Grandparents rights

Well that last sentence made me smile. Reminds me of a comment my sister made about her late mother-in-law "She was always fine but once she came round and wiped a chair before she sat on it"
Well done for holding out on mothers day.

Surely the answer to all this- and some posts are TOO LONG = posts are not BLOGS. Any way. Why doesn't Nan or Grandma visit every two or three weeks?
Most if us do not see our GCs every week, even I don't and I live ony 15 mins drive away.
If you only have the two days with your child/ children then this is really not much for a child and a bit more socialising with their own family must be beneficial. Be firm with Gran and don't think she has any chance of winning a court case. On what grounds? Grandparents would like to have rights but I am not aware that they do, except in death or where the parents cannot look after their children.
Hope it works out. Compromise is the word!

I agree with Charlotta. She has summed it up nicely.

Hard to believe!! The pure hell of seeing my grand daughter born and enjoying seeing her for 9 months to have it all stopped overnight, the tears shed and pure hell still going through, it is not about respecting the parents wishes, we are human beings and it is our flesh and blood too - what about our human rights and respect for us the parents in our case who have done everything for our daughter inc helping buy their house, putting her through uni for 4 years and supporting her totally in desire to have family to be cast aside like a dirty rag and put through this hell, so far we not gone downcourt route but feel will be the only way to see our little grand daughters again then we will after 3 years of pure hell, no Inbetween you are definitely not a grand parent to talk like that!!

I'm sorry for the state you are in but it doesn't help to keep on about your rights when in the eyes of the law you have none. That is what rights are. Legal rights; the rest of us have responsibilities and duties etc but it is not in the Bill of Human rights for grandparents to over-rule the wishes of parents. where would that lead us?
There must have been something that the parents didn't like in the way you treated your grandchildren. Perhaps too permissive. perhaps you spoilt them I don't know and I don't want to go there. Your daughter seems to be a thoroughly spoilt person according to how you describe her. I have money but have not financed any houses, only education for my children. I don't believe in spoiling children or grandchildren.

I think you need professional help and I can't give it you over GN. You need to talk to someone and get rid of this hate and anger, in the end it might make you ill.

anneandgraham that must be a nightmare for you. I am so sorry.

I didn't know we were limited as to the length of posts - not everybody has the experience or ability to write pithily and I am perfectly willing to read any post and give the writer the chance to express themselves in their own way.
Neither do I agree that grandparents must have done something wrong to be denied access - jealousy can work both ways and perhaps some parents resent the fact that their children love their grandparents so much. I don't think it is our place to pass judgement, just to listen and give advice when asked.

Grandparents don't necessarily do anything wrong to be denied access - they are useful pawns to hurt when one parent or the other wants to wreak revenge or exert control.

The posts are not too long - we all have the freedom to write as long or short a post as we want - readers have the choice to read or not.

Inbetween in your post you say:
'.....sunday dinner it has been accepted once where they then continued to moan about the cooking little did they know it was my partners cooking and they tought him! So he was very upset that day. '

I don't understand why you wouldn't say that your partner had cooked the dinner? Why be upset in your own home and not feel able to assert yourselves, or make a joke? I would have said 'don't you be pulling your face at the cooking when you taught him to make this lovely food ha ha!'

How has it come to this, that you are all treading on eggshells round each other, and engaging in games, instead of you being open and honest and giving them an opportunity to apologise and start correcting the mess it's turning into? Have you thought that they may be as confused and upset as you are? It comes to something when you are interpreting their behaviour because they have left an open newspaper to send you a message about court.

If they won't engage in a discussion, send them a reasonable letter, setting out what you need from them and clarifying the boundaries. They'll probably retreat to lick their wounds, but if they really want to see their grandchildren, they'll grit their teeth and crack on with getting it right before they get much older.

We never say who cooked dinner does not seem something that should need to be said however its expected that I do, when nanny her self cannot cook much more than a pizza but sits there moaning about how the veg is cooked, how the potatoes are cooked and the meat all the while my partner is feeling worse and worse about his cooking when he is a great cook better than me but dont tell him that!

Ive tried to joke about things when they have done something in a dont be silly way or a kind of turning the tables but into a joke way but I just get a sour face back at me.

The newspaper is because we have seen the newspaper closed and will say we are going to get a glass of water and nanny will run though to the kitchen and open the paper right next to the sink.

We have my partners sibling often texting or moaning about nanny it seems the whole family just let her do as she pleases and then moans to everyone else yet my partners sibling will then in the next breath defend her so much.

A letter sounds like a good idea since they would prob read it due to the fact they did that to my partner when we got engaged a 3page letter telling him he was a failure and a idiot for getting engaged to me and was wasting his life with me. I think that was the day my partner kind of gave up and saw her for exactly how she is as their relationship has never been the same since.

Sorry for my long posts Charlotta but is it not best to try and say as much as possible in one post rather then little bits here and there?

She will just have to like it or lump it if she doesn't accept a reasonable letter from you, won't she 'inbetween'? If she does decide to comply, start as you mean to go on, present the dinner and say 'I/he cooked it, we like our food, but you're welcome to make a sandwich if you don't.' Leave them to fit in with you and don't accommodate her behaviour any more. Good luck!

There are always two sides to a situation - I know that we must all sympathise with Anne and Graham in their sad situation, and I do not think that anyone is suggesting that they are to blame. No-one can truly get inside another's head, and and there is always history that we do not know.

Anne and inbetween are two sides of the problem and it is interesting to everyone to get these different perspectives.

All we can do is support inbetween in her efforts to get this right for all the family - it cannot be easy and if getting it off her chest in this forum helps to lighten the situation and give her strength to deal with it (perhaps a bit lightheartedly might be the way forward!?) then that is good - however long the post.

And we can give Anne our support and make sure that she knows we understand her sadness - but we do not have the answers to what is clearly a complex situation that has been ongoing for some time.

For my part it makes me more appreciative of the good relationship I have with my children and GC - I do not think I have done anything to deserve it and could just as easily have been in one of these difficult situations. There but for the grace....and all that.

Mishap - I don't know why you insist there are always two sides to any situation when it clearly is not true. Do you think there are two sides to it when a man beats his wife, or parents abuse children? Some people are just treated very badly without any just cause and it really doesn't help to be told that it must be 'six of one and half a dozen of the other'.

I get the impression there are two sides to inbetween's story, but I agree with Greatnan there aren't alwys two sides when one side is being abused and cruelly treated and the other has done nothing to incite, trigger or justify that abuse. There is no justification for treating other people cruelly.

inbetween are you never tempted to simply tell her where to stick it.

You sound very patient. You are trying a lot harder than I would.

in drug abuse and violence there are not two sides but this seems to be a difference in parenting choices and it is not too much to expect that this family who are blood relations should be able somehow to find a way to come together again.
The first step must be to ask where you yourself are perhaps going wrong. Both sides just pointing fingers does not move this family forwards. What is done is done and can't be undone.
The next question is how does this family move forwards as they remain related to one another and will come together again one day.

I am sure there are situations where both sides have made mistakes or have some kind of personality clash - I merely objected to the statement that there are always two sides to the story - it simply is not true in every case.

Hi, First post here so forgive me if I get the conventions wrong.

I totally agree with those here who have said that GCs have a right to a relationship with their Grandparents. In the sad cases where family break up or whatever means that contact is cut off I can understand why Grandparents would want to fight this. It would break my heart not to see my GCs and I would fight with every ounce of my strength for that contact.

This is not the same as saying that I think I have the right to have that contact all on my own terms, when and how I want it and that the parents just have to give me what I want.

I have a very different relationship with my Daughters son than I do with my Sons two children. This is because that is how the parents want it. My daughter's son stays with us often when they are going out or in school holidays when they work and we love every minute. But he is still their sone when he is with us and we play by their rules. (Well, more or less a little spoiling now and then slips in!!)

My daughter in law has her own family near her for babysitting and, although I don't think she has a problem with us, she is less ready to let her children come to us. We do get to take them out for days sometimes and they do bring them to see us and we go over but it is different.

I would love to have the same close relationships with sons children but it is not what their parents want so we work with what we have. We do have a good relationship with them but we are not such an important part of their lives.

The only time I got frustrated was when my son told his sister that he is a bit jealous of the relationship her son has with his Granddad!!

As a young Mum I could easily have found myself in a similar situation as Inbetween but I was lcky because my MIL lived 500 miles away so it was a once or twice a year thing. I know I would not have tolerated it so I can hardly complain if my DIL wants to do things her own way, and nor would I wish to. (She is lovely by the way)

Sorry if this is too long, put it down to inexperience.

Welcome Meercat - you set out the complexity of different family relationships so well, and as long as everyone can be flexible and collaborate in the interests of the children, that's all we can ask for. Your post is not too long at all.

I think what I am saying greatnan is that we have only heard one side of the story - I have great sympathy with inbetween as the situation sounds dire - but we have no idea what the gran in this situation might say. I am not saying that it is "six of one etc." - we have no way of knowing whether that might be the case because we have not heard the other side. There is indeed, as Carol says, no justification for treating others cruelly.

And I guess that 25 years of social work makes you realise that people who seem utterly irredeemable often have histories themselves that have damaged them. That does not mean that I condoned their behaviour - I have met abusive parents, who were themselves abused - that does not excuse their behaviour and protecting the child comes first, but it does help to explain it and to influence what you do about it.

I sincerely hope that inbetween is able to find some way of dealing with this impossible-sounding situation, and I am not suggesting that she is at fault in any way. But she is clearly asking herself whether there might be a better way of dealing with the situation that will help her family to feel more comfortable and I admire her willingness to seek the advice of other grans on this forum.

Just got back on here, Meercat you sound like a great nanny/granny can you come me my childrens? Everyone needs to be some whaat flexible and I understand the want to spoil like a few too many sweeties and stuff like that.

Im going to go with the inviting them to our house and if they dont want to come round then that is their issue not mine and if that becomes the case I will then write a letter to them and hope to clear the air and state what me and my partner want in relation to our children and that if they are not willing to play fair so to speak then access to the children will only be at our house/family gatherings and when we want/have the time for it not what they want.

I was not expecting the relationship to be this bad as all of my family have always atlest appeared to get on with inlaws/grannys/nannys etc sometimes better than their own direct family.

Hopefully this will all get sorted in a way and then I wont have to keep imposing on all you lovely ladies.

I do not think that it is seen as an imposition inbetween; I hope that some of the comments from the assembled grans have been of help.

It is good that you have come to a decision as to how to proceed. Nothing is going to wave a wand and make it perfect, but at least you have a plan of action now and your MIL will know that you mean business and that your primary concern is the wellbeing of your children.

These sort of family problems are a minefield and it must be very frustrating for you to be in this situation when all you want is for your children to have good parents and grandparents and for the family all to be pulling together.

But you have been dealt a difficult hand with this particular person and all you can do is exactly what you have done: set your priorities, make your position clear and stick to your guns. It is never likely to be easy, but at least you know what you think is best and can set off in that direction - with fingers crossed! Good luck!

If just one family has avoided denying the grandparents having contact with their grandchildren, that must be a good thing? Good luck inbetween

inbetween I took time to consider my behaviour as a grandparent.
I can truly say that I never made demands to see my grandson.I was available for babysitting,picking up from school etc,didn’t give advice,talk about my ‘rights’ or make criticisms of my daughter-in law.
My GD(160 miles away) I only see 3/4 times a year .Other gran lives nearer so sees more of her.I accept that.
After my son’s divorce I saw less of my GS- only in my son’s contact times.
For over a year now I,my son and family have been denied all contact with my grandson due to conflict between my son and exDIL. It’s been a heart-breaking year for me but even more so for my son,who at times has felt suicidal.He’s been to court but is still denied contact because of lies .
Dads have few rights -_Grandparents have no rights_
That is the current law. Our local support gp states that _
Grandchildren’s rights are most important.
I have seen my MP.had a letter from Hon.Michael Gove MP sympathetic but little hope of a change in the near future.

I’m sorry you are feeling angry and distressed.
My Mum and in-laws were far way from us,so saw my children at holidays or if they came to stay for a few days. My children missed out on Granny-time.
I wish I could persuade your parents/in-laws to treasure and make the most of the time (how ever little) with their grandchildren.
Two thoughts occur.Could you persuade them to join Gransnet? or move further away!!
Best wishes

Maniac (((hugs)))

This post more than any other has made me reflect on my relationship with my grandchildren and their parents who live abroad. I realise I have always wanted to see the children and hear from my daughter on a weekly basis(on Skype I mean) but I have spoken to my daughter twice and had an email twice-in response to information on how I was collecting the children to look after them in the summer. I understand I think a lot more about my role in their lives from reading this.