This government has me puzzled

Allira

^I think you misunderstand the general definition of far-right politics Mollygo^

I think we do understand the general definition of far-right politics, DAR and we can all Google, copy and paste too.

But those definitions in your post do not always coincide with some of the claims made on GN.

Even those who generally vote Liberal Democratic, occasionally straying to Labour or the Tories, have been accusing of peddling far-right views.

It is perfectly possible for anyone, declaring a belief in a particular party, leaning in one or all areas of the far-right.

DAR the list you supply could be for the far right or the far left.
Which is why it’s better to be nearer the centre.

Oreo

DAR the list you supply could be for the far right or the far left.
Which is why it’s better to be nearer the centre.

I couldn't agree more but we do have to be aware of the shifting of the Overton window. For this public opinion sets boundaries on what policies or ideas are considered viable. The Overton Window has shifted on many fronts in recent years . From climate and social policy to immigration and economic ideas, some previously radical ideas are now mainstream political discussion points. In other areas there’s active backlash or repositioning that pulls the window back. The exact direction of the shift can vary by country and issue, but overall the range of what’s considered acceptable has definitely changed in recent years. Some have remained in what was centre. Others, in the "new" centre can still seem more left or right wing.

fancythat

^Please just try and remember that labour have inherited a corrupt Tory government.^

All governments "inherit" from the previous one.
They cant all get off the hook that way!

All governments do indeed inherit a past carved by the previous government but I do think it can be shown that the Tories left a government "stuck in a doom loop of short-termism" (Institute for Government) with performance having declined over a long period.

Public services were widely assessed as under strain.
The new government reported inherited financial pressures and gaps.
Analysts and stakeholder reports describe structural economic and social challenges linked to the previous decade plus.

It's not yet an established legal fact that the previous Conservative Government's acted corruptly. However, there are documented examples of inquiries and investigations in the UK that have revealed wrongdoing, red flags, or serious concerns about corruption or misconduct.

Mollygo

DaisyAnneReturns

I think you misunderstand the general definition of far-right politics Mollygo. This may help:

EXTREME NATIONALISM
Far-right politics strongly emphasizes the nation, often defining it in ethnic, cultural, or religious terms rather than civic ones. This can include ideas that some groups “belong” more than others.
AUTHORITARIAN TENDENCIES
Far-right movements often support strong leaders, strict law-and-order policies, and limits on democratic checks and balances, civil liberties, or independent institutions (like courts or the press).
EXCLUSIONARY OR HIERARCHICAL VIEWS
They commonly promote the idea that society should be organized hierarchically, opposing equality based on race, ethnicity, religion, gender, or sexuality. This can show up as racism, xenophobia, or anti-immigrant attitudes.
OPPOSITION TO LIBERAL DEMOCRACY
Many far-right ideologies reject key elements of liberal democracy, such as pluralism, minority rights, and protections for dissent. Some seek to replace democracy with authoritarian or ethnocratic systems.
POPULISM (often present, but not always)
Far-right groups often frame politics as a struggle between “the real people” and corrupt elites, media, or institutions, claiming to represent the nation’s “true will.”
TRADITIONALISM
They frequently advocate for strict social norms, opposing progressive changes related to gender roles, LGBTQ+ rights, or multiculturalism.

IMPORTANT DISTINCTION
Right-wing politics broadly supports free markets, limited government, tradition. Far-right politics goes beyond this by rejecting equality, pluralism, or democratic norms and promoting exclusion or authoritarianism.

So no, personally I don't see it as "anyone who disagrees" and I am sure Labour, and their supporters, can look after themselves.

Love your very wordy non-explanation DEAR. The fact that on GN and other media far right is instantly used to describe anyone who disagrees with something Labour does or disagrees with certain posters is indisputable.
As exemplified on here. 🤣🤣🤣

Perhaps it's time you wrote a thesis on how others should answer posts Mollygo you seem so determined to make something of others style.

The fact that on GN and other media far right is instantly used to describe anyone who disagrees with something Labour does or disagrees with certain posters is indisputable.

It is very noticeable, Mollygo, but also dilutes the meaning of far-right if it can be bandied around so freely as an insult.

Message deleted by Gransnet. Here's a link to our Talk guidelines.

All workers have something to contribute but unlike farmers the rest of us have to pay 40% IHT AND aren't given an extended time to pay it. I fail to see why farmers should be given special treatment.

‘Puzzled’ ? That’s tame , it has me frothing at the mouth.

Allira

^The fact that on GN and other media far right is instantly used to describe anyone who disagrees with something Labour does or disagrees with certain posters is indisputable.^

It is very noticeable, Mollygo, but also dilutes the meaning of far-right if it can be bandied around so freely as an insult.

Yes , I agree with this comment. Far right in reality are usually thugs who go round with Nazi symbols bashing people. Very unpleasant criminal types. The Far Left who like to think they know everything and look down on the majority are far more prevalent and turning out to be far more dangerous to democracy. Stop jury trials, imprison people who disagree with me, stop elections so they don’t get voted out. All far left, all very,very dangerous.

Well put nanna8.

Who are the far left on GN? Is it 'some people'?

I think most people broadly understand what is meant by the “far right”, what the far left advocate, and what Labour, the Liberal Democrats, the Greens and the Conservatives see as their core beliefs, ideas and goals. It may be fairer to say that the term is sometimes applied too broadly, rather than that it is automatically used for anyone who disagrees with Labour. That distinction matters if we want a useful and informed debate.

The far right, like any political movement, is defined by a set of core beliefs, ideas and aims. These often include strong nationalism, opposition to immigration, an emphasis on traditional social hierarchies, and scepticism towards liberal democracy. While some individuals or groups associated with the far right have engaged in criminal or violent behaviour, or used extremist symbols, those actions alone do not define the ideology as a whole. It is reasonable, however, to criticise the far right by examining its beliefs and political objectives.

Doodledog

Who are the far left on GN? Is it 'some people'?

It's those wretched Communists, Doodledog There all over GN.

Or perhaps, if people lean far enough to the right, any suggestions of social democracy is seen as far left! You couldn't make it up, could you?

Nanna8 stick to Australian news maybe 🤷‍♀️

The far right or far left on GN is used as a way of dismissing anyone who disagrees with you. Sometimes using the term isn’t sufficient and involves reporting the person who disagrees with you.

So these are things I think are far right.
The massacre of Jews.
The sterilisation of children who are autistic or who will grow up to be gay.
Suppression of speech.

Galaxy

So these are things I think are far right.
The massacre of Jews.
The sterilisation of children who are autistic or who will grow up to be gay.
Suppression of speech.

What I’m was saying is how far-right movements and organisations define themselves, not the worst actions that people associate with them.

Listing extreme crimes tells us what you personally oppose, which is fine, but it doesn’t really answer the question of how far-right groups describe their own beliefs, goals, or values.

The term far right has-been rendered meaningless in the last decade or so. The ' crimes' I describe' are frequently currently supported by the left but they are historically far right actions.

Mollygo

The far right or far left on GN is used as a way of dismissing anyone who disagrees with you. Sometimes using the term isn’t sufficient and involves reporting the person who disagrees with you.

Who us "you" in this context Mollygo? We're you replying to my post?

Galaxy

The term far right has-been rendered meaningless in the last decade or so. The ' crimes' I describe' are frequently currently supported by the left but they are historically far right actions.

The claim that these actions are “frequently supported by the left” is false. The claim that these crimes are no longer meaningfully “far right” is historically incorrect and the argument relies on reframing modern policy debates as genocidal or eugenic, which is not accurate analysis.

What is true? Political labels can be misused and authoritarian behavior can exist on both sides.

What is not true? That the genocide of Jews, forced sterilisation, or authoritarian repression are now “left-wing crimes”and that the term far right has become meaningless.

This could be seen as a bad-faith argument but I think it is more likely to be a deeply confused argument, not a sound historical or political one.

Oh I am sure you think so.
Sterilisation of autistic and gay people is part of trans ideology, which has been supported by the left.
We have just had the systematic killing of Jewish people by Islamic terrorists, which the left can't cope with addressing in any meaningful way .
And the left have embraced cancelling speech with a particular delight.

No mainstream trans advocacy supports sterilising autistic or gay people.
Medical interventions are voluntary, individual, and governed by consent. Equating that with forced sterilisation is historically and ethically inaccurate.

Terrorist attacks on Jews are real, abhorrent, and must be condemned without qualification. But they are not equivalent to a state-run genocide, nor are they “left-wing crimes.”

Condemning terrorism and criticising Israeli government policy are not the same thing. Collapsing them together prevents meaningful discussion and weakens the fight against antisemitism.

Yes, illiberal behavior around speech exists across political movements, including on the left. That does not make it equivalent to authoritarian repression or genocidal ideology.

Expanding the term “far right” to mean “anything I find coercive” doesn’t clarify history; it erases it. You’re no longer making a historical claim here, you’re collapsing very different phenomena into a single moral category to score a point.

No I am not scoring points, I know more about the trans movement than you do unfortunately. The investigation into the tavistock was very clear about concerns around the
over representation of autistic children in the numbers, gay rights organisations consider the trans movement as a form of gay conversion therapy, etc etc.
Islamic terrorists are systematically murdering Jews across the globe, they are fascists.
I didn't extend the term far right, that was done over the last few years but not by me.

Galaxy

No I am not scoring points, I know more about the trans movement than you do unfortunately. The investigation into the tavistock was very clear about concerns around the
over representation of autistic children in the numbers, gay rights organisations consider the trans movement as a form of gay conversion therapy, etc etc.
Islamic terrorists are systematically murdering Jews across the globe, they are fascists.
I didn't extend the term far right, that was done over the last few years but not by me.

It’s clear that you know more about the trans movement Galaxy.
You put your knowledge very clearly.