UK mercenaries serving abroad - should be illegal.

The UK recruits overseas personnel to serve in our forces are they to be illegal too when they take part in overseas operations.

The Mercenary soldier has been around as long as the oldest profession (prostitution). The Swiss Guard, who guard the Pope are mercenaries, only symbolic now, but not in the past.

British Mercenaries are fighting in Ukraine, fought on both sides in the Spanish Civil War, the (Irish) Wild Geese who fought for France and other European countries in the 16th to 18th century.

You will never stop motivated people of any nationality going to fight other people's wars for money or principle. I think the current actions of the IDF are aborrent, but stopping people fighting for them but not, for example, any fighting for Iran, or Syria, or the Palestinians would be blatant anti-semitism.

I would suspect they may be dual citizens and hold Israeli passports so presumably it wouldn’t be illegal.

SueDonim

I would suspect they may be dual citizens and hold Israeli passports so presumably it wouldn’t be illegal.

This

In addition, we have men fighting alongside the Ukrainian forces

I suggest the OP checks out what the Geneva Convention has to say about mercenaries before declaring anything about legality or otherwise.

SueDonim

I would suspect they may be dual citizens and hold Israeli passports so presumably it wouldn’t be illegal.

Some have, but many do not. They may or may not be Jewish.

British people fought in the Spanish Civil War. I suppose they must have been paid something in order to exist but their involvement was was primarily because they wanted to fight against an unelected right wing dictatorship.

It is probably true that those people signing up for the IDF are likely to be of dual British/Israeli nationality and, however unfathomable that may seem to me and others, given the appalling situation in Gaza, they may see themselves as saviours of Israel.

Iam64

SueDonim

I would suspect they may be dual citizens and hold Israeli passports so presumably it wouldn’t be illegal.

This

In addition, we have men fighting alongside the Ukrainian forces

Totally different. They are British soldiers working for the British Army, not mercenaries.

Claremont

Iam64

SueDonim

I would suspect they may be dual citizens and hold Israeli passports so presumably it wouldn’t be illegal.

This

In addition, we have men fighting alongside the Ukrainian forces

Totally different. They are British soldiers working for the British Army, not mercenaries.

Not all of them, there are definitely British mercenaries fighting in the `Ukraine forces, some have lost their lives, others have been seriously injured.

Thanks, I was not aware of that.

The UK Foreign Office confirmed that at least 80 British nationals were serving in the Israeli military. Europe 1, a prominent radio broadcaster in France, reported that 4,185 individuals of French or Franco-Israeli nationality were engaged in combat alongside the IDF in Gaza. Similarly, an estimated 23,380 US citizens are believed to be serving in the Israeli armed forces, according to the Washington Post. The South African Foreign Ministry has also expressed grave concern over reports that South African citizens serving in the Israeli military have joined the conflict in Gaza.

However, many countries do not criminalise the act of joining the military forces of another nation based on dual nationality. Lord Ahmad of Wimbledon, UK minister of state, has said: “The UK recognises the right of British nationals with dual nationality to serve in the legitimately recognised armed forces of their additional nationality.” Similarly, French Foreign Ministry spokesperson Christophe Lemoine said that dual citizenship implies dual loyalty, and as a result, France does not investigate the military activities of French-Israeli citizens in relation to their obligations in Israel. The US State Department has also confirmed that American citizens are not prohibited from serving in the military of a foreign nation.

However, while dual nationals may be permitted to serve in the armed forces of their other nationality, they are not immune from prosecution if they engage in crimes against humanity or commit war crimes. The International Centre for Justice in Palestine (ICJP) warns that British nationals, including dual Israeli-British nationals, are “at risk of participating in war crimes, crimes against humanity and acts of genocide.” Likewise, in France, lawmakers have called for the prosecution of French-Israeli citizens found to be involved in war crimes, including those participating in military operations in the Gaza Strip.

To make bi-national Israeli soldiers accountable for their war crimes, the Hind Rajab Foundation has initiated legal action against them invoking the active nationality principle. In an interview, Dyab Abou Jahjah, spokesperson for the foundation, explained their approach: “We are targeting Israeli soldiers who hold dual nationalities, specifically those who are also citizens of European countries. If you are a citizen of countries like the Netherlands or Belgium and are committing war crimes abroad, as is the case with these soldiers in Gaza, you are accountable to the legal system of your home country.''

If that is allowed then, why should British citizens not fight along Palestinians or Afghans. Yet if they do, they are called terrorists? Seems hugely hypocritical, especially in this case.

Above from here

www.middleeastmonitor.com/20241021-prosecution-of-dual-national-israeli-soldiers/

What about British mercenaries fighting with the Russian Army?

Claremont

Iam64

SueDonim

I would suspect they may be dual citizens and hold Israeli passports so presumably it wouldn’t be illegal.

This

In addition, we have men fighting alongside the Ukrainian forces

Totally different. They are British soldiers working for the British Army, not mercenaries.

No British Forces are fighting in Ukraine.
British Forces might train Ukrainian soldiers but they are not themselves fighting.
They have also escorted diplomats but again are not fighting.

Some young people may have decided to go of their own accord.

Baggs

I suggest the OP checks out what the Geneva Convention has to say about mercenaries before declaring anything about legality or otherwise.

👏👏👏👏

petra

Baggs

I suggest the OP checks out what the Geneva Convention has to say about mercenaries before declaring anything about legality or otherwise.

👏👏👏👏

Hear hear.

Baggs

I suggest the OP checks out what the Geneva Convention has to say about mercenaries before declaring anything about legality or otherwise.

I have of course. Are you sure that all those British citizens who have chosen to serve in the IDF have Israel nationality and passports. Or are they only 'identifying' with Israel, and/or Judaism? Does anyone check this?

But, if it is accepted that dual citizens are automatically allowed to go and fight for their 'other' country, do you believe that should be for any country? Russia? Other African countries in major conflicts of even civil war? Why not Arab/Muslim countries then, including Palestine. Especially as in this case, with a genocide against them being perpetrated.

I need a word with myself about posting in haste, I was referring to British mercenaries in Ukraine, not British army personnel. I’ve read about British mercenaries being treated badly if captured by the Russians

Are you sure that all those British citizens who have chosen to serve in the IDF have Israel nationality and passports. Or are they only 'identifying' with Israel, and/or Judaism? Does anyone check this?

I'm not sure, but they are free citizens and can do as they please.

Who should check? And why?

Iam64

I need a word with myself about posting in haste, I was referring to British mercenaries in Ukraine, not British army personnel. I’ve read about British mercenaries being treated badly if captured by the Russians

And killed, fighting for a cause they believe in.

My friend worries about her SiL who drives across Europe and into Ukraine to deliver aid. Brave people.

Allira 👍🏻.

Iam64

Allira 👍🏻.

I'm the first to admit to posting in haste too, Iam64 and making mistakes!

Just thought I'd make it clear, though, if anyone was confused.

People serving in the British forces do not fight as mercenaries in other people's war.

Those British servicemen currently in Ukraine are not fightina d do not go near the frontline. They are well behind lines, in advising and training roles.

I think a few Australians have fought for the Ukrainians,too. I seem to remember one ( Oscar Jenkins) was captured and tortured by Russian soldiers. Possibly more widespread than we realise ? With a name like his you would think he might be of Welsh origins, not from Eastern Europe.

Baggs

I suggest the OP checks out what the Geneva Convention has to say about mercenaries before declaring anything about legality or otherwise.

Seems to answer the question - if there was a question rather than a statement.