Eldest Daughter problems, advice needed..

Maybe just give her a hug to start with, tell her you love her and then leave it for a while.

You've started to build bridges and that's what matters. She probably doesn't know how to handle this but you've held out the olive branch so why not give her a few days and see if her behaviour improves? She does sound more like a teenager than a 20 year old, but that's not unusual. When one of my daughters was that age, I found she would bat away attempts to have a discussion with her, but the very fact of me bringing an issue up would bring results without us having a 'big talk.'

Oh dear, I think she needs to know it's your house and you won't have her speaking to you like that or swearing however much you love her and however upset she is about what is going on. Where is Dad while this is going on? If he's hiding in the shed it really is not good enough, it's time he intervened.
That sounds bossy, sorry don't mean to, but I would have got DH to have a word by now however unpopular it made him and however reluctant he was ! And they still adore him.

Families!!

He's been working nights but is off tomorrow. .. see if anything happens then

It does rather sound like 'wait till your father gets home', but he does need to listen to both sides and perhaps mediate for the sake of harmony. My DH worked away so didn't want to be seen as unpopular when he came home but sometimes he could sort it out as he was one step removed from the row and could see both sides of the argument. Good luck, let him have a good sleep and a meal first!!

I won't be asking him to intervene as I know he doesn't want to get involved. My daughter does a very good job of always being right and can see that she does no wrong, its always someone else's fault. If he says anything to her she takes it we are ganging up on her and storms off, if anything he sees her side more as he knows how she over reacts.
I am going to leave her to talk to him as I know she will whilst I'm at work and I can only hope he is neutral and helps her see how I feel too because I know she doesn't want to listen to me.
She's 21 soon and is very critical of others and only hears her own opinions so I am stepping back, its times like this I wish my parents were alive to talk to.

I agree about your DH having a word in her shell-like , it is not really on how she is behaving !
((hug))

Stand your ground, optimistic. You have made it clear you will not be spoken to so rudely by an adult in your own house. Your intention to stand back and let that take root is wise. All the best .

My daughter stormed out when she was almost 18, she never came home that night but I knew she was OK because her boyfriend (devoted to her) never rang to speak to her or to come round (found out she was living across the road with her friend's family) sneaking in when I was at work to get clean clothes and telling her dad (my ex) that she had left home. I packed her things in five bin bags and left them on her bed with a letter telling her that I loved her very much, that I had realised that she had left for good but that she was welcome to come home but to know that SHE was living with ME and that I would not tread on eggshells any more around her.

She phoned me later that day and come home. We hugged and things have been lovely ever since. What I am trying to say is that it is YOUR house and if she cannot live with you peacefully and with out you having to tip toe around her and feel uncomfortable then maybe she should find her own place to live.

Optimisticnana, this is so hard for you. But also very unhealthy for all of you. It is impossible to advise as there maybe hidden factors none of us- nor you are aware of. I am trying to think of worst scenario and thinking- perhaps she is pregnant? Or was and felt she had no choice but to have a termination. Or drugs of some kind, which can truly lead to quite violent changes of mood- etc.

But whatever the problem is- I don't think you should share a roof any longer, if she refuses to talk or be civil- which is a form of blackmail, really. Write to her to say you love her, and would love to understand how and why she is hurting so badly- that you are there for her, always- but that if she refuses to talk and is rude as she is now- she has to leave for a while and make her own way. That you would love to help and support her- but that living like this is just not good for anybody- perhaps acknowldege that you can understand she feels her nose out of joint due to the baby and her sister getting the larger room, etc. but ask her what choice you had in the circumstances. Very very hard- but you can't keep walking on eggshells and hiding in your own home. Thinking of you and hoping you will find a way.

I think that to write a letter, as granjura suggests, is a very sensible way forward. You can have your say and keep your dignity. The problem is with your daughter...not you. You have every right to expect to live in your own home, on your terms. I would not give in. I would not tip toe around her. I wish you a satisfactory outcome to what must be a totally depressing state of affairs.

I hate to go against the general opinion here, but I still feel sympathy for your eldest daughter. Yes, her swearing at you is wrong and everyone, whatever their age should be able to go about their life without being sworn at or swearing at other members of the household. But.....your comment about 'we would have done the same for her if she was pregnant' disturbs me a little, and it does come across almost as praise for the 17 year old getting pregnant. I am sure you are doing what you can to help the 17 year old, but it is not ideal having a child when you have never even had a job let alone paid your own rent. I am not blaming you or your youngest daughter, but I think the 20 year old needs some slack here, she sees her sister getting all the praise for being a good mother, getting the best room etc. you still seem to be blaming her and to be honest I think you need to act the adult and take control, politely tell her that swearing and shouting will not be tolerated, but when you have this conversation, do make sure that you dont shout at her. ( we have all done it!). Not trying to tell you that you are wrong, but just try to see it from her point of view.

To be candid that thought had drifted through my mind!!

Yes, I feel some slack and space to let things settle down is wise, not a showdown. You've told her there's an issue that needs sorting and she's trying to avoid what she expects to be a telling off. Gives you time to show you love her just as much and that there are boundaries about behaviour - gives her time to save face and start to be more reasonable.

I'm with nonu and GillT57 on this but a conversation needs to be held before tensions build up to an explosion.
PS I like the new Spring emoticon! - is that in honour of Saturday??

I am with Gill57 and whenim64 here. I feel quite strongly about it.

I can't see that coming over all strict or throwing DD out will do any good although, having said that, it does depend on what you want to achieve.

I am just wondering if you feel resentful to your daughter. Do you feel your husband is siding with her?

If you want to establish a peaceful and more harmonious relationship with DD I think you will have to give it time, plenty of time.

In other words, you've got to be a bit of a saint. Can you manage that?

The only way to solve this one is to try and "walk in her shoes" a bit. You are the more mature person and it may fall to you to be the one who does this. I feel that this lass is hurting - why or how, who knows - but she is certainly not happy.

I am assuming that she has not always behaved like this.

New babies are very seductive - they hoover us in and you will be wanting to support your younger DD. But maybe this other lass has needs too.

Tread gently - I do not think ultimatums are the way forward. Of course her behaviour is unacceptable, but for her to be doing this is evidence of her distress. Remain calm; stay firm that you cannot discuss things as long as she is swearing at you; but try not to be angry and judge her - boy does this lass need you just now!

More than likely Soutra !
GNHQ CAN be patriotic !

A word of support from me for those counselling attempts to calm the emotional atmosphere down. If you ask your daughter to leave in these circumstances, I fear it could damage relationships within the family. I'm not defending bad behaviour, swearing and displays of temper. Could you continue to try and talk with her about why she is behaving like this (assuming it isn't an established pattern of behaviour that is)
I empathise with your situation, it's so exhausting and debilitating, isn't it.

Nobody is takling about 'going all strict and throwing her out'- but write to her calmly about how you love her and how you understand she may well feel pushed out by the new baby and dad living in, etc- but that perhaps, for her sake and yours, and the others- a break and time to think may be helpful. If she was 15 or 16, it would be very different- as she is an adult and 21 .... and I think this makes a huge difference really.

As my 30 something daughter said to me not long ago - " I don't know, you're the grownup. You're supposed to be the one to stay calm!".

Don't burn bridges, but do ask DH for support, he doesn't have to take sides to be supportive.

I'm thinking it might not be easy for DD to find other accommodation in these straightened times.

Anyway, I think it would be a retrograde move to ask her to move out. I imagine she would feel terribly rejected.

I remember when DD2 aged 19 was getting snappy because her sister's boyfriend was forever at our house and eventually she explained to me that she felt it as an intrusion into our family life, couldn't come home and really relax, flop,about in PJ's etc., something both girls did at home before the boyfriend so possibly your DD is feeling something similar optomistic and she has had to adapt to a different household too except in her case, on a more permanent basis. However, her behaviour and language are, as you already know, unacceptable.

I would let things calm down, tell her you love her and you understand the changes at home are a bit difficult at present but it's not forever then later when she is reassured explain that her behaviour and swearing at you are not in fact acceptable.

All the best and I really hope things calm down for you and you have more harmony at home again.