I Feel Terrible

I am sorry that this has upset you. Lockdown is fraying adult and children's behaviour sometimes. However your daughter needs to take part of the responsibility here, not abdicate in a petulant manner. Hopefully she will calm down soon. I think you should apologize about the shouting one off incident, but when the dust has settled, you should say you are worried that the behaviour has become a habit and could hold her back at school. Your daughter could also tell her children about the things they may not do while at Nanny's house, screaming being at the top of the list, this case, and tell you want the agreed sanction is.

It sound like she needed telling off! Obviously how her mother is treating her is not working! Your Granddaughter is coming across as quite spoilt thinking she can do as she likes....and by throwing a strop she can get away with it!
Your daughter needs to put a stop to this behaviour otherwise your Grandaughter will not be liked when at school.

Dont let her get away with it. What a naughty little girl. Hold firm grandma

Well at 5yrs old she deserves a good telling off for unnecessary screaming. And your daughter stressful as times are in lockdown should be grateful you are looking after her.

Goodness me, beautybumble, are you aspiring to sainthood? You have a little one who has learned to manipulate adults by screaming and who needs to learn when enough is enough. Your daughter needs help to devise strategies to manage such behaviour and you need a break. It’s easy to know that you should be calm and detached, much harder at the end of a tiring day. I like the mother who put a screaming toddler the other side of a door so that they could only annoy themself - worth a try.

My AC accepted that I had to be able to discipline the GC when I was in charge; DGD2 has always been confrontational and manipulative and laughing at her antics was an effective way of defusing the situation since she hated not being taken seriously. It was then possible to find out what had triggered the outburst and talk about it. At 15 she is still complicated and not always easy but she likes clarity so she and I get on well.

I would tell her if that's all it takes to look after her own kids.

As far as I can see, you are well out of it!
I have 2 children, now grown up and both were diagnosed with Autistic Spectrum Disorder and my son also with ADHD in their younger years. I had no family support whatsoever as my own mum passed away before they were diagnosed. She had been ill for many years before she died, so even babysitting wasn't an option.
My husband and I had to bring up 2 very difficult children with zero support and that took its toll on us and our relationship, both mentally and physically!
My daughter who is now 29, has always denied her condition, in spite of it causing problems for her all throughout her schooldays! On 12th January, she gave birth to her first child, a little girl! Whilst I am delighted, I have concerns that my little granddaughter will turn out to be autistic too! She has already been diagnosed with a congenital heart murmur, so you can understand why I am concerned. I don't have a very good relationship with my daughter. I suffer from very severe arthritis and osteoporosis and also depression. She is totally lacking in empathy and is often quite nasty to me!
That being the case, and given my experience of bringing her and her brother up, I will be carrying out my grandparenting duties from a distance! ? No way am I getting involved! Fortunately, she lives over 50 miles away from me so it's easy for me to keep my distance!
I do sometimes wish I had a better relationship with my daughter and that I could be involved more with my little granddaughter, but for my own sanity, it's better that I stay out of the way! Good luck with your situation - I hope your daughter will eventually see sense! xx

I think your daughter is over reacting at what is quite a normal reaction to a screaming child. She was after all making a lot of noise and you needed to be heard over it! I'm sure you probably shouted at your daughter when she was a child.

I don't think you need to apologise, just explain that when your GD is in your care, in your home, you need to be able to deal with any tantrums or bad behaviour as you see fit, and that may necessitate raising your voice sometimes. Children also have to get used to hearing raised and even angry voices or they won't learn to cope with them. Tell your daughter to calm down and deal with her daughters tantrums, and remind her that she will be losing your valued child care.

I most certainly shouted at my children and fully expected that their GPs, other parents, neighbours, teachers and perhaps strangers would also shout at them if they were misbehaving. If someone raises their voice to a child there is usually good reason for it. Don't feel guilty about it.

I don’t blame you for what you did - think many of us would do the same. Curious though as to why she resorts to screaming at 5? Little ones scream because they can’t articulate but at five she should have language skills.
Maybe shes treated as ‘the baby’ so acts like one?

I’m sure your daughter will soon forget about it. Most of us have been there. My husband and I looked after my granddaughter for a day and as soon as mum was out the door she went absolutely crazy - a real meltdown which nothing would help. Unusually for my husband who doesn’t like to interfere took hold of her gently and said I a very loud cross voice ‘stay in the hallway until you can calm down’. Ten minutes later she was sitting on his lap playing a game! Her extreme tantrums lasted until she was around five - I believe that she couldn’t process all her emotions and was an intelligent child that got frustrated as mind and body were not yet in sync. As grandparents we are usually older and wiser but looking after children is exhausting and sometimes frustrating - we can all lose it on occasions .

Sara1954 and Lin663 are spot on.
And don`t feel guilty either,it`s your dd`s loss in the long run.

Very sensible replies here beautybumble. Don’t feel guilty, this child needed telling off, she’s learned that screaming gets her what she wants. Time your daughter learned to take charge but that’s for her to learn. If she comes back asking you to do childcare again I’d set the ground rules and tell her you won’t put up with screaming and disrespect from your granddaughter. The child will be a lot happier with boundaries too. This modern child centred parenting has a lot to answer for!

I agree with everyone else in here. Shouting at a child that persistently screams, is almost like giving her a taste of her own medicine. I’m afraid if your daughter is refusing your help just because of that, it may explain why she has a child that behaves in that way. I would gently voice your opinion to her...don’t feel guilty...when she has actually calmed down, she may change her mind about needing you.

Your daughter will come round as she needs you. Xxx

Totally with you. Children do have to learn at some stage that you can push too far and it has consequences.

It probably did the child good.I remember our Mother she only had to raise her voice and we did as we were told, she never shouted, neither did we.

Been there too but it does come good again. The kids will eventually realise that they cannot control the house by screaming. It’s a ‘phase’ and all kids seem to find one obnoxious phase to go through!!

My DGD lay on the floor in Asda and screamed so I moved the trolley around her, carried on walking to the end of the isle and hid round the corner, once her audience had gone, she got up and came to find me!
I have helped with childcare for 10 years, if I get pushed too far I shout, kids need to know when they've gone too far. For years I've been threatening them with an invisible stick, it's become a family saying "get granny's stick" obviously I haven't got one and they know it but now if my DS steps out of line I get a shout out "granny bring your stick, daddy's being naughty". They are my darlings and I love them.
Do not feel guilty, your daughter is lucky to have you share her burden of childcare, it's not yours it's hers, so relax, as soon as she needs help she'll call. Don't let children manipulate you.

I haven’t read all the comments, but it seems to me absolutely OK to loose one’s temper with a child. Children need to see normal human reactions. Emotions are not the privilege of children.... and showing anger in the appropriate situation is healthy, as far as I can see. When emotions have settled it will be time to talk it over with the child and explain that “ when you did ....it made me very....” Emphasis on the inappropriate behaviour rather than on the child is the key.

My GC was a screamer and I was told parents were to do the disciplining. As an ex-teacher, I found it difficult to accept the tantrums but did so never intervening. Until parents wanted to do a quick trip out alone and GC kicked off in another room. I went and explained where they had gone and would be back shortly, still, it went on.
So I practised what I would have in the classroom and a very firm loud voice explained they could come to me when they had calmed down. Eventually, the child did, got on my knee and had a cuddle.
Of course, GC told what had happened to parents and I was told in no uncertain terms not to do what I had done it was old-fashioned and not practise now.
I accepted and said over to you but no more childminding unless and repeated a phrase "My house my rules, your house your rules".
Subsequent visits to their house showed that the tantrums still went on even at school. Though in my house they were non-existant with me and only started when parents were around.
Leave it to your daughter if she wants to have a demanding naughty child with her when we can eventually shop let her. She'll soon change when she gets shown up, or like mine be ruled by demands and get phone calls from school when they are open.

I should add the other siblings just stood and watched.

Or OP could try this method.

www.youtube.com/watch?v=6v3wYEnYKrs

Don’t worry! I am sure if she is such a handful our daughter will soon relent and let you look after her again, just for a bit of respite!

My granddaughter was the same and would tantrum and hold her breath until blue. I used to put her on the floor in a safe space and tell her to come join us when she was finished.
Most of her life everyone has accommodated her rather than her have a huge meltdown and she nearly always got her way. My grandson who is gentle and loving adored her and also gave way to her. Much as I love her to bits, I don’t think that this has worked as she finds it hard to make friends as a teenager and hates school.

Sooner or later they come across people that aren’t going to worry if they scream and shout and they then find this very hard to deal with. They need to know that not everyone is going to let them have their own way and it is easier to learn as a child rather than as a teenager.
We all get exasperated and wish we had dealt with things better but try not to worry. It will all work out in the end.

My granddaughter and I love each other to bits!

But PaperMonster- the GD is being naughty, to a certain extent, as I'm sure her sisters not doing this as well, to 'let her emotions out' so she's doing it to get her own way, and her mother clearly lets her get it by doing so! - you haven't committed a crime Beautybumble by letting her know she cannot get away with that tactic with you. Your DD will probably come round when shes had to put up with it herself for awhile, with NO BREAKS from the screaming,-(breaks which were supplied by you)so just rest assured it will 'all come out in the wash' and enjoy the rest in the meantime- its just such a shame that its spoiling it for your other, poor long- suffering GD, as it sounds like the younger one is mean to her as well.Time will show this up to your daughter.maybe she will have to get a proper childminder, who wont tolerate this bad behaviour, and will tell her so.?

Get Beyond Toddlerdom: Keeping five- to twelve- year-olds on the rails by Dr. Chris Green, an Australian Paediatrician. It's full of good common sense. I have bought his other book, Toddler Taming, and this one for various people who were struggling, and they have appreciated the practical approach, which is not harsh, but is full of grandfatherly wisdom, as well as his experience as a paediatrician. Even if your daughter will not apply a calm consistent approach to discipline, your GD will soon realise what is expected at your house, and she will feel more secure for it!

I used to look after my friend’s daughter one day a week. She was a whiner and a screamer. Every time I told her “no” she had a meltdown. I sat her on the stairs with her blanket and a toy and proceeded to vacuum the whole of my downstairs. Checking she was okay (surreptitiously of course) every few seconds. By the time the vacuuming was finished she had calmed down and we enjoyed the rest of the day.
She is now in her early 30’s and has become a mum herself. Whenever we meet she laughs about how horrid she was.