cut out of thier lives 2

Counselling is getting a bit of a kicking here, isn't it? My friend's daughter told her mum that the counsellor told her not to have contact with her parents a few years ago. They were devastated and didn't know where to turn. A few months later, when said daughter was stabilised on her medication for bipolar disorder (hitherto undiagnosed until counsellor raised the topic of previous contact with a psychiatrist and they discussed whether returning for an appointment might help), the daughter turned up to stay with them out of the blue, and gradually unfolded her explanation about the past year or so (worry about qualifying, exams, relationship, health etc) and corrected her statement about the counsellor, who had said no such thing about dropping contact. It's useful to hang what we want to say on the counsellor in order to save face, if we don't yet feel assertive enough to speak out, if we don't feel we'll be listened to unless it comes from someone else, or if we're just in a bad place and need some respite to get our heads round what's been happening in our lives/the past. In my friend's case, she and her husband recognised that they had inadvertently been expressing expectations of exam success and their daughter had got it in her head she would be rejected if she didn't pass with flying colours, which they hadn't said or believed - their attempts to bolster her up and say they believed in her abilities got distorted, but they went along to two sessions with her and as a family they cleared the air.

My point is - don't attribute negative outcomes from counselling to the counsellor - they are there to enable the person to work out what they can do to move forward in their lives.

Thanks to Penstemmon and When for some positive comments about the way in which individuals and families can be helped to move forward in situations that had been causing real distress to all concerned. Seeking help for psychological distress is a positive move, as When's example of her friend's family demonstrates.
Mediation, joint counselling, therapy, family therapy etc, all potentially positive in helping families in distress. The action of one family member, seeking help with their feelings about estrangement from children/parents/siblings, can be the first step towards reconciliation. This demands a lot of everyone of course.

no i dont think that counselling is getting a kicking its what we have experienced hence our comments....true it can work out for some ..i also think a lot depends on the counsellor and how good they are... as librachick so rightly said things get distorted and taken out of context....

Those of you that find St. John's Wort helpful have every reason to have faith in its efficacy as it is recommended by the Royal College of Psychiatrists for mild to moderate depression. This is because it has been subject to properly controlled trials. Of course it won't help everyone, but neither do the most rigorously tested antidepressants help everyone. It's important to find what works for the individual and even if something works by placebo effect alone, so what? The mind is a weird and wonderful place. Good wishes to all of you suffering so much hurt by those you love

Counselling is only as good as the counsellor qualifications vary enormously and of course personalities.

I wanted to try cognitive approach but really did not like the counsellor tried online to find a suitable one as am not eligible for nhs apparently ! Give up In The end. Apart I from the expense I just could not find a suitable one.

If only our estranged daughter would suggest or agree to any form of mediation but she and her husband steadfastly refuse.

Smileless well done on 4lb loss! I am. T doing well am I ?

Gosh we had difficult day yesterday trying sort out my beauty room, cleaned all massage oil containers sorted oils the nail polishes all in Colour order found some eyelash tine developer wrong. Place turned to get something off couch knocked entire tray nail polishes off 2 broke all over carpet! Omg my long suffering husband had nipped to swim pool as they found my earring when he returned I Ranted on but together we managed to lift stain with nail polish remover loads cotton wool the shampooed carpet nightmare !

Still we went our meet good friends to rejoin social club last night enjoyed natter and showed them letter we posted to daughter last week. They have known her since she was born and wrote to her themselves whenshe sent the. Xmas card about 3 years ago returning it with lovely letter saying they could not accept card while she was treating her mum and dad so badly.

Penstemon and whenim are you actually in position of being estranged from family? Agree with libra chick our posts must crossed.

I do know you had a short time not seeing your grandchild and happily it was resolved for you whenim

Sadly it is vastly different for some of us.

Again - St mJohn's Wort is very efficient, and tested, but it does interfere with other medications, like Tamoxifen and statins, which said tests acknowledge. Always check!

I experienced being separated from a much loved grandchild for long enough to remember those feelings of despair, helplessness and yearning that are described on this thread, celeb. Those feelings will stay with me for life, and my heart goes out to anyone put in the same position. I have started a couple of these threads myself, if you look back over time. I think the help from counselling, family solicitors, mediation, family contract centres, Cafcass and others can be invaluable in resolving many cases. My ex-DIL would not engage in mediation and remains embittered and willing to sabotage the regular contact we now have with my grandson. Parental alienation was the main issue in our family, and I researched the legalities and possibilities of overcoming it until I was falling asleep over my computer, such was the depth of my despair at the situation I felt I had no control over. I'm lucky because my grandson is now that bit older (nearly 14) and able to speak for himself. So, in answer to your question, I do think I have something to contribute here from personal experience. I wish I hadn't because I know my grandson suffered from being kept from seeing his dad and me, and it has taken effort and much reassurance to help him catch up with schoolwork and begin to accept that his mother's threats that he will be homeless, or his dad will forget him, had no foundation.

Let's not get into questioning whether posters on this thread can legitimately put their view. We all have something valuable to say.

Yesterday, I received my copy (Amazon) of Dr Joshua Coleman's 'When Parents Hurt'. I've read a good bit of it already and in a way, realise that how I've been dealing with DD's and my estrangement has more or less been the 'right' way. There's a chapter towards the end where it says that sometimes it's something we have to accept, but nevertheless letting the adult child know that you love them and will always be there for them. I think the book might be helpful.
No other family members or friends have been involved in my efforts to have a reconciliation with my DD. I felt it was wrong to involve them because it was about her and me.

Whenim please don't take offence no one doubts you went through hell at one point all I am saying is it is vastly different when you have no hope like. Myself that is a very dark place to be.

I know people say there is always hope but 5 years 2 births not told about it is a horrid horrid situation.

I am lucky have a wonderful son and some like libra chick is her only child that is beyond awful.

It is all about support and empathy and I have found tremendous support from people on here including yourself.

I am Sure whenim these centres and mediation is excellent but when the other party steadfastly refuses any form of mediation it is not an option sadly.

Celeb I was responding directly to librachick who said her DD had said she was up for counselling if she went.

I was merely saying I thought it was worth a go. Anything in my opinion is worth a go if there is an outside chance that it might help!

Your situation appears extremely difficult and I empathise with you not seeing your family. You have made a choice to share your situation on a public forum so it is not appropriate for you to then imply that other forum contributors should not offer comments.

I'm not estranged from my DDs or DGCs but I have had experience of of supporting a close family member with mental health illness & of using counselling. The whole point of counselling is to help face yourself as others see you and sometimes that is very uncomfortable but it really can help to heal a situation.

But I do not think my personal experience has to match someone else's before I can give an opinion or make a genuine suggestion to offer support. That way would close down forums like this overnight!

celebgran I would imagine that some members might very much appreciate hearing on this thread from others who have come through a period of separation and reached some resolution. Many of us have had fallings out and/or other separations from family or struggle with relating to our adult children happily.

Penstemon I am entitled to say what I want as you point out is public forum.

There are guidelines of common courtesy we would hope.

I am taking a deep breath and my life into my hands but I would like to express my own opinion about some threads at the moment, including this one. Or perhaps "ask a question" .
Is it right that any member should be challenged for their eligibility to contribute to a thread? I can hear the hurt expressed by the members who contribute most to this particular thread and I do not wish to cause any offence. However, surely the way forward and support with finding it, is what a thread like this is all about? And anybody's legitimate contribution is valid . I am trying to choose my words carefully because I am not sugggesting that flippant or irrelevant comments would add anything and could be offensive or hurtful.
Anther growing fear I have is that some threads have become "exclusive" - a comfortable meeting point for a handful of individuals. Nothing wrong with people in a similar situation supporting each other, of course, but with respect, do accounts of "what I have done today" not belong on our well-loved ToadyI thread? perhaps I am alone in feeling that it has become something of a private club or chatroom for a few members .

Celeb no-one has contravened any guidelines of common courtesy, have they?

i dont think anyone has deliberately been challenged in any way on this thread...a lot of threads can be so called 'exclusive' because of the actual content...so what if it looks like a meeting place for a handful of individuals who are going through a very bad time with a similar situation to deal with..theres nothing wrong ie of accounts of "what I have done today" i for one think its nice to know that grans are coping while under durres..

many forums can seem like a private club or chatroom for a few members...ive noticed on several threads on gransnet where its the same people posting...people have a choice to join in if they wish it doesnt make the threads exclusive...

whenim64 and penstemmon were directly challenged in this morning's post of 9.22
If I may quote:
"Penstemon and whenim are you actually in position of being estranged from family? "
A challenge like this leads one to think that the thread is not welcoming to other members when this is a response to comments designed to be helpful. The plethora of posts which are exclusively addressed to a small group of individuals further reinforces the impression that this is a chatroom for an exclusive group or "in crowd". Could this not deter new members with a similar problem?

i wouldnt call that a direct challenge it was more a question!...

it does appear from your recent posting that you are the one thats challenging ...

Sorry, dollie I thought I had chosen my words carefully so as not to offend but to instead ask a question and express an opinion. I did not anticipate that exception would be taken but I do not think I was alone in seeing that question addressed to whenim and penstemmon as challenging their right to comment.

Sigh!

That was not a challenge but a question surely? Let's all take a step back and remember the very real hurt of those who have lost a child or a grandchild either for ever or, hopefully, not for ever.

Peace......please.

Penstemmon, my D does not want to go to mediation counselling with me, she wants me to go to counselling and then she will come along and tell me and the counsellor what a bad mother I was/am.

Without repeating myself again, this is short……I have never been a bad mother, she has not been abused any in form whatsoever, she had a very privileged upbringing. She is currently going to counselling and I feel that she is distorting and taking things out of context. Her father was there the whole time she was growing up and he can’t understand why she is behaving the way she is towards me, even he says I was a really good mother. She still sees and speaks to him.

Grans, well I came on to this thread and it looked a little exclusive, but I thought, it was just people with the same issue as me, so I commented, it did not put me off at all putting my post on. I can’t see the problem in saying how your day has gone, it is grans with the same problem, and they got to know each other. Who say’s what you are allowed to say on a thread? I think everyone needs to take a step back, we all have enough on our plate without adding any more angst in our lives.

Is it possible to get counselling without the son or daughter being there? On the NHS I mean.like Libra I thought I had done my best. Perhaps a counsellor might show a way forward. I would like to try.