Banning legal & illegal migration for 5yrs

Actually if we are looking for accuracy and the British, only 7000 years ago we were simply Northern Europeans - not British, of whatever ancestry.

Then dogger-land(sp?) was flooded and those occupying this peninsular were cut off from the mainland.

But that isn’t the end of the story - there was freedom of movement back then 😄😄. (Clearly a very civilised and open minded society) and people drifted around the continent, bringing skills, fresh DNA and cultures with them.

My children’s DNA show only Celt and French DNA.

Looking at the migration issue.

IMO - none of it will be properly solved until countries come together to try to solve the issue through quotas etc.

It ain’t going to happen is it?

growstuff

Wyllow3

growstuff

foxie48

There's also a shortage of skilled trades people to build new houses.

I know, but why is that? Is it because we're not training enough (because the opportunities aren't there) or because people don't want to work in construction?

Often it's the training. The schemes for young people I posted above means increasing apprenticeships which cant be done overnight.

That's what my gut feeling tells me too. The solution is relatively long-term, but involves government intervention (probably in conjunction with major construction companies) to incentivise the provision of more training places. It will require investment, but is feasible.

This seems to be a really good idea -we need housing desperately, we haven't enough skilled workers, we have young people needing training, we have some migrants arriving either with skills or who could join the training.

It's been a growing problem for so long, and presumably it was believed by previous governments that 'market forces" would do the job, but it clearly wont. How do we finance these apprenticeships with so many demands soon the public purse?

Whitewavemark2

Actually if we are looking for accuracy and the British, only 7000 years ago we were simply Northern Europeans - not British, of whatever ancestry.

Then dogger-land(sp?) was flooded and those occupying this peninsular were cut off from the mainland.

But that isn’t the end of the story - there was freedom of movement back then 😄😄. (Clearly a very civilised and open minded society) and people drifted around the continent, bringing skills, fresh DNA and cultures with them.

My children’s DNA show only Celt and French DNA.

The point I was trying to make is that there will never be an end to the story - until the earth destroys itself. It's possible to take any point in time and claim the people who inhabit a particular place are 'indigenous'.

growstuff

Allira

growstuff

Allira

nanna8

How can you petition against unauthorised entry? Makes no sense. As for regular migration,there are a lot of jobs that the indigenous population ( i.e.white Anglo Saxons) don’t seem to want to do or are not qualified for.

The white Anglo-Saxons were immigrants.

The indigenous population are the Ancient Britons, who probably became the Welsh and Cornish.

Even the ancient Britons weren't the original inhabitants.

True, the Neanderthals were here first but they died out, only to live on in us.

Not just Neanderthals. Remains of humans have been found which have DNA from people who originated in the steppes. The Celts weren't the first humans to be indigenous in Britain. I don't understand why people seem to think that history will stop and the people who lived in Britain 100 years ago will be a baseline for ever more.

Well, I didn't say that at all, did I.

I just pointed out that Anglo-Saxons were not the original inhabitants of Britain.

I think we now have to be cautious using the word "indigenous" as it's now being politicised for questionable reasons.

(I mean in the UK)

Allira

growstuff

Allira

growstuff

Allira

nanna8

How can you petition against unauthorised entry? Makes no sense. As for regular migration,there are a lot of jobs that the indigenous population ( i.e.white Anglo Saxons) don’t seem to want to do or are not qualified for.

The white Anglo-Saxons were immigrants.

The indigenous population are the Ancient Britons, who probably became the Welsh and Cornish.

Even the ancient Britons weren't the original inhabitants.

True, the Neanderthals were here first but they died out, only to live on in us.

Not just Neanderthals. Remains of humans have been found which have DNA from people who originated in the steppes. The Celts weren't the first humans to be indigenous in Britain. I don't understand why people seem to think that history will stop and the people who lived in Britain 100 years ago will be a baseline for ever more.

Well, I didn't say that at all, did I.

I just pointed out that Anglo-Saxons were not the original inhabitants of Britain.

I know and I didn't dispute it. I'm sorry if you were offended. All I was doing was developing your point even further.

The idea that Anglo-Saxons are somehow indigenous and the original Brits is nonsense.

Using the word "indigenous" in the UK context is meaningless really as its now a contested word in for example Australia where there are a real identifiable First Peoples population.
Looks suspiciously like an attempt for an "us and them" definition of UK citizens.

There are no “indigenous” Britons.

Whitewavemark2

There are no “indigenous” Britons.

We're mostly mongrels.

Wyllow3

Using the word "indigenous" in the UK context is meaningless really as its now a contested word in for example Australia where there are a real identifiable First Peoples population.
Looks suspiciously like an attempt for an "us and them" definition of UK citizens.

in for example Australia where there are a real identifiable First Peoples population.

It's more complicated than that.
There are still disputes about who can qualify as having Aboriginal identity. You cannot look at someone and know by their appearance. Someone may have fair hair and blue eyes but still claim Aboriginal descent through an ancestor.

Torres Strait Islanders are also considered to be indigenous.

The word "indigenous" is used as a deference to the people who have settled in any one place for the longest length of time It doesn't necessarily make them the original indigenous. Many of the tribes in the Americas came across The Bering Straits over thousands of years and worked their way down the whole land mass, as opposed to the "recently" arrived Europeans,, but who knows who they fought with and what territorial skirmishes occurred with other groups of more established tribal communities millenniums ago.

The dinosaurs were here first.

Allira

The dinosaurs were here first.

😂😂😂

What about the amoeba?

First life on earth crawled out of the water allegedly! I reckon that's why so many retire to the seaside, some sort of primeval urge to crawl right back from whence we came.

If you think about it too deeply you start to wonder why we have borders, countries .....

TerriBull

First life on earth crawled out of the water allegedly! I reckon that's why so many retire to the seaside, some sort of primeval urge to crawl right back from whence we came.

😁
I do love the coast, miss it a lot.

My maternal grandparents retired to the Sussex coast. My mother often lamented their foolishness with "what a daft thing to do full of retirees" When my parents retired what did they do? Up sticks, leave my hometown in Surrey and move down to the Sussex coast. The primeval pull was clearly too great, they just couldn't fight it

I know there's nothing I like better than sitting facing the sea trying to invoke those memories of my previous amphibious life.

How much do I love the sea.
This was my home for 15 years and another for 5 years before that.

Yes, further to comments above, everyone in Europe emigrated from Africa.
13,000 years ago, what is now Britain was under ice. Ancestors of everyone now living in Britain migrated here in the millenia after the ice melted. Some came from the now submerged Doggerland. Has anyone seen the depressing forecast of what will remain of Britain in 2100? We will be on the move again.

foxie48

"The UK has been struggling with a construction skills shortage for some years now. In 2021, it was estimated that 75% of all UK contractors were having problems recruiting skilled workers. The latest CITB figures suggest that the UK needs an extra 251,500 construction workers by 2028 to meet expected levels of work."

I’m not sure why we have such a shortage, there’s no end of gov backed schemes in partnership with the bag construction companies and a further separate scheme for women in construction. All schemes have different pathways, ie brick laying, scaffolders, etc etc

growstuff

Witzend

Monica, I dare say plenty of school leavers who’d be perfectly capable of being trained as doctors, can’t find university places because numbers are restricted, and have been so for a long time. And that’s largely because successive governments have chosen to rely on poaching doctors from countries that have funded their own people’s training.

Witzend I doubt very much whether school leavers who have the potential to be doctors become NEETs. School leavers who narrowly miss out on the qualifications to train to do medicine usually opt to train in another skilled medical field. They don't miss out on medical school and say "That's it. I can't be a doctor, so I'll sit around and do nothing all day".

I wasn’t in any way implying that they’d be either NEETS or idle. Just saying that we could almost certainly train more doctors of our own - and stop needing to poach them from other countries (often poorer ones) if the funding for more medical school places was available.

Wonder why there isn't a big take up. Is it big firms only with limited locations?

Allira

If you think about it too deeply you start to wonder why we have borders, countries .....

It is exactly this though isn’t it?
Why should anyone be forced to stay in a place of war or dysfunction ? Just stay where you are die, starve…