Support for family members cut out of loved ones lives 5

Some of us are grandmothers Yogagirl but of course we were also daughters and DILs and have seen many viewpoints. My husband went NC with his mother several times, always relented and always regretted it. She would tell me what a wonderful mother/grandmother she was but of course she refused to see it from anyone else's point of view. The main thing she couldn't get was that children grow up and have a life of their own. Demanding phone calls every day, visit more often and of course the trying to justify it all by buying things e.g. you must bring the children more often as I have all these toys they need to play with, I gave him deposit for his first care (20 years ago 30 years ago?) so he should run me round more. In the end you can't do enough so why do anything?

Celebgran, you daughter might have overreacted by involving the police but why did you continue sending cards if you had been asked not to? Can't you see that it won't help to do something you have been asked not to do? If I was your daughter I would feel you had no respect for my feelings and yet you expect her to have respect for yours.

Fairydoll yes well said by you and of course Winston Churchill himself!

Annsixty Thank you for your in-put, what a sad story, take it you don't see their Son either?

GrannytomineI know that most of us here HAVE tried to make contact and work things out. Maybe reading back on the threads may help you to understand that. It's hard to have a conversation with an AC if they don't answer your calls, texts and emails. And if you don't know what you did like many of us here, how can we apologize. I'm glad you can keep treading water with your DIL and not fall in. But many of us have been pushed in the water by our EC and this thread is a lifesaver.
I don't understand why you say that spending money on equipment will annoy the AC. Why ? We babysat for three years every week before estrangement. If I bought equipment why would that be of concern to the AC? That surely can't be the basis for an estrangement. In our case the AC were happy that their child was in a safe piece of equipment, especially car seats. When you give support to someone you make no judgments. You may disagree but telling everyone what they are doing wrong is not support.

Who is Madman?

Juststrollingby It was to wish my precious grandchildren a 'happy birthday' a 'Happy Birthday advert' My precious granddaughter lived with me whilst she was in her mummy's tummy [my D] so she knew my voice even before she was born, we didn't even know her now stepdad existed! I chose her name, along with my D, and she was named after me [her middle & last name] My D & GD living with me, gave us a very special and loving bond, I loved and adored them and them me. From that to NC! My GC didn't chose to not see me anymore, if asked they would have said "NO!" to their nannie being cut out. I have no add. to send cards, so this is the only way to wish my beloveds a "Happy Birthday" And you say I'm wrong to do this !?

Stepdad even took away my GD name!!!

Grannytomine

if you have a safety gate that's all you need

Really?

A friend has been caring for her 3 year old grandaughter since she was 6 months old as her DIL works full time.
She had to buy a cot (to the requirements of her DIL - who is also very 'challenging'), subsequently a bed, a highchair, two stair gates (large house), a car seat (to DIL's standards) and toys etc etc
She was not offered anything towards these purchases and neither did she ask as she knew the young couple were only just coping financially.
I had five siblings and managed without highchairs, child beds, car seats - well, we never had a car - and much of the other stuff that is deemed necessary baby equipment these days. But, the world has changed and we have to go with the flow,,,,

P.s My Churchill. 'speech' was meant as a little bit of light relief for the posters on here who, just recently, have become the recipients of some quite nasty, hurtful comments.

Think I'll stay off of this forum now, It's became too ugly! I have tons of work to do, getting my Yoga Retreat put together for next month.
It's stopped being a support page now, but rather a 'Let's stick the knife in' page!

I've got to say attacking someone for buying stuff to use when their DGC visit is puzzling. I am lucky, I have a good relationship with my DC and they visit regularly with their families. I often look after the DGC at mine, or the whole family stays over. Of course I have equipment to make those visits easier - books, toys, a buggy, travel cot, safety gates, high chair (two actually - so shoot me ). I am at a loss to understand how this can be a bad thing, but no doubt someone will enlighten me.

JustStrollingBy - Yogagirl seems to have made a habit of putting adverts in the paper. I have seen the adverts, as Yogagirl gave so much family information on GN, it was incredibly easy to find them. They gave the GCs full names and a one had a photograph of them.

The first year Yogagirl said on GN: "I've been a naughty girl and put an advert in the paper for xxxx and xxxx birthday next week. When my s.i.l. sees this, which is going in the local paper, evening paper and online for a week, he will go ballistic."

The next year, she said, "I put the photo of xxxx and xxxx that my neighbour downloaded and printed for me in the newspaper advert .......... but they will wonder how I got it. Little pleasures"

It is so unkind to knowingly do something which is likely cause tension within her daughter's family, who must feel almost under siege.

If GPs feel the need to support each other online, they can do that without giving so much personal information that it is easy to trace their entire family. I also don't understand why they think that only posters who agree with them should contribute to this thread. GN is an open forum, and if you post details of your life online, you are inviting comment. I can't see anything in the GN guidelines that says if you tag a thread as "support", no-one can post an opposing point of view. These posters do not own or control this thread, but they seem to almost give marks out of ten to other posters - approving of anyone who supports their point of view and declaring that anyone who sees it differently does not know what they are talking about. In reality, none of us on GN, apart from the estranged GPs themselves, knows the full story, so we are all equally entitled to comment.

Sad day when Gransnet was discovered by Mumsnetters.

estrangement comes in hundreds of different ways ....all families are different in the way they live their lives ours are no exception...the problems that arise in our families are not the same but may be similar to someone elses....one size does not fit all!

The one thing that sticks out in this thread is the lack of compassion and respect for other posters 'the lurkers' who jump in and think they know it all and stir the pot so to speak...

we the estranged grandparents should not have to justify our lives to anyone to make them understand ...as the saying goes 'walk a day in my shoes'

this is a support group for us to vent not for others to jump in and attack!

Here we go again g to mine total jump in not knowing facts.

I have better stuff to do than enlighten you.

Yogsgirl big hug we really need ignore the horrendous nasty stuff admin dont seem to get involved unless it suits them.

Off out for lunch try. To be so unkind on here as yogsgirl says is supprt thread not boxing ring.

My good God! Madman you have been scrolling through years of my posts, to repeat the above! I don't even remembered this myself, as you are talking about three years ago!! Get a life!!

Strollingby I take it that the harassment order was against your own mother that you 'cut out' and you call me bad for wishing my beloved GC a 'Happy Birthday'

I will read no more posts. I'm OUT!

Jenty61 well done excellent post,

I can't fathom what lurkers get out of jumping in with nasty posts it is sad reflection on their lives I suppose hiding behind anonymity to try stir up sxxx

So sad reflection of society today

Message deleted by Gransnet for breaking our forum guidelines. Replies may also be deleted.

My harassment order was not against my mother, it was against someone who had no respect for me. Someone who believed their need/right to communicate with me was more important than my desire to be left alone.

You talk a lot about your pain, your heartache. About how you are 'only' wishing Happy Birthday to your GC. It's all very emotive. It's all you.

The reality for your daughter is that she will feel stress and anxiety over your ad. I used to have to turn my phone off because the beep to say an email or text had come sent my heart hammering with fear. The time they came to the house after being asked not to I was left shaking in a heap hiding in a corner. The psychological impact of not being left alone when you ask for it is immense. What to you might be 'only' a text, or 'only' birthday wishes morph into incredibly destructive attacks on her actual core self. This is why harassment is a criminal offence. It is psychological harm.

I have ended up with PTSD. Because they, the sender, refused to accept they were doing anything wrong or causing harm by their actions, and they only stopped because an emergency court order would cause them to go to jail if they didn't.

And there was nothing beyond a sort of low level unpleasantness within those messages, because they were frustrated and angry that I was not doing what they asked, but just wanted to be left alone. They could not accept that any human being can choose not to remain in any relationship, of any kind, at any time, for reasons of their own. Reasons that do not have to be agreed with or validated by the person from whom they wish to have space.

It is a basic human right. It is recognised in law.

You are ignoring your child's basic human right. To be left alone if requested to do so.

And as for your GC? They will not see your ad. You know this. Their birthday will not be affected by not hearing you say Happy Birthday to them. Harsh though it may seem, they have their parents so they will be fine. Their security and self-esteem comes from their parents, not you.

So who have you done this ad for?

Not your GC. They will never see it.
Not your daughter. You know she doesn't want it.
Not your SIL. You know it will make him angry.

I feel compassion for you, because your pain is real. I can see it in your words. But as an outsider to this thread it is clear you cannot see your part in what is happening. And because you can't see it, it is unlikely ever to be fixed.

Your ad is nothing but a power play, and benefits no one but you.

Madamecholet

Get a life!

What a vindictive post. Is trolling through someone's retrospective newspaper adverts so you can come back on here and attempt to score points or prove a point, something that you really think is worthwhile?

Very sad.....

Celebgran, I am trying not to judge.

But even without knowing ANY back story, it is not ok to do this. To anyone.

I can see everyone's feelings are running high. It is hugely upsetting all round.

But however jangled and overpowering your feelings, feelings cannot be used to justify actions that cause harm to others. All humans have the thinking skills to appreciate that feeling like you want to murder someone, does not mean murdering them is ok.

And the DC in these cases, however baffling and unreasonable you each may find it, have the right to do this if they find that spending time around you is causing them psychological harm. And THEY get to decide what causes them harm, not you.

We are all humans. We all have these rights. No one has the right to stay in your life if you want them far away from you. Your DCs rights are no less.

"I've been a naughty girl and put an advert in the paper for xxxx and xxxx birthday next week. When my s.i.l. sees this, which is going in the local paper, evening paper and online for a week, he will go ballistic."

"I put the photo of xxxx and xxxx that my neighbour downloaded and printed for me in the newspaper advert .......... but they will wonder how I got it. Little pleasures"

Taking pleasure in sending him ballistic, then feeling hurt at the rift in the family while claiming to be absolutely inoocent of doing anything to continue it is not consistent. If you continue doing what you know they don't want you to, then of course the war continues. Those ads were NOT for the children, they were weapons used against SiL. My response to that would have been to take out an injunction against somone who was determined to use my children to attack me.

For goodness sake, instead of thinking that ALL the pain has come from one side, examine your own motives and actions for once, without the rose-coloured spectacles on, and stop telling those who point out where you might just have made a mistaken comment or done something that would hurt the "other side" that they are trolling, vindictive, and abusive.

By the way - do you really not understand that saying that calling a poster Madman or saying that it is a good name for them is abusive? More abusive than anything that Madamecholet posted? Try reporting her post if you think it abusive - and hope that she doesn't report yours!

None of you 'newer' posters will ever succeed here . The problem is the main posters refuse to move on. If you read other GN
threads you will see they don't contribute to them at all..... even the innocous ones like.crafts, tv. , fashion. Doesn't this tell you something? I have no contact with my first-born, although she did grudgingly stir herself to travel down for her father's funeral .Since then (5 months) .....zilch! Do I care? Not in the least!
I intend to enjoy the few years I have left, and couldn't give a fig what she does with her life. Time on this earth is too short to spend it in bitter arguments, .'what-might-have-beens', and 'misery postings'.

I hope the posters, who have recently joined this thread will perhaps move on to Mumsnet and comment on the liberal use of the 'F word' and frequent suggestions to LTB ( leave the bastard?) which appear from time to time.

Maybe they could suggest that children could easily read their mothers posts at some point in the future and find them very distressing.

That may be slightly more helpful than some of the really quite vindictive comments on here. Some posters have valid points and make them succinctly and kindly.
Others, well...

Just saying ....

I'm not going to comment on this thread as I'm not estranged from my children but I think you're totally wrong in your comment grannytomine about equipment.

We have two bedrooms in our home totally fitted out for our grandchildren and have done since the first arrived nearly 10 years ago. One room is our baby room and each little one starts in their in the cot.

They move up to the big kids room , with bunk beds etc when the next baby arrives or they come out of their cot at home.

We have car seats and a high chair, clothes both new and hand me downs from previous grandchildren. We have toys both new and recycled from the other kids. Their mums regularly send back things the kids have stopped playing with because when they discover it at our house it's all new again.

They all have their own cup, plates and cutlery.

Why?

Because both of my daughters love the fact they can drop by with nothing and it's all here. Because if they stop by and a little one asks to stay , it's all here. Because in an emergency we can pick up a child in the middle of the night and bring them back and it's all here .

How could any parent who loves their child and wants to foster a lifelong loving relationship between child and grandparent ever worry if Nana has a cot or a high chair? How can that possibly be annoying?

NanaandGrampy, if your children are happy with that it is fine but apart from a cot if they are staying overnight you don't need that. There is no way a child needs there own cup plate and spoon. The bedrooms aren't the children's though are they, they are spare rooms in your house that they use when they visit, their bedrooms are at their parents home, the home they live in with their parents.

I look after my grandchildren alot, they sleep here at least twice a week and more in school holidays, I pick them up from school 3 or 4 times a week and occasionally five. When they were younger they would arrive in a car seat which was transferred to my car, their buggy would be lifted out of mum's carboot. I don't think it is surprising that one poster said they went out and spent hundreds on baby equipment, I don't count toys as equipment by the way, and suddenly the arrangement for them to look after the baby was cancelled. They stepped on the parents toes and I can understand exactly how the young mum felt. Like I said step lightly and give them space and they will come to you, keep pushing for more and you push them away.

I think you don't understand that you have to be much more diplomatic with DIL than daughter, I have both and I have been both.

If anyone is being nasty on here I don't think it is the new people who are actually trying to help people understand how these things go wrong.

I agree with Elegran about who is being abusive. I think it is incredibly sad that people are deliberately doing things that will cause stress in their EC family and if that is what is being supported here then I don't think there is much hope of people regaining contact.