Prince Andrew latest.

eazybee I see you missed the vital words...she was to report on "the sexual ABUSE" ,Women who cant see the issues of young girls being controlled by rich powerful men and USED area mystery to me.I take it you would be happy to see your daughter treated in the same way? Abuse starts with CONTROL ,then the victim cant see the abuse for what it is .What a sad individual you are

eazybee what an unpleasant remark that was about a trafficked girl who suffered, in your words sexual abuse.

For Monarchists trying to push 'bad apple' theory of #princeAndrew...

The palace have been completely supportive of him & unwilling to help the
@FBI

The Queen proudly awarded Andrew a medal when scandal broke.

@RoyalFamily
are hidden from scrutiny by state enforced secrecy

Well done @Channel4News who reported on the Prince Andrew scandal. As far as I know, the only UK TV channel to do so.

More unpleasant photos of Windsor beginning to emerge.

Not my words; quoted from the deposition made by her lawyers.
I would not describe her as a trafficked girl; as I understand it a girl who went willingly and knowingly into whatever it was she did while in the employ of Epstein, with the knowledge of her parents. I do not know how long she worked for him or what she was paid, but again it is my understanding that she was not coerced and could have left at any time.
What Epstein did was depraved and he was rightly being pursued. But she, having already received an undisclosed sum from Maxwell, and thwarted in her intention to claim money from Epstein's estate, is now pursuing others involved for more money. She may well find herself prosecuted for conspiracy to blackmail.
Would you have behaved as she did, aged fifteen, and older? I know I would not, and that is how I judge her.

eazybee

Not my words; quoted from the deposition made by her lawyers.
I would not describe her as a trafficked girl; as I understand it a girl who went willingly and knowingly into whatever it was she did while in the employ of Epstein, with the knowledge of her parents. I do not know how long she worked for him or what she was paid, but again it is my understanding that she was not coerced and could have left at any time.
What Epstein did was depraved and he was rightly being pursued. But she, having already received an undisclosed sum from Maxwell, and thwarted in her intention to claim money from Epstein's estate, is now pursuing others involved for more money. She may well find herself prosecuted for conspiracy to blackmail.
Would you have behaved as she did, aged fifteen, and older? I know I would not, and that is how I judge her.

What a good job you are in the minority then.

The girls were groomed and raped.

The pattern was repeated time after time.

Girls from poor backgrounds promised the Earth including a good education.

But - the job description as described by Maxwell was quite different to the reality.

It keeps coming back to the question of why PA won't give a face to face interview to the FBI - they have previously said they are willing to travel to UK as he is obviously reluctant to travel to US.

eazybee that was a truly contemptible remark to make about a woman who when still a child was manipulated and controlled by older powerful people. In a statement she said the first time she had no idea what was going on, how to deal with it or how to get away.

Would you say the same about the young girls abused in Rochdale because they were given gifts and drugs, or is it different in the case of Epstein and Maxwell because they were rich?

What a good job you are in the minority then
Hear hear.

Why is this girl an innocent yet the teenagers in the PC Harper
case evil ? Her parents approved , their parents quite possibly
approved

You really are clutching at straws now Anniebach - two entirely different cases. Those boys in the PC Harper case chose to go out to steal, they were aware he was being dragged by their vehicle and were reckless as to what would happen to him.

These young girls were groomed, manipulated and abused - they did not seek out Epstein and Maxwell and expect to be made to have sex with older powerful men

I am not clutching at straws , I ask why the teenage boys who
probably have been raised from birth to steal etc are evil yet
this 15 year old girl is an innocent.

I could not hold my head high if he were my father.

Charleygirl5, why on earth should his kids be ashamed. They have absolutely no control over what their father does. I speak as someone who has just discovered her father is a peadophile and will go to prison for a long time. My mother is distraught even though they divorced when I was a very young child because she chose someone like that for my parentage. What he does, does not define me in any way at all. That old saying about the "sins of the parents" not being visited on the children should hold true.

Anniebach

I am not clutching at straws , I ask why the teenage boys who
probably have been raised from birth to steal etc are evil yet
this 15 year old girl is an innocent.

Sorry but all your posts seem to be in support of PA. Is this correct ?
Agreed he has not been officially found guilty as yet but things do look quite damning, if only as regards his continued friendship with Epstein.

Annie - yes those boys may have been raised to believe stealing was a way of life - those girls were not raised to believe having sex with older influential men was a way of life, so yes you are clutching at straws.

It seems you are prepared to blame anyone and everyone - except PA. I think he needs to sit down with the FBI in a face to face meeting in order to answer their questions as a WITNESS. His reluctance to do so merely encourages speculation that he has something to hide.

No Lucca no way do I support Andrew , he is not unofficially
guilty, no one can be unofficially guilty . I don’t know the truth
of the allegations, I do know he chose to fly to America to meet a man who had served a sentenced for sexual abuse , this
cannot be supported or excused.

I have doubts about Ms Guffrie, and I don’t see any difference
between ‘wealthy men’ or the man in the street or in his own
home who sexually abuses , much emphasis is given to ‘wealth’.

My personal feelings about the murder of the police officer , any police officer in line of duty are personal, those teenagers
were brought up to know no other way of life , are they too
victims ?

Before anybody completely denigrates PA and the Royal Family beyond all measure, it is worth reading Malcom Gladwell's, "Talking to Strangers." and, particular, the chapter about some of the abuse cases which have taken place in the States. Our default position regarding what we believe is apparently one of trust so it is possible that PA, the Royal Family, etc believed that Epstein was innocent of any charges or that they weren't as bad as they appeared. Equally, as unlikeable as Virginia Giuffre is she could have been experiencing that default position regarding Epstein herself as would her family. From the outside, it looks clear cut but it probably isn't. Clues missed from PA and VG would have led them to behave in a way we don't necessarily understand.
The only thing I wonder about is that VG's original testimony did not name Prince Andrew but just spoke about somebody she believed to be Royalty. Now she is adamant it was PA. We also only hear about the stuff the press want us to hear which can skew matters.
Personally, I don't think PA does come out of this well and I think he should co-operate with the authorities if only to put this matter to bed.

Anniebach

No Lucca no way do I support Andrew , he is not unofficially
guilty, no one can be unofficially guilty . I don’t know the truth
of the allegations, I do know he chose to fly to America to meet a man who had served a sentenced for sexual abuse , this
cannot be supported or excused.

I have doubts about Ms Guffrie, and I don’t see any difference
between ‘wealthy men’ or the man in the street or in his own
home who sexually abuses , much emphasis is given to ‘wealth’.

My personal feelings about the murder of the police officer , any police officer in line of duty are personal, those teenagers
were brought up to know no other way of life , are they too
victims ?

Thank you replying Annie.

Ms Guiffrie said ‘ I was horrified and ashamed ‘ after her encounter with Andrew in 2001,’you can never forget the face of someone who has heaved over you ‘ . Yet she kept the
photograph

She most probably in the back of her mind determined to keep photo to eventually expose PA and get justice for herself the many others. Good this has been brought into the open.

Anniebach, so following on from your assertion that the thugs who killed the police officer could be excused because of their upbringing; it follows then that all criminals, rapists, torturers, war criminals and murderers can be excused their crimes because of their upbringing. Therefore, no one is responsible for their actions because they know no better. REALLY!

No Bluebellwould I compared teenage boys and teenage girls .

Grany* she kept the photograph for 14 years to expose Andrew ? A very clever 17 year old wasn’t she , wonder why she didn’t
keep photographs of all the others she was forced to have sex
with.

When this was first discussed on this forum a letter was posted
in which she had written to Epstein explaining she was going to start a new life in Australia

Her father said in an interview ‘she is a very good actress’

Anniebach

Why is this girl an innocent yet the teenagers in the PC Harper
case evil ? Her parents approved , their parents quite possibly
approved

To ask that question shows a lack of understanding relating to grooming, power and trafficking.

Anniebach, if an excuse works for teenagers, why won’t it work for every age? After all every adult was once a teenager.

I don’t think Virginia Guiffre was that innocent. If you read her background she was probably quite streetwise but being very poor could have been tempted as a means of escape from poverty. Whatever that does not excuse those who took an underaged girl and abused her. She was not underage with PA in this country but she was over there. Okay maybe she is scheming to get some money but maybe she thinks she deserves it and maybe she does.