Canon Andrew Hindley

Yes I read that they were willing to close the cathedral after his suspension. I don't know which program?
I can't imagine why he had freehold.

The C of E need to change the way they employ people so no one in future is ever in a position where they are safe from being sacked if they need sacking.

the programme was the one i advertised earlier, was on bbc radio 4 at 8pm 13th aug.
he had freehold because that was the position he held as sacrist canon of the cathedral, similar to the incumbent of a parish.

Iam64

Prince Charles told Ball in a letter in February 1995, two years after the bishop had accepted a police caution , which was read to the inquiry “I wish I could do more. I feel so desperately strongly about the monstrous wrongs that have been done to you and the way you have been treated”. Charles later arranged for the Duchy of Cornwall to buy a house to be rented by Ball and his twin, also a Bishop”. Guardian 23.06.18)

Ball was first arrested in 1993 and cautioned for gross indecency against a 17 year old boy. At the time police had letters of support from political and education institutions. His lawyers told police he had a letter of support from a member of the royal family, never seen by authorities. (Christian News 27.01.17).

I think this goes back to the point I made in a previous post, that for a long time, 'Normal' people did not realise how ingrained and relentless paedophilia is in many of its perpetrators and saw it as someone doing something wrong in a fit of mental illness or doing a breakdown and willing to hate the crime but love the sinner.

We have a far greater understanding now and the King would not do now what he did then, not just because of the weight of public opinion, but because like som many of us, he has a far greater understanding of the relentless nature of serial paedophiles.

The difficulty of sacking people the employer recognises pose a risk to children isn’t confined to the CofE
The headteacher at my children’s primary school was accused of two historical offences against 7-8 year old girls at his previous school, about 5 years earlier. One complaint from 5 years ago was resurrected after a 2nd girl told her teacher after a stranger danger class that Mr x had indecently assaulted her when she was in primary school. This girl had not told anyone about this until promoted by the lesson

He was suspended. Parents split into 80% supporting Mr X who was indeed a good head teacher. 20% saying we have to accept what the children allege because he is suspended and the 2 children knew nothing about each other. Some parents told their children Mr X was away from school because two naughty girls said bad things about him, (they really did say this )

He was reinstated after the CPS decided girl 1 wouldn’t be seen as a reliable witness because she’d had support fromCAMHS.
He was appointed to a bigger school soon after this.

Two years later, a child at that school made allegations. Local press reports led to other allegations being made - 3 by girls who’d attended our school.

CPS again said not enough evidence from reliable witnesses to prosecute. They said a well respected middle class head teacher with a wife who believed his denials and a child doing well etc would be more likely to be believed than the children. They couldn’t link the earlier allegations and one of the current victims was from a very disturbed background. The education department responded by moving him out of schools into an administrative position

Sorry for the long post. Prosecutions of sex offenders are rare. Successful prosecutions even rarer.

I was at college with a boy who had been taken into temporary care with his slightly older brother when his parents separated.

The boys were sent to a Catholic children's home run by nuns and both were sexually abused by the same visiting priest. The priest visited frequently and liked to have one to one private talks with the children.

It was well known among the children what went on in these 'talks' but it was also well known that, if it was reported to the nuns, the child would be severely punished for lying and being dirty minded.

This took place during the 1960s but it would appear that 60 years on children are still not adequately protected.

A few years ago I read in the news that a church minister (not C of E) befriended a family "with problems" and used that "friendship" to spend time with the troubled teenage lad.

Initially the lads single mother was grateful of the "support". I don't know how long the abuse went on before the troubled teen spoke out, but as soon as it was reported to the police he went back to prison because he had done this previously.

His church knew he had been in prison before for abusing teens and they believed he had repented. I googled the man and he had lived all over the country and been inside two previous times. Hope he does not get let out again!

Abusers seek vulnerable kids and people who won't be considered credible. These are the worst snakes in society and belong in prison, not masquerading as a good guy.

20 years ago, a local woman told me that her first experience was with a local vicar (in the pulpit) when she was a school girl. She said there were others. Nothing was done until he retired. His church is still empty for some reason.

Under no circumstances, am I condoning this behaviour. However, I keep repeating, for every bad apple there are some very decent and good clergymen.
It is unfortunate that they are tainted by the behaviour of these vile people.

Quote Marydoll Wed 14-Aug-24 10:39:09
Under no circumstances, am I condoning this behaviour. However, I keep repeating, for every bad apple there are some very decent and good clergymen.
It is unfortunate that they are tainted by the behaviour of these vile people.

So true Marydoll , priests and nuns are easy targets

Perhaps because so much evil in the world has been perpetrated in the name of 'religion'...

Yes there are always good clergy people. And there are some very bad ones. Then there are those who turn a blind eye or who are too trusting and don't do the background checks.

In the case of the minister I mentioned above (not C of E) the church he attended knew of his past but they believed he had repented and would never do it again. I did some digging and discovered....

He would not have been approved to visit young people if it had been known about. I now know that this man was in and out of prison and moved around the country and was given a local authority home each time. His new neighbours had no idea and his old ones who knew, could not find him. I plotted his known homes on a map and he's done a triangle of Britain.

I wonder where he will end up next time he's let out of prison.

We can never be too careful who we get close to or let our young people get close to because you just never know.

MissInterpreted

Perhaps because so much evil in the world has been perpetrated in the name of 'religion'...

But religion is often used as a cloak to cover other reasons. the problem in Northern Ireland has its roots in the hostility of the native Irish to British conquest and part of the colonistaion process was taking land from Irish landowners and granting it to Protestant settlers form Britain - mainly from Scotland. Since both irish and Scottish people look alike, the only way to tell them apart was by their religion.

There are many other examples of 'religious' wars, where religion was a cloak for other real non-religious reasons.

the programme is on again right now, worth hearing;
bbc radio 4

Sandelf:
"Cannot understand why these cases don't go straight to the police."

Me neither. I hope the Archbishop of Canterbury has been misreported as rewarding the criminal with a golden handshake.The ArchB does after all influence people of other and no religious affiliation.

Paedophilia is one thing but assaulting kids is another. I do hope the old school tie is not affecting judgements but |I am afraid cases like this do rather point to it.

M0nica

MissInterpreted

Perhaps because so much evil in the world has been perpetrated in the name of 'religion'...

But religion is often used as a cloak to cover other reasons. the problem in Northern Ireland has its roots in the hostility of the native Irish to British conquest and part of the colonistaion process was taking land from Irish landowners and granting it to Protestant settlers form Britain - mainly from Scotland. Since both irish and Scottish people look alike, the only way to tell them apart was by their religion.

There are many other examples of 'religious' wars, where religion was a cloak for other real non-religious reasons.

That's why I said 'in the name of religion'.

Quote Caleo Wed 14-Aug-24 11:27:07
Sandelf:
"Cannot understand why these cases don't go straight to the police."

Me neither. I hope the Archbishop of Canterbury has been misreported as rewarding the criminal with a golden handshake.The ArchB does after all influence people of other and no religious affiliation.

Best read the thread you will read the police were involved

Religion or faith can often be a cloak for other things. It doesn't really make any difference what religion it is. Anyone in authority can abuse and cover it under a cloak of "respectability".

The minister of our local church spent a lot of time "ministering" to my friend's Mum. Everyone local saw his car there a lot and eyebrows were raised, but no one guessed the extent.

Then, my friend came home early and found him with her Mum without his trousers on. She was told he'd spilled his tea and her Mum was drying them At the time we believed it and laughed at his carelessness.

Later on when the affair was discovered, we looked back and the pieces fit together....He stayed with his wife and family while she was disgraced and alienated from hers, but it should have been the other way round. She was the vulnerable one, with MH and other problems, yet painted as a temptress.

It made the daily papers , as many stories of errant clergy do. Instead of making a troubled woman's life better, he wrecked it with his selfishness, doing house calls on vulnerable women and manipulating circumstances to his advantage until he was found out. Like many men, he wasn't sorry, only sorry he got caught!

When the affair came to light he threw his mistress to the wolves. I think she really loved him and with her existing MH problems it broke her. He carried on with his "ministry". He could decieve most people, but not the neighbours that saw his car outside her house and eventually pieced it together. I feel sorry for the lives that were damaged by his "ministry" for YEARS

My friend lost her mother at a young age because of this man's selfishness.

OnwardandUpward,
could you give us his name, in case any of us come across him.

i meant the one who served terms in prison, as that is clearly criminal,
although there are so many of them . . .

Probably not the done thing to name people publicly, I don't want to fall foul of GN...

Put it one way, anyone who knows him, knows exactly who I'm talking about. Especially those with learning disabilities or mental health that he preyed on.

If someone "older" and new to your area is housed in social housing and seems a bit lost be careful because they may be being resettled by the Prison. Each time they have lived in a different part of the country as they've been moved sixty miles away from the place they lived before going to prison each time. I was able to plot it on a map and it made a perfect triangle. Nice work resettlement, there's only a few places left where he could go next at that rate.

This person would be safe around older people because they are only interested in older kids and teens. Just keep them away.

The CPS can't always proceed if there's not enough evidence or if the victim isn't able to give evidence. Fortunately in the case of someone like him who is known for previous offences, they put him away. How long for is anyone's guess. He's not the only one and I'm not comfortable naming.

I once went for a job that sounded good on paper and was horrified to learn that it was as a carer for pedophiles. There are many warped people so we just need to make sure we encourage good boundaries in our young people and know where they are. Make sure they are strong and not prey.

Well well, this makes "interesting" reading...So basically only a person with a "proper interest" can complain to the Clergy Discipline Measure... www.churchofengland.org/about/leadership-and-governance/legal-resources/clergy-discipline

If you are abused in any way you either need a witness, or to be a church warden, on the PCC or the Arch Deacon (otherwise no one gives a damn)

That explains a few things.

That is indeed an "interesting" link.
I am not in c of e, but I will have a good read of it.

As the link says, it is the start of a legal process.

I'm not either but I googled to find it.

[Hmm] I might have to start carrying my mobile phone more in certain places. There are some things that shouldn't be happening.

No surprise at all. Pervert hiding amongst the cloth nothing new.

I didn't listen to the radio program, I researched my own information.