A very English Scandal

Well said Eglantine, a girl can choose to go to university, join the armed forces, join the police force, be an apprentice bricklayer , a cleaner, but if a girl chooses to be a topless nightclub hostess or a sex worker she is a victim of men.

So you do equate topless night club hostesses with prostitutes Annie. What about the Windmill girls who appeared completely nude were they?

Yes that’s right ab you've got it at last

Girls who work in night clubs are no different to girls who work in supermarkets (although they may be paid better!)
Because they are all girls does not mean they all have the same personalities. And we are also, to some extent, a product of our upbringing.

Women are not an homogenous mass. Thank goodness!

^ How can ‘we’ be poorer for the loss of the upper class hypocrite JT? ^
Because he was a brilliant politician, revived the Liberal Party, an advocate for human rights and all of this (which may not have happened 20 years later) resulted in a great loss to British politics and Liberalism.

Perhaps you are too young to remember maryeliza. I was a supporter of Jeremy Thorpe and I well remember the feeling of being 'let down' and, in fact, quite devasted, when all this came to light.

It was due to originally be aired just after the verdict - but when he was acquitted the BBC pulled the programme and said all copies should be destroyed but Tom Mangold managed to keep a tape and then transfer it to a DVD which survived his dog trying to eat it!
Yes, Welshwife, that was the Tom Mangold documentary which, again, is of its time, but not the recent drama which, of course, has had no input from Jeremy Thorpe himself.

that not only was Shakespeare less than historically accurate
well I never

You’ve just described a scenario of exploitation ab.
I moved to London in the 1960s but didn't work as a topless hostess

Because you chose not to Jalima just as some girls choose to. It is a choice .

Maryeliza’s reply to Annie illustrates perfectly the point I was making about the attitudes of some to sex workers.

For reasons of their own they find it impossible to believe that sex work could be a choice made freely. The same choice that other people make when they have a talent; when using that talent gives them pleasure and satisfaction in being able to do something well to the benefit of others. To be able to use that talent to make a good living is a bonus.

Now if I was referring to hairdressing or care giving or nursing nobody would say that everyone who does any of those jobs has been coerced or exploited.

Those who assume that all sex workers have somehow been forced or manipulated into their job only reveal the contemptuous attitude they have towards those whose choices are different to their own.

And perhaps for them the impossibility of believing that some people do not find sex repugnant!

Its as ridiculous to think that all sex workers make a free choice as it is to think they have all been manipulated or forced. What is certainly true is that there is sex trafficking of especially Eastern European young women.

Interesting Parliamentary report on sex workers publications.parliament.uk/pa/cm201617/cmselect/cmhaff/26/26.pdf

A tenant of one of our flats was a sex worker. She was the best tenant we ever had. I know many people have an image of what a sex worker looks like, but believe me, never in a million years would you have put that label on her.

Annie said (ironically) if a girl chooses to be a sex worker she is a victim of men and you, Maryeliza said that’s right you’ve got it at last.

So you were the one that said all sex workers were victims.

I dispute that.

Well I don't know about any one else but I don't have an image of a sex worker - I know they are a very varied group from heartbreaking drug addicted 15 year olds from E Europe to self sufficient women who have made real choices.

Belle du Jour or Brooke Magnanti who wrote Diary of a London Call Girl in The Guardian a few years back, was a children's health research scientist

Bit of a u turn there, ME?

The fact that some people choose to do something does not negate the fact that in the course of doing that thing- be it sex or any other transaction they may be exploited. I posted what happened to Christine Keeler in a photo shoot. Her early history reveals she survived abuse and family break down all factors which may have made her vulnerable and open to abuse. Instead of speculating about sex workers who may or may not be there by choice it might be good if some posters could start looking at the actions of the men involved and consider who suffered more.

Not at all - I was talking about the CK etc scenarios and and I still believe they were victims

Exactly trisher I wonder how many of us would have accepted our 17 year old dds making that 'choice'

Profumo lost his job, Keeler wrote a book

Anniebach is quite right, they were not ‘vulnerable’ ( oh that word is thrown around right left and centre!)
They enjoyed their life, does anyone think they would have preferred working in a factory or shop?
Plenty of girls who had hard upbringings then would prefer the factory or shop, being at the higher end of prostitution isn’t everybody’s lifestyle choice, but it was
Their choice.

I repeat Annie said if a girl chooses to be a sex worker she is a victim of men. You said that’s right ab got it at last.

She wasn’t talking about CK then.

No, you can’t dodge it. It’s there in black and white.

I suppose you could ask to have the thread pulled......

Everyone has to be ‘a victim’ now, it’s beyond ridiculous.

Of course you are right lemon whatever were trisher and I thinking of.