This must be a sad day for England

Bottles thrown. Police officers injured. Disgraceful.

It is an interesting phenomenon and I’ve been thinking and reading about how this move towards populism has occurred.

I think really that the initial push was at the time of the financial crash in 2008 which affected both the USA and Europe in equal measure. Prior to that globalisation had been - and still is the driver of the world economy which has seen a structural change in the system based on the movement of goods, capital and labour.

However post 2008, what happened I think is that the crash undermined trust in ability of the establishment to run the economy. Faith in the “experts” like the bankers, economists and politicians was sorely tried - who was going to believe the experts now?

Prior to the crash however the west and the U.K. and USA in particular had a number of foreign policy set backs over Iraq and Libya which did huge damage to the Middle East and later we had Afghanistan.

But really I think that the real driver behind this move towards populism has to be the global economy. So whilst it brought huge growth and prosperity to the world in general, for some and the west in particular where capitalism is more “mature” what has happened - predicted by some economist was that wealth became highly concentrated, middle class living standards stagnated, and the working class found itself in competition with cheap labour arriving from overseas.

This crises was compounded by the establishment continuing to govern with neo-liberal policies - a broken system which brought the U.K. a decade and more of austerity, hitting the working class even more - thus skewing the balance even more away from the working class and towards capital. Is it any wonder there has been a backlash towards populism?

Assistant Commissioner Twist said officers had suffered broken teeth, concussion, a prolapsed disc, a head injury and a possible broken nose.
"The 25 arrests we have made so far is just the start," he added as the Met vowed to identify those involved in disorder.

Yes disgusting. We are lucky to have a police force that, on the whole, do a good job of protecting us. We could have one that reports to an extremist government, then who would be safe?

MayBee70

Can’t just blame this government. It worked with previous Conservative governments and the same tactic was used by Farage for Brexit. Unfortunately people have been brainwashed into thinking the solution to everything is a ‘protest vote’ even though they don’t actually know what the alternative might be.

I think this is an arrogant assumption. people are not brainwashed, if they are then among the brainwashed are all of us, we are not superior to all those on these demonstrations.

People are demonstrating because they are fed up with governments that ignore them and their concerns in pursuit of - well, what? Whatever it is - it isn't what people want.

Robinson and Farage have risen as leaders from the many ordinary people who are fed up with the current situation. If people were happy with the governance of this country as it is now, these people would not have come to promenance.

People may not be clear on what the alternative is, but what they do know is that they are very sure it is not what they are getting now.

Patronising and looking down on ordinary people and pretending that you (or I are somehow a cut above the rest and know so much better than them, is what got us into this mess in the first place. Continuing it only makes the situation worse.

26 police officers injured so now on sick leave taking them off the streets.

1500 people on the streets of London yesterday and incited to violence by Tommy Robinson and Elon Musk.
Britain at its worst.

26 police officers injured, 4 seriously, 25 arrests but police say this is just the start. A protest march organised by Tommy Robinson and his thugs was never going to be a friendly trouble free day out with the family. This country has it's problems but anyone who thinks that people like TR and his ilk will make a difference for the good is IMO naive. He spreads hate and division using immigration as his scapegoat of choice. His tactics are those of a fascist playbook and his presence frightens and sickens me.

Of course I guess if we want to live in a democracy, we have to accept it with all its vagaries.

The question for me is - does populism give us more or less democracy, as I am watching Trump and listening to various rhetoric which makes me feel very uneasy.

Politics has become the playground for people deprived of their bread and circuses- maybe we should bring back the circus maximus- now there's a tradition started by immigrants.

Peacefully demonstrating is one thing MOnica, it is still our right to do, but that was a disgrace yesterday. Dozens of Police officers attacked and harmed? Some family day out that was.

I can understand the populist movement when it claims to be anchored in the sovereign will of the people, but it is when it begins to identify minority groups in society as the “enemy” rather than the establishment which they argue caused the problem, I begin to have a real issue.

Whitewavemark2

I can understand the populist movement when it claims to be anchored in the sovereign will of the people, but it is when it begins to identify minority groups in society as the “enemy” rather than the establishment which they argue caused the problem, I begin to have a real issue.

Agree.
And of course this serves the government well, Tory and Labour, inasmuch as their glaring incompetencies are hiding behind a group of powerless people. Certainly nobody is talking about child poverty, a lack of public services, the cost of living crisis, looming heat poverty, homelessness etc., whilst we are talking about all this Yaxley Lennon hoohah.

So then we have to wonder whether populism does in fact represent the sovereign will of the people or just a group of people in society feeling disaffected and ignored, who go on to identify a minority as the enemy rather than the elite as was first argued.

Bizarrely the populists leaders like Trump and to a lesser extent Farage, would, in normal times be the epitome of the elite. So one really does have to question their real motives.

Gosh, Whitewave, has that ever happened before in history?
Oh yes, in the 1930's, in Germany, when an innocent group of people was picked on as scapegoats.

It is an enormous pity that this demonstration deteriorated into such a violent stramash. Typical of the sort of men just looking for a fight. However, the vast majority of those attending were there in good faith as they're unhappy at the way things are going here. Unfortunately those thugs have ruined the value of this mass expression of a lot of people's feelings.

Yes therein lies the danger, but I do not think that at present the governing bodies have the answer.

And if you ask the working class in the USA if things are changing for the better I think you will find a large minority will answer negatively.

Whitewavemark2

Bizarrely the populists leaders like Trump and to a lesser extent Farage, would, in normal times be the epitome of the elite. So one really does have to question their real motives.

I argued this earlier, both Farage and Trump represent the ruling elite, they are neither radicals or revolutionaries. And their first tactic is not to empower the masses but to attempt the influence the judiciary and get rid of human rights in order to make the masses powerless and do more easily manipulated by the ruling elite.
Sadly some see them as anti establishment and giving a voice to the ordinary person in the street, this, as we can see in the US, is far from true, with Trump undoubtedly ‘the establishment’ an ex business man chasing the dollar, already causing hardships for ordinary Americans and silencing the ordinary person in the street.

And isn't Stephen Yaxley Lennon the very one to be leading.
A Patriot to look up to. Financed by an American Billionaire, just like any other man of the people, spread pro-Putin propaganda after the invasion of Poland. Yep, just the sort who has British interests at heart.
Seriously though, read his Wikipedia entry, if you have half an hour to spare.

Apologies cannot type very easily on my phone.
🤨

growstuff
As your aware not all Muslim Marriages are conducted as your daughters was.
This solicitor claims ( from her own experience) that over 80% of British Muslims age under 30 have an unregistered Muslim marriage.
The consequences of this can be devastating.

www.ainakhanlaw.com/muslim-marriage-project-survey/

Tommy Robinson and Elon Musk want to destroy the UK and demonstrations like yesterday's help them.
I understand the unrest as people struggle every day to feed their families, get doctor's appointments and feel their lives are getting harder but this violence will not help at all.

FriedGreenTomatoes2

So many flags too - the Saltire 🏴󠁧󠁢󠁳󠁣󠁴󠁿 the welsh flag 🏴󠁧󠁢󠁷󠁬󠁳󠁿 the ROI trichlor. ….

exactly, it was lovely to see those flags

Our flags are a lovely expression of our identity, but was that the 'intent'? Welcome to our countries? Or go away, you don't belong?

So who do these people see as the ‘elite’? Anyone with their own home? With children in private schools? People with earnings or savings above average? Anyone with a degree?

They are coming for immigrants now, but who will be next?

I agree (and have been saying since Brexit) that sneering at people with different views is what leads to extremism. For years we have been pitted against one another. Young against old, race, rich against poor, religious differences, left against right- it goes on and on. Telling people they don’t understand their own views adds fuel to the fire.

I hope it’s not too late to stop what seems like an inexorable slide, but I doubt it.

Until the governing classes get to grips with the economy and ensure it works for everyone, we will inevitably roll along this road to populism, with all that it might bring.