi millionaire himself but still taking money from another multi millionaire. It is very sleazy.

Why would Starmer and his wife who are millionaires in their own right with hundred's of thousands of pounds wage a year need someone else to pay for their clothing, it is very weird to me and shameful, has the man no pride.

I too would like that detailed account Smileless. You will never find out that it is this government's way. Say one thing, do the other. Yes he's created space in prisons, leaving families devastated. Murder is ok tap on the knuckles but stealing is not.No plan for those people let-out, no tags just free to roam, bet they don't even know where they are. Never mind he has made a bit of space, weve got this for five years. Hes jitted his family out on freebies, now when his wardrobe is full, he has stopped. You couldn't make it up.

Casdon

Smileless2012

I've no idea Doodledog just as I've no idea if the 22 billion black hole is true, or just for the gullible to absorb.

The national debt – the sum total of every deficit – rose by 4.3 percentage points during the year to August 2024, to 100% of GDP, meaning an overall debt pile equal in size to the annual value of everything produced in the economy. Of course there’s a problem.

There’s a problem all over Europe with debt since Covid, our black hole is also theirs.It’s stated that 9 billion of the 22 billion is money chosen to be paid to doctors and train drivers.
It was also a choice to remove WFA to pensioners, one that KS doesn’t seem to be losing any sleep over.

There isn’t Oreo, or at least, it’s nothing like the position in the UK.
‘Overview. At the end of the first quarter of 2024, the general government gross debt to GDP ratio in the euro area (EA20) stood at 88.7%, compared with 88.2% at the end of the fourth quarter of 2023. In the EU, the ratio also increased from 81.5% to 82.0%.22 Jul 2024
ec.europa.eu › eurostat › web

karmalady

LucyLocket55

He was voted in by a massive majority …. be careful what you wish for

Get real, 20% of the uk population is not a majority of voters

He will be out before long, to be replaced by another robot at the beck and call of the paymasters

Just what I was going to say karmalady.

Lisaangel10

karmalady

LucyLocket55

He was voted in by a massive majority …. be careful what you wish for

Get real, 20% of the uk population is not a majority of voters

He will be out before long, to be replaced by another robot at the beck and call of the paymasters

Just what I was going to say karmalady.

This is the most inane argument out there at the moment. It’s how the British democratic system works. You cannot blame any government for winning a majority of seats and governing on that basis - when did any government win more than 50% of votes?

Stats hey? How about a breakdown of individual countries and not mixing them all together in a eurozone?
It’s like saying the average price of a detached house in England is, say, £800,000 when that’s true but doesn’t take into account the fact that different regions have different prices.
If it’s true that the 9 billion payout is adding to the ‘black hole’ of 22 or rather is part of it then that makes a big difference.

MaizieD

Casdon

Why, what purpose would that serve? It’s a fact that we are deeper in debt than we have been since the early 1960s, what we need now is a robust plan to improve our position, not endless post-mortems.

The government isn't after reducing the 'debt'. It would be impossible to do that because they cannot unilaterally 'repay' everyone who has savings and investments with them. i.e government bond holders, premium bond holders and people with NSI savings accounts. The govt. can only 'repay' these people if they actually ask for their money to be returned to them. Which very few are going to do because their money is safer 'invested' in govt. bonds & savings vehicles than anywhere else as the govt will never default. It will always pay the agreed interest or the principle if repayment is requested. British governments have had 'debt' for centuries. It hasn't been a problem so long as the debt can be serviced. Which it can be as tge govt creates the money with which to service it.

What the govt. wants to do is to, quite unnecessarily, to reduce the 'deficit', which is the difference between incoming revenue and govt. spending. Unfortunately, taking money out of the economy by cutting spending will make our current situation much worse.

I don't write these posts for fun.

This is what the 'national debt' is and it is not a problem.

Oreo

Stats hey? How about a breakdown of individual countries and not mixing them all together in a eurozone?
It’s like saying the average price of a detached house in England is, say, £800,000 when that’s true but doesn’t take into account the fact that different regions have different prices.
If it’s true that the 9 billion payout is adding to the ‘black hole’ of 22 or rather is part of it then that makes a big difference.

Here’s the breakdown.
ec.europa.eu/eurostat/statistics-explained/index.php/Government_finance_statistics#:~:text=General%20government%20gross%20debt,-In%20the%20EU&text=At%20the%20end%20of%202023%2C%20the%20lowest%20ratios%20of%20government,and%20Lithuania%20(38.3%20%25).

LucyLocket55

He was voted in by a massive majority …. be careful what you wish for

Do you mean the 34% only of the overall vote . Starmers popularity has been falling ever since. Well deserved.

I agree with you on this MaizieD and I just can’t understand the present government’s mindset on reducing spending.

Some really sour comments on here this morning aren’t there.
The only gullible, if there are any, are those who think that a new government will be better than the previous one.

We vote them in, as someone put it, on a wave of euphoria.

The difference is how long it takes for the rot to set in. This time, not long at all.

Casdon - it depends on how the stats are manipulated; on who reports these things; when they are reported, etc.

It all differs, day by day. One minute Germany is in the worst economic hole ever, the next it is the UK, then France, then Spain, you name it - a country will appear as on the brink of collapse. Just depending on how, when and who does the reporting.

Namsnanny

He had a law passed especially to cope with his large unusual pension.

No one else has that privilege.

Hes quite a hypocrite

Thanks Casdon for the individual figures.I think this shows /highlights how much the UK spent on keeping jobs and households afloat during the Covid years, one of the really good things that the Tories did in my view. What now has to be done is for KS to stop the doom and gloom mongering attitude and for RR to open the national purse not close it, we need to spend, build and take people along with this by showing hope for a better future, as Labour did in the 1950’s.

Cabowich

Casdon - it depends on how the stats are manipulated; on who reports these things; when they are reported, etc.

It all differs, day by day. One minute Germany is in the worst economic hole ever, the next it is the UK, then France, then Spain, you name it - a country will appear as on the brink of collapse. Just depending on how, when and who does the reporting.

The measurement the EU zone does is consistent though.

LucyLocket55

He was voted in by a massive majority …. be careful what you wish for

1 in 5 voted Labour

Oreo

Thanks Casdon for the individual figures.I think this shows /highlights how much the UK spent on keeping jobs and households afloat during the Covid years, one of the really good things that the Tories did in my view. What now has to be done is for KS to stop the doom and gloom mongering attitude and for RR to open the national purse not close it, we need to spend, build and take people along with this by showing hope for a better future, as Labour did in the 1950’s.

The majority of EU countries did very similar to support their people in Covid though Oreo, so that’s not a defining difference. I don’t disagree that the doom and gloom needs to stop though, I think we need some positive plans to turn the corner on the economy and give some direction to the task ahead. I really hope there are measures to support the most vulnerable in society in the budget.

Yawn!

Yes, I think the Labour Party have made mistakes in the short time they’ve been in power.

I support the removal of WFA for some pensioners, just not the way it’s been implemented.

I’m disappointed about the acceptance of freebies, but (sadly) it’s in the rules.

I’m still waiting, patiently, it’s too early to make huge judgments.

LucyLocket55
He was voted in by a massive majority …. be careful what you wish for

1 in 5 of those who voted, voted Labour i.e. 20%

^Turnout at the 2024 general election was 59.7%, which was the lowest at a general election since 2001.
Turnout was 7.6 percentage points lower than in 2019.This represented the largest drop in turnout between elections since between 1997 and 2001.^

Seventeen of the 20 constituencies with the lowest turnout were seats held by Labour

I don't think he takes much notice. Look how populism ruined this country.
Just because someone isn't liked doesn't mean a thing- it is what they do that counts and he's a way to go yet.

Mollygo

LucyLocket55
He was voted in by a massive majority …. be careful what you wish for

1 in 5 of those who voted, voted Labour i.e. 20%

^Turnout at the 2024 general election was 59.7%, which was the lowest at a general election since 2001.
Turnout was 7.6 percentage points lower than in 2019.This represented the largest drop in turnout between elections since between 1997 and 2001.^

^Seventeen of the 20 constituencies with the lowest turnout were seats held by Labour^

We all know that means nothing in the UK democracy though Mollygo, don’t we? You can’t blame Labour for being in power when that’s how our democracy works. Governments virtually never govern with a majority of of over 50% do they?
commonslibrary.parliament.uk/research-briefings/cbp-7529/

Casdon it’s true we can’t blame Labour for being in power but we can and will blame them for any misbuse of that power.