Howard's End

the final irony is that it is Leonard Bast's son who will inherit Howard's end. The penny hadn't dropped with me on that one! So there was a point to the whole tale after all. I watched the film years ago and never got that bit.... thanks Jalima

Glad it wasn't just me. So shutters closed meant Helen was about to jump on Leonard, right. I was rather hoping it was the younger Wilcox son who fathered the child before leaving for Africa! He and Helen ran hand in hand through the gardens in a carefree idyll one afternoon.
The ending looked like one of those Fields of Barley Cancer Appeal commercials.
What was the significance of the crimson flowers at Mrs Wilcox's funeral? Obviously a huge faux pas but why? Only white flowers 'the done thing' at Edwardian funerals? Mr W said it might be 'a foreign thing'. Those flamboyant Germans with their gaudy tributes, eh?

BTW I think Leonard had his wicked way with Helen
DannieRae I thought that it was Helen having her wicked way with Leonard!!

Mr W's view of getting the sister locked up would have been the accepted one for that time and long afterward Yes, trisher, sadly, and there she would have remained in an asylum probably for the rest of her life and the child adopted. It's not that long since women were released from asylums after years having been sent there because they fell pregnant, I can remember it.

Spoiler alert for looplooo - don't read!

I'm not sure about Margaret wanting to be in control; she had been left at a young age to bring up two much younger siblings (albeit with plenty of money to help), so perhaps a great sense of responsibility rather than control? She manages to change Mr Wilcox's attitudes and, of course, the final irony is that it is Leonard Bast's son who will inherit Howard's End.

Gosh - I must have gone for a pee and missed the bit with the shutters!

Yes, closing the shutters was the clue. Old movies showed a train going into a tunnel, or waves crashing on the seashore!! These days you get to see practically the whole performance with nothing left to the imagination. Ugh!
I need to watch the last episode again as there was a lot of detail crammed in and I think I missed bits. But it was well done, well acted and very enjoyable.

Did I miss an episode when Helen became pregnant or was it so subtle that I missed it?
It was left to our imagination which makes a nice change from what is normally shown in the media - as Eglantine21 says, the closing of the shutters and we are left to assume that they then make love.

I think the 'all change' mood at the end is Forster's nod in the direction of oncoming war. Charles is in prison and the younger son (name?) expects to go to Africa. The reason Henry doubts if he will get there is that he has a feeling that war is coming - he has mentioned this previously. This signals the end of the Edwardian era.

Leonard and Helen had sex in the bit where she was in their rooms and Jacky went to bed because she was ill. Helen and Leonard stood by the window and Helen symbolically closed the shutters. Very subtle. The reader/viewer was meant to be as much in the diary as Margaret and Tibby until the moment of revelation.
Margaret stayed with Mr Wilcox because he was a broken man and she was able to take charge again and order everything her way, including his eventual separation from his family and the claiming of Howerds End by her family.
I have always thought of it as a study of a fight for control and how Margaret wins by making others dependent upon her under the guise of love and support.

It seemed acceptable for Mr Wilcox to have an extra marital relationship with a young working class woman, but his family is shocked when a respectable working class man makes an educated woman pregnant. Charles Wilcox then defends the honour of his family!
I was amazed that Margaret did not stand up to her husband more robustly - for example about where they were going to live. This was the era of the Suffragette movement and Margaret would, I'm sure, support the principles of equality for women.

What a mess ! I haven't seen it yet but I am prepared! Glad it's recorded so I can replay it if I don't understand something. Think it shows its not a good idea to mix with woolly headed liberal intellectuals. Either if you are the landed gentry or the working class.

That's what I got as well-DanniRae -the hotel bit.
I think Mr W was clearing things with his family. He had obviously suffered a major blow and changed his lifestyle. I thought it showed how attitudes have changed so much. Mr W's view of getting the sister locked up would have been the accepted one for that time and long afterward. Thought the acting was great and it was so well filmed. Brilliant!

I have just watched last night's episode and feel very confused?? I got that Leonard Bast was the father (eventually) but one minute Margaret and Helen were going to Germany and M was finished with Mr Wilcox - next they all seem to be living at Howards End (I presume). Why was Mr W saying goodbye to all his family? Are they all going to live together happily ever after? Is he ill?
BTW I think Leonard had his wicked way with Helen when they all stayed at the hotel after she took Leonard and Jacky to the daughter's wedding.

Yes - Mr Bast was the father; hence Wilcox's son bashing him up (egad sir! - deflower a woman would you!?) and inadvertently killing him. It highlighted the double standards current at the time very well. To us it just seems barmy that he would take it upon himself to defend the honour of his father's wife's sister! - especially as there seems to be no suggestion that she did not cooperate at the time of the conception!

I got slightly confused at the end when Wilcox's family were all saying goodbye to him as though he was about to drop dead - anyone know what that was about?

I also felt as if I had missed an episode. Some uncomfortable attitudes and practices were highlighted, I wonder how many Margaret’s there were to take a stand . It left me a bit unsettled.

I assume Mr Blast / Blaste was the father. Too many gaps and jumps. I shall have to read the book. DH couldn't watch it as Mr Wilcox infuriated him too much!

I thought she said Leonard Bast was the father.
I assume the fact of the son going to prison caused Henry's fall into health decline.

I assume that the little boy was Bast’s child? DH said “have we missed an episode?” I ended up admiring Margaret immensely for her stand against Mr Wilcox’s attempts to have Helen removed, presumably to an asylum? I wanted to thump him! As SueDonim said, it was beautifully filmed.

I was confused too, especially about the pregnancy, but then I was only half watching. I still enjoyed it.

Watched the final part last night and still not really sure what happen. Who was the father of the little boy does any one know the answer?? confused.com!!! lol

I was a bit confused, too! Still, it was very nice to look at.

Never read it but now feel I should! Did I miss an episode when Helen became pregnant or was it so subtle that I missed it?

An unsettling ending.
Not what I expected even though I've read it a couple of times in the past.

The poor clerk guy [Mr Blast?] is SO Dickensian.

I thought the point about Mr Wilcox was that he has brought home to Margaret the reality (and perhaps the hypocrisy) of her own situation. Her income comes from people like him and although she tries to improve social conditions she benefits from his actions. She also thinks he has a hidden more caring side. And the sex of course!

Yes there is always that!