Son and DIL won't see me any more

Please dont tell me your daughter has a poa on you

Your poor DS.

I’m sorry, but where’s your backbone? You allowed your husband and daughter to treat you and your son appallingly.

Don’t expect your feckless daughter to support you when the money runs dry!

Why is your daughter dealing with your medical appointments from her work email and phone? That sounds suspicious in itself.
Have you given your doctors permission for her to liaise with them on your behalf?
Amongst all the other paperwork she handles on your behalf, have you maybe signed Power of Attorney forms without realising it?

You really do need someone in an official position to take a long hard look at your affairs.
Solicitor? Adult social worker?
Someone with your best interests at heart.
But whatever you do, do not, repeat not, tell your daughter first.

Please let us all know how you get on. Your situation must be such a worry to you and people do care.

Asdf Below are some quotes of things you have said and a lot of questions for you to consider. I truly do not want to upset or offend you but I hope that you can be truly honest with yourself in answering these questions and that maybe that will help you to consider what is happening in your life at the moment. I suggest that you get counselling so that a counsellor can help you to work through some of these questions and others that may arise.

IF you can do that then you might get to a point where you might be able to address the justified problems that have arisen with your son/DIL, who understandably are struggling to have a relationship with you as things stand.

1. You say: I'm worried that I may have given the wrong impression of my dd to people on here I feel like I've bad mouthed her when she drives me to the shops, has been throwing away things from my house, does the garden and arranges for any work needed on my house to be done. She also deals with my medical appointments from her work email and phone. She helps me do these things even though I don't ask her and don't need her to

- So WHY is your daughter doing these things even though you don't need her to?

*Why aren't you doing them if you are able to?
*Do you want the things from your house thrown away?
*Do you EVER have any involvement in arranging YOUR own medical appointments?
*Do you EVER decide for yourself what needs doing around the house and arrange it yourself?
*Do you EVER go to the shops alone or are you always driven to and accompanied by your daughter?
*Do you have your own Bank debit card, credit card?
*Do you withdraw your own money from the bank or does your daughter do that?
Does your daughter "take care" of your debit card/credit card or have cards on your account?
*Do you receive/see bank statements?
*Do you know how much money is in your account?

After your husband died why did DD ...*take charge of my house and finances throwing things out and making decisions
*Did you truly want her to? If so was that because you felt incapable and/or anxious of being involved in those things because your husband had always done them?
*WHY are you not making those decisions about YOUR finances, YOUR decisions about YOUR life?
*Does your daughter make you feel incapable and/or anxious about doing these things because she "takes charge?"

2. You say: It was already very difficult for her when I used to visit my ds and gc once a week and she was left out. She would say I was off playing happy families without her and she felt that perhaps I would have preferred dil as a dd and not her

*So WHY is your daughter isolating you from your son through emotional blackmail.
*WHY is she is making you feel that she will estrange from you ...how is she doing that?
*Is it loving to isolate you from your son?
*If SHE chooses to estrange from you whose fault/choice will that be?
*Will she tell you it is your fault for seeing your son when it makes her (your daughter) feel bad?
*Do you believe it would be your fault? WHY?
*What will she do for childcare if she chooses to estrange from you? Is that your problem or is it hers?
*WHO is making you feel in the position of choosing between your 2 children? Is it your son and DIL OR is your DD?

So many questions so I will stop there?
I really hope that you can answer these questions, and any others that arise, being truly honest with yourself!

Asdf You are completly in thrall to your daughter. You ditch your son at every opportunity whenever you daughter threatens to estrange herself. You live with her half the time, you let her control your finances. On every occasion, when she says jump, you jump. The fuss she makes when you visited your son and grandchildren is pure emotional blackmail and indeed, I would say its purpose was to effect the very estrangement from your son that you now have.

^ I'm not choosing dd for any other reason other than how would she cope alone? She has nobody else.^

That is the weakest excuse I have ever heard. Your DD will manage perfectly well on her own if she has to. Tens of thousands of women in her position, when faced with managing on their own do so.

This claim that she 'needs' you is all part of the emotional blackmail aimed at separating you from your son and ensuring she has complete control over your whole life.

Anyway, taking control of your own finances, finding your ownadvisors and therapists, will not affect the help you give her nor the help she gives you

You also say She also deals with my medical appointments from her work email and phone. She helps me do these things even though I don't ask her and don't need her to.

Read that aloud to yourself 20 or 30 times, what does it say. It says that your daughter manipulates you like a puppet on a string. All you need to do, is tell her it is kind of her to do all this for you, but you are quite capable of doing this yourself and in the future you intend to do so.

I will give you credit for having the courage to come back time and time to this thread, even though what we are saying here is often very hard, even brutal.

It is obvious that you really are looking for a solution to your problem, but you are now a widow, the real problem in your life is not your son, but your daughter.

She has taken over your life under the guise of 'helping you'. She has undermined your confidence by offering and doing everything for you; doctor's appointments, finance, therapy. She constantly tells you that she knows more than you do, can do things, more easily, gradually bit by bit she is deskilling you and undermining any confidence you have in your ability to run your life, down to things as intimate and personal as your health and relationship with your GP.

I know you want a solution that restores your son, but does not upset your daughter. Quite simply that is impossible, and the reason that is impossible is because your daughter is the problem and has actively worked to get this estrangement.

There is only one solution. You have to take back charge of your life. Start with medical appointments and their like and refuse to tell your DD any details of them, other than a bare minimum. Then seek therapy. Just talk to your GP or somewhere like Age UK or the Citizen's Advice. Do not say anyhthing to you DD until you have got it arranged and started the course of therapy. Then gradually take charge of your finances. Check your bank statement every month, ask for details of savings and investments. Tell her firmly that you want to run your own life, she has more than enough to do being a single mum.

If necessary employ a firm of accountants to check everything to see if it is as your DD has told you.

There is only one solution. You have to take charge of your life and make your own decisions and there is no way you can do that without cutting the strings your DD uses to manpulate you.

There is one alternative. Shrug and just accept that your son's estrangement is the price you have to pay for an easy life.

It’s not clear how long the estrangement has gone on - it may well be too late if the OP’s son decides it would be too painful to resume contact.

It sounds like your daughter (and late husband)has financially abused you. I would get your paperwork together and see a solicitor. We can't actually help you. I'm not surprised your son is upset for gods sake, it's not difficult to work out why

You’re still not seeing it OP. Your daughter is playing you, as you have been played all along. She’s in it for herself. Your first post is most likely the ‘real’ one. The rest is trying to justify the actions of someone’s ( ie your daughter’s ) behaviour. Think of this way.
Maybe you need to show her all your posts. If she is horrified, and wants to sort things out with her brother, it will be obvious. I’m willing to bet she won’t be, and will make excuses to keep you apart from your son.
There is a lifetime, in fact probably many lifetimes, of bad inherited behaviour here. For goodness sake break it, and get in touch with your son. You’ll lose him if you don’t. It’s just a matter of time with your daughter too, once she has what she wants.

She won’t “become” estranged, she’ll choose to do that. And I bet you anything she won’t, not if she needs you that much and not if she loves you. Call her bluff and tell her that you’re going to apologise and try and rebuild your relationship with your DS.

Excellent post Sparkling, could not agree more.

I cannot understand you going along with everything your husband and daughter did. It seems your son has been sidelined his whole life. You can see what your daughter is, do you want to be controlled or take charge of your own life, only you can decide. You seem to be in victim mode the whole time, letting things go, it’s easier I suppose. I would not allow my son to be put down by his father and sister, I can’t stand injustice. You defended your daughter and your son has done the right thing and left the situation, let’s hope he has a good life with his wife and family, if you want to continue as you are it’s a kindness to let him go, your d and h seemed obsessed with money and possession , your d still is, but at least make a will leaving your house to your son your d has had more than her due.

It seems to me that your daughter is controlling your life. You need to regain control, make your own appointments, manage your own financial affairs. I have a feeling you are being taken for a ride. Why on earth are you spending half your time in her house. You really need to take a long hard look at the situation you are in and have a good think. From an outsiders point of view you are in a very vunerable position. Take the advice given on here and act on it.

I don't want estrangement from either of my dc it's like a living grief I miss my DS and his family but it looks like I have to choose and I'm not choosing dd for any other reason other than how would she cope alone? She has nobody else.

Your poor, poor son.

After all that has been done to him, he has only asked you to acknowledge how he has been treated. Nothing more. And rather than do that, you have chosen to abandon him.

As a mother to two boys, I don’t understand how you can turn your back on him like this. I don’t understand how you can love one child more than the other - you can rationalise it to yourself however you wish.

Your poor, poor son.

Asdf You really should not cut one child off because the other is jealous. Your dd has to accept you have two children and are entitled and want to see both of them. That should not stop you looking after your Gc unless she uses that to deny you contact, unlikely because that would make her life more difficult.

Your dd is an adult- she can cope with life, trust me.
She has kids, she is not alone.

Your relationship with your son is none of your daughter's business.
If she asks you to choose between her and her brother - red flag.

* If I reconcile with my son, like I want to, but then I have to address the issues with her then she will stop talking to me too.
It was already very difficult for her when I used to visit my ds and gc once a week and she was left out. She would say I was off playing happy families without her and she felt that perhaps I would have preferred dil as a dd and not her.*

Your daughter is not a good person. And if you’re happy with her then it’s your life.

But you have chosen her over him then and you won’t be able to have a relationship with him.

You need help. Independent help away from her.

I have been reading all what has been said. My mum and dad were really good, they loved eachother and despite their age they were not old fashioned. They had a happy marriage and were not bullies.

I'm worried that I may have given the wrong impression of my dd to people on here I feel like I've bad mouthed her when she drives me to the shops, has been throwing away things from my house, does the garden and arranges for any work needed on my house to be done. She also deals with my medical appointments from her work email and phone. She helps me do these things even though I don't ask her and don't need her to.
If I reconcile with my son, like I want to, but then I have to address the issues with her then she will stop talking to me too.

It was already very difficult for her when I used to visit my ds and gc once a week and she was left out. She would say I was off playing happy families without her and she felt that perhaps I would have preferred dil as a dd and not her. I want a relationship with both of my dc but if she becomes estranged, she has nobody. At least my ds has his wife and children. He also has close friends. Dd has no friends nearby they've all moved away. She would have no childcare either, she earns too much to get government help with childcare and I know someone said about me being paid. She gives me £200 per month. I have my gc during the day until her father arrives and takes her. Dd is home from work and has had a chance for a break by the time he brings her back at 8pm

I don't want estrangement from either of my dc it's like a living grief I miss my DS and his family but it looks like I have to choose and I'm not choosing dd for any other reason other than how would she cope alone? She has nobody else.

M0nica

I agree with both your posts.

It is likely the OP witnessed a similar dynamic between her parents which she has gone on to recreate in her own marriage, and I too am not convinced that she is prepared to do what is needed for reconciliation with her son.

I feel terrible sadness for the OP’s son. If anything positive can be taken from this, it would be that he goes on to break the cycle with his own children.

Her future is in her own hands, and that includes reonciliation with her son and family. But, I emphasise, she is the one who is going to have to do all the hard work, and I am not sure whether she is prepared to do it.

I think they need too listen. I don't think it is ever too late to change your ways and be a better person. Sometimes it is easier to stay in denial and pretend everything is fine but if you do that it causes problems for other people unless they stay away. So if they are happy with their life then you have to let people who aren't happy in the relationship go. One day being surrounded by the wrong people will bite you and that is very sad.
I would have been the one too look after my mum if she needed it. The family who have taken her side will not do that as they are very selfish.

Ps...if you are still there OP, I do hope this has all been helpful to you, and wish you well.

I think the long and short of it is...no normal person would choose to be unpleasant and cause problems for others, particularly your own children. I can understand someone finding themselves stuck in a situation they would never have knowingly planned. Victims come in all shapes and sizes. I doubt the OP would have aired all this on line, particularly as a first time poster, unless she was desperate, or just winding us all up, which happens I know. I always like to give someone the benefit of the doubt as much as possible. If nothing else, it’s given us all an interesting topic to discuss.

That is certainly a possibility M0nica however anyone can fall victim to a manipulative, controlling and coercive partner. Being raised in a family "where there was a dominant and bullying parent" will not necessarily be a factor in all cases.

In this coercive control/ enabling discussion, at no time have we been given any indication as to what sort of family the OP grew up in.

If she grew up in a family where there was a dominant and bullying parent, it is possible, that this disengagement and indifference to the sufferings of the weakest link (a son with a medical condition) is a coping mechanism she learnt in childhood, and inexorably led to her marrying a domineering man and continuing this behaviour as an adult.

Discodancer1975

I understand what you are saying, however, it is not true of all enablers. They are not all coerced and many do chose to enable abuse for many reasons. And, in some cases where extremely sadistic individuals are involved, it can often be a partnership.

Anyway, I am now going off topic.

I don’t think that the OP is sadistic, but nor do I think her perception is so warped by coercive control that she believes the treatment of her son is normal. I don’t believe that for a second.