Have the Conservatives signed their own death warrant?

Good post Doodledog. As things stand I have little idea how the candidates stand on social issues.

Good point Casdon - most people forget the early days of Blair.

Fleurpepper

Grantanow

The Tory talent pool has been whittled down - first by the Buffoon getting rid of some of the most intelligent Tory MPs and second by the electorate voting many out. So they are left with a very limited talent pool.

Exactly this. I have never voted Cons, but we are from a very Conservative voting family and have many excellent friends who are too. There was some amazing talent in the Cons Party- but all gone now, kicked out or left. People I did not agree with but with intelligence and integrity, and I could respect. Top of the list Dominic Grieve, Rory Stuart, but so many more.

Eek!
I was glad they were voted out. Lost their seats.
Good riddance - riding roughshod over a democratic vote (Brexit).
Glad Anna Soubry was ousted too.

ronib

The blog Turbulent Times today takes a very different approach. It suggests that Badenoch is biased in favour of Nigeria and basically how about a potential pm from a proper British family. I sort of gulped when reading this.

It is a big gulp.

I don't know if it will come into play.

Record numbers of voters are choosing other parties than the main two and there is huge disillusionment with the two main parties. The Tories were worn out, had no new ideas and had a succession of shortlived leaders, but I had no time for Labour. They've actually proven themselves to be worse.

The winners here will be the Lib Dem’s for the disenfranchised Tory voters I think, not Reform. The acid test will be the by elections.

ronib

The blog Turbulent Times today takes a very different approach. It suggests that Badenoch is biased in favour of Nigeria and basically how about a potential pm from a proper British family. I sort of gulped when reading this.

Aaah, Turbulent Times... Richard North, founder member of UKIP who fell out with Farage when he swanned up and took it over...

What he actually says is this:

In fact, I would prefer it public office in the UK was limited to those who were British citizens by birth, born to parents who were also British citizens by birth. As a nation, I take the view that we are entitled to a parliament and a government run by our own kind.

One can almost nod along with it until the last sentence... I think we know what he means by 'our own kind'

I'd point out that we do have a PM from a 'proper British family' as defined by North but North isn't too keen on him..

In fact, from my experience of North (whose earlier blog about Brexit I followed for a while back in 2016/17, I get the impression that he isn't too keen on anyone...😁

www.turbulenttimes.co.uk/news/front-page/politics-the-only-possible-candidate/

Casdon

The winners here will be the Lib Dem’s for the disenfranchised Tory voters I think, not Reform. The acid test will be the by elections.

This disenfranchised Conservative could never vote Lib Dem in a GE.

If /when our current MP (Conservative) stands down I doubt I will vote in another GE.

I will continue to vote in local and county elections though.

Cumbrianmale56

Record numbers of voters are choosing other parties than the main two and there is huge disillusionment with the two main parties. The Tories were worn out, had no new ideas and had a succession of shortlived leaders, but I had no time for Labour. They've actually proven themselves to be worse.

They've actually proven themselves to be worse.

If this was a measured judgement a year or two into the Labour administration with the country falling even further apart I might be inclined to agree with you.

As it is it's a tribute to the success (and hypocrisy) of the right wing media.

FriedGreenTomatoes2

Fleurpepper

Grantanow

The Tory talent pool has been whittled down - first by the Buffoon getting rid of some of the most intelligent Tory MPs and second by the electorate voting many out. So they are left with a very limited talent pool.

Exactly this. I have never voted Cons, but we are from a very Conservative voting family and have many excellent friends who are too. There was some amazing talent in the Cons Party- but all gone now, kicked out or left. People I did not agree with but with intelligence and integrity, and I could respect. Top of the list Dominic Grieve, Rory Stuart, but so many more.

Eek!
I was glad they were voted out. Lost their seats.
Good riddance - riding roughshod over a democratic vote (Brexit).
Glad Anna Soubry was ousted too.

Oh yes, Anna- very much on that list.

Surely by now, you must KNOW, without any doubt whatsoever, that this so-called 'democratic' vote was nothing of the sort, as agreed with the Electoral Commission.

Maizie You're right about Richard North. It's also why I wouldn't see Badenoch as a natural bedfellow with Reform. She's not the slightest bit concerned about so-called 'left behind voters' in the UK. I doubt she's even ventured far in the UK beyond Wimbledon and Westminster. She couldn't care less about equality, 'levelling up' or minority (including women's) issues. She comes from a middle-class, highly educated family and was educated at one of the best private schools in Nigeria. Her father was considered to be a political 'elder'. In Nigeria, politics isn't really based on class or wealth - it's mainly tribal/sectarian. It's also socially conservative and every man/woman for him/herself.

On the other hand, Reform has picked up (and exploits) the disillusionment of people in former industrial areas and those who haven't been served well by the current educational systems and industrial strategies of the UK. Badenoch would just see them as losers.

MaizieD

Cumbrianmale56

Record numbers of voters are choosing other parties than the main two and there is huge disillusionment with the two main parties. The Tories were worn out, had no new ideas and had a succession of shortlived leaders, but I had no time for Labour. They've actually proven themselves to be worse.

They've actually proven themselves to be worse.

If this was a measured judgement a year or two into the Labour administration with the country falling even further apart I might be inclined to agree with you.

As it is it's a tribute to the success (and hypocrisy) of the right wing media.

Quite.

On the other hand, Reform has picked up (and exploits) the disillusionment of people in former industrial areas and those who haven't been served well by the current educational systems and industrial strategies of the UK.

I don't think that Reform is any more 'concerned' about them than is Badenoch. I think you hit the nail on the head with 'exploits'.

Doodledog, your posts are funny in a nice way. Love the anecdote about the lunch with your friends! I suppose that is why I am conservative, because I do believe in a small state as opposed to state interference but then I have always been capable, and do realise many need protecting. We all have our beliefs in the best way forward. I wonder if maybe the NHS does need dismantling in some way. France seems to have much better healthcare, maybe with people paying in a reasonable amount in exchange for better healthcare perhaps.

Jenrick is yet another slippery politician so he will be right at home if he wins the Leadership race. He was very keen to rush through a friend's Westferry planning application a day before a change in the law would have resulted in his friend having to pay an eye-watering tax bill. E-mails and texts between the two showed they were dealing under the radar and hoping to distance themselves from each other in case questions were asked. Badenoch may be a loose cannon at times with what she says but I think, hope, she will be more honest than Jenrick, which should not be hard.

MaizieD and growstuff Ed Davey definitely fits ‘our own kind’ label. Starmer should but somehow doesn’t. Sunak well probably not but he’s past history. So bring it on Ed Davey 😀.

ronib

MaizieD and growstuff Ed Davey definitely fits ‘our own kind’ label. Starmer should but somehow doesn’t. Sunak well probably not but he’s past history. So bring it on Ed Davey 😀.

Goodness my, ronib. You're narrowing the 'our own kind' definition even further, you seem to be making it political as well as racist.😱 Of course Starmer fits the bill as defined by North.

MaizieD do you think so? I get the impression that no politician would ever please Richard North.
I am definitely warming towards the Lib Dems …. as the lesser evil.

The 'tune' of Alli is his own vested interests which are quite probably many, varied and less than obvious. There is corruption all around. I do not believe Labour are any better than the Conservatives despite all the virtue signalling.

Not at all GFT2. Grieve, Stuart and others did not 'lose their seats', they were barred from standing in them by their local constituency parties being forbidden to select them. (So much for democratic votes, since you mention it 😂)

Judging by the opprobrium generated in Labour supporters for the two Conservative leadership candidates, surely this implies the selection process was something of a success?

Casdon

The winners here will be the Lib Dem’s for the disenfranchised Tory voters I think, not Reform. The acid test will be the by elections.

The Lib Dems probably will take votes from Conservatives who are wotried about their party moving to the Right. Ed Davey comes across as very decent and doesn't have the sleaze attached to him like leaders of the two main parties. I liked Charles Kennedy, who sadly died young.
The other thing both main parties have to look out for is Reform. A weak Tory leader will gift Reform votes from Brexit voting Tories and also disenchantment with Labour from their working class voters could see more votes for Reform. Where I live, Reform took 20% of the vote.

Lilyflower

Judging by the opprobrium generated in Labour supporters for the two Conservative leadership candidates, surely this implies the selection process was something of a success?

How do you work that out?

growstuff

Lilyflower

Judging by the opprobrium generated in Labour supporters for the two Conservative leadership candidates, surely this implies the selection process was something of a success?

How do you work that out?

I think you could justifiably say that if there was support for one of the two chosen by all Tory Gransnetters, but that’s not the case?

There are very strong indications that tactical voting was involved - and went terribly wrong re Cleverly. Here is an article by the

includes
www.electoral-reform.org.uk/surprising-conservative-leadership-vote-shows-that-voting-systems-matter/

"Did tactical voting strike?

The Conservative leadership contest starts with a series of First Past the Post ballots of all Conservative MPs. And just like when we are forced to use it in the general election, first past the post means that it is sometimes in your interest to vote for someone who isn’t your first choice.

If you were an MP who wanted Cleverly to win in the final contest among the party members, and you think he had a lead large enough to be able to be able to lose a few votes and still get through, you might be tempted to vote for the candidate you think he stood the best chance against.

Or for the candidate who was your second choice to ensure your least favourite didn’t win.

We can’t know what happened, but if this is what has happened, they have massively shot themselves in the foot"

The result was so very close - it only took a few.