Manchester Synagogue Attack

ronib

GB News is reporting that the assassin was on police bail for an alleged rape.

And what did they give as their source please?

the Guardian also reported it earlier today, but no source was given by them either, which I'm not al all happy with.

Wyllow3 it’s very unusual for any tv station to give its source? However the Daily Mail is running on this story plus details of debt problems and separation from wife and young baby. Also it seems that the trauma surgeon father had divorced the assassin’s mother leaving her to bring up 3 sons.

There is an up to date report on the BBC News site now. I thought this was interesting.
‘Additionally, the Syrian British Consortium, Rethink Rebuild Society and Syria Solidarity Campaign released a joint statement.
They said: "At this stage, no-one within our Syrian community networks - neither within or beyond Manchester - has been able to identify the individual involved in this attack or confirm knowing him personally."’

Each update, as usual, makes things worse.

Wyllow3

ronib

GB News is reporting that the assassin was on police bail for an alleged rape.

And what did they give as their source please?

The BBC reported this too.

ronib

Wyllow3 it’s very unusual for any tv station to give its source? However the Daily Mail is running on this story plus details of debt problems and separation from wife and young baby. Also it seems that the trauma surgeon father had divorced the assassin’s mother leaving her to bring up 3 sons.

Actually the BBC reported it first at 11.15am. Others followed.

However....the patterns of his early life, that trauma, had to have affected him.

Galaxy, its inevitable information would come out, but I dont understand why you say it makes it worse? (not a criticism, a genuine, why do you think that?

Because it always shows failures, always.

Galaxy

Because it always shows failures, always.

Do you you mean failures by systems or his failures?

BTW, In the UK all the news outlets are using the word "attacker".

I don't know how using the word "Assassin" entered this thread - but it's factually inaccurate.

Assassin" has a particular meaning
It's when a particular person is specifically targeted

This is not the case here, and its beginning to look like a group might be involved.

And this is not the case here

I suspect El Dorado is the only world in which there are no failures Galaxy. If potential killers could be profiled and prevented in advance it would be a wonderful thing, obviously though.

It sure isn’t the case that he wanted to kill a particular person, it was a case of any Jew will do and had he got into the synagogue he could have killed a few more people before he was overpowered by the men in there.
No that a single descriptive word matters much just now.

System failures. He was out on bail for rape.
Oh in the least surprising announcement ever he may have been influenced by Islamist ideology.

Galaxy

System failures. He was out on bail for rape.
Oh in the least surprising announcement ever he may have been influenced by Islamist ideology.

It’s so simple in a black and white world, after the event though, isn’t it? Failures happen because the wrong call is made, but unless everybody who is suspected of committing any crime is locked up, pending an (imperfect) judicial system decision, there will be failures - the successes aren’t reported on.

An assassin
1. A person who commits murder
2. A Shia Muslim who at the time of the crusades was set on suicide missions.

ronib

An assassin
1. A person who commits murder
2. A Shia Muslim who at the time of the crusades was set on suicide missions.

No.

a person who murders an important person for political or religious reasons

As for your historical Shia Muslim definition are you saying he's one of these?

"a member of the Nizari branch of Ismaili Muslims at the time of the Crusades, when the newly established sect ruled part of northern Persia (1094–1256). They were renowned as militant fanatics, and were popularly reputed to use hashish before going on murder missions."

You are deliberately trying to use the term to load the attack by a Muslim,

Have you not read the bible if you are venturing back into history?

(Biblical texts, particularly in the books of Joshua and Judges, describe instances of warfare and violence by the Israelites against other nations (like the Canaanites and Midianites)

This is treading dangerous ground in terms of current world affairs -

Best left on this thread

escaped

So what's the plan going forward then?

If we allow more of these marches and protests, the more violence will be incited.
If we throw more money at security, it won't prevent more of these attacks happening in the first place.
If we appeal for less hatred, who is going to take any notice.
We've tried all this before.

I think education has to somehow be the only way. I just hope isn't now too late.

I am personally left feeling very sad.

Agree.

We can't go on like this.

Well we can't. Gaza cant go on like this. Hatred whipped up against both Jewish and Muslim communities. It gets nowhere but destroyed or damaged lives.

Many of us have been saying for ages that anti-semitism can only increase due to international pressures, and now it's happening.

substack.com/@avigail/p-175220317

Warning: dont open the web address above. It leads to a page with your email on, yes, for real. it also says it comes from Scotland and the writer uses to word "gotton" as in USA speak.

I'm reporting it now but its late at night as regards moderators.

Wyllow3

Warning: dont open the web address above. It leads to a page with your email on, yes, for real. it also says it comes from Scotland and the writer uses to word "gotton" as in USA speak.

I'm reporting it now but its late at night as regards moderators.

It didn't have my email on - weird!

The writer is Israeli, so isn't a native English speaker, which could be why she uses "gotten". She currently works in Scotland near Inverness (I Googled her).

yes but if you go into it your email address. comes up on their page to subscribe..I'd rather lets mods decide, how did they get my mail?

Wyllow3

yes but if you go into it your email address. comes up on their page to subscribe..I'd rather lets mods decide, how did they get my mail?

Fair enough - let them decide, but just saying it didn't happen to me, so I don't understand.

Shame because the article is interesting.

Allira

sunami

Oreo

The marches have caused so much hatred towards Jews world wide.

Have they caused them or are they a symptom of hatred? There's a difference and you need to be able back up your claim.

Oreo says, The marches have caused so much hatred towards Jews world wide but you ask or are they a symptom of hatred?
If a symptom of hatred, as you suggest, then why are they allowed to take place at all, as surely that would be considered to be anti-semitic?

I thought they were protests about the war in Gaza and a plea for it to end.

If, as suggested the protests are a symptom of hatred, then that is anti-semitism, surely?
🤔

The marches certainly have whipped up people's emotions and sadly we begin to see the results.

I really don't agree. I haven't been anywhere near any of the marches and they haven't influenced my thinking in any way.

It isn't logical to link marches against the Israeli government in Gaza with antisemitism. That assumes that the Israeli state represents all Jews worldwide. It doesn't even represent the views of all Jews in Israel, never mind all the ones in the US and elsewhere.

I am well aware that there are those on the marches who are antisemitic and/or anti Zionist, but that's not the aim of the marches. Banning the marches has implications for free speech. There is nothing wrong with expressing an opinion that the Israeli government's actions are wrong.

By the way, an assumption is being made that the motivation was Gaza. The Israeli government has been bombing Syria since December last year as part of its proxy war against Iran. As the perpetrator had Syrian origins, it could very well be that he was motivated by that. In any case, he was wrong to assume that British Jews are the same as the Israeli government, but unfortunately that's an easy mistake to make when the Israeli government itself claims to represent all Jews.

In fact, the thinking has even crept on to GN because posts criticising Netanyahu and the Israeli government are seen by some as antisemitic.