Trans Teacher

Well said Doodledog, and an excellent example of how quickly we assimilated all the buzz words and phrases during Covid.

If we as adults assimilate such buzzwords so quickly and easily, how much more so must young children, and the influences and half-baked ideas behind them.

Delila

If we as adults assimilate such buzzwords so quickly and easily, how much more so must young children, and the influences and half-baked ideas behind them.

Yes, and the more so when the phrases are used in an educational setting at a time when children believe much less critically than when they are older.

Delila

Doodledog (today 10:29) I absolutely agree.

FarNorth, I have two outstanding questions awaiting an answer from Glorianny, going back several days.

But Glorianny has now declared that her definition of a bully is anyone who questions any thing she posts.

I evidently haven’t missed much, by working and G still hasn’t answered questions I asked about her posts. Probably FONBATAT.

She’s also said
I'm afraid I will now ignore any comments you make about any research, your reading is obviously completely incapable of objectivity.
So we are to understand that, IHO, only her own research is of any use.

Well I'd simply ask what would you say to a two year old who insisted as soon as she could talk that she was a boy? His parents managed it very well. Would you have insisted he was a girl, entered into arguments every day with him and persisted in getting him to dress as a girl and be called a girl's name, no matter how upset he got?

It's fine setting your preferences out and criticising what happens, for you it is purely hypothetical but there are real parents coping with real children every day.

And sadly some of these children die.
www.brightonandhovenews.org/2023/09/19/trans-people-let-down-by-extraordinarily-long-nhs-waiting-lists/
www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-oxfordshire-65624233

Mollygo

Delila

Doodledog (today 10:29) I absolutely agree.

FarNorth, I have two outstanding questions awaiting an answer from Glorianny, going back several days.

But Glorianny has now declared that her definition of a bully is anyone who questions any thing she posts.

I evidently haven’t missed much, by working and G still hasn’t answered questions I asked about her posts. Probably FONBATAT.

She’s also said
I'm afraid I will now ignore any comments you make about any research, your reading is obviously completely incapable of objectivity.
So we are to understand that, IHO, only her own research is of any use.

Mollygo you don't seem to have noticed that I stopped answering your highly abusive and offensive posts some time ago. There is no requirement on GN for anyone to respond to another poster. And certainly no point in trying to enter into a dialogue with you.

I would follow NHS guidelines which is not to do social transition.
I would explain that ideas such as dress like a girl are stereotypes. Actually the only long term study shows that suicide rates seem to increase after surgery so I would be very very careful. We know there are real parents lots of them are currently taking legal action against the tavistock.

Er and its not hypothetical for some posters as they have talked about their own family with regard to this issue.

Galaxy

I would follow NHS guidelines which is not to do social transition.
I would explain that ideas such as dress like a girl are stereotypes. Actually the only long term study shows that suicide rates seem to increase after surgery so I would be very very careful. We know there are real parents lots of them are currently taking legal action against the tavistock.

Oh yeh! A two year old screaming he's a boy is bound to take careful note, and agree that following NHS guidelines is absolutely the way to go.

I very much doubt that a 2 year old as soon as she could talk would declare that she was a boy. She'd have no concept of what being a girl or a boy means. Do you have a link to anything that supports this has ever happened *Glorianny?

Oh dear, I've asked a question. I do hope that doing so wont be misconstrued as bullying.

Some evidence please Glorianny that this has ever happened with a 2 year old.

I have no idea how I would respond to a two year old saying she was a boy. My understanding is that children are just learning about pronouns and so on at that age, and they often say things like 'when I was a boy' if they have a baby brother and so on. They are still learning how they fit in the world, so the idea that they are unhappy with their sex must be very unusual.

I don't know what I would do - probably much as the family did when my nephew insisted he was Hercules. We humoured him until he grew out of it. If the child didn't grow out of it, I'd think again, I suppose.

Glorianny

Mollygo
Delila
Doodledog (today 10:29) I absolutely agree.

FarNorth, I have two outstanding questions awaiting an answer from Glorianny, going back several days.
But Glorianny has now declared that her definition of a bully is anyone who questions any thing she posts.

I evidently haven’t missed much, by working and G still hasn’t answered questions I asked about her posts. Probably FONBATAT.

She’s also said
I'm afraid I will now ignore any comments you make about any research, your reading is obviously completely incapable of objectivity.
So we are to understand that, IHO, only her own research is of any use.
Mollygo you don't seem to have noticed that I stopped answering your highly abusive and offensive posts some time ago. There is no requirement on GN for anyone to respond to another poster. And certainly no point in trying to enter into a dialogue with you.
No Glorianny, and your lack of response saves you having to answer questions about what you post

Meaning there’s no point in trying to enter into a dialogue with you either.

I have known of very young children preferring to dress as children of the opposite sex, and parents have obliged, but with no coercion of any kind, it has proved to be a passing phase.

Are you advising people to go against the current guidance.
Sone of the children I work with become very very distressed about not being allowed to run across the road I dont just decide that road safety is optional.
This is in no way criticising any decisions made by parents I think they have been badly let down. The information on suicide and the way it has been used has been horrendous.

So have I Delila but a 2 year old girl, screaming insisting she's a boy, I don't think so but if Glorianny has evidence to support this then of course I'll accept that it has happened.

Smileless2012

I very much doubt that a 2 year old as soon as she could talk would declare that she was a boy. She'd have no concept of what being a girl or a boy means. Do you have a link to anything that supports this has ever happened *Glorianny?

Oh dear, I've asked a question. I do hope that doing so wont be misconstrued as bullying.

Sorry real case, real child, friend of my GD. Saw him at toddler groups. Lovely parents a bit overcome but doing their best He has a sister 2 years younger who is a happy girl.
Course there isn't a link. It's real life.
Believe me or not. I don't care. But it says something about a philosophy when the only response is "that couldn't happen".

He's changed his name to a boy's and is accepted at school as a boy.
What the future holds who knows? But his childhood has been as happy as the parents could make it.

I'm not sure I follow your last couple of posts, Glorianny. You are talking about a two year old screaming she's a boy, and say that she has said so since she could talk (she must have had an unusually complex vocabulary for a toddler) but your link is to teenagers who died after delays inning referred to MH services. Whilst undeniably tragic, waiting lists for MH services are very long across the board, regardless of the reason for referral.

Are you suggesting that if a parent mishandles a situation where a baby is saying she is 'in the wrong gender' it could lead to suicide?

I am not sure who knows what will happen in the future is the greatest approach, that is the criticism that is levelled at this approach, in that there has been little if any long term follow up.

Which philosophy says that it couldn't happen?

My experience says that it is unlikely that a 2 year old could articulate something like that uncoached, but as I said, my nephew was convinced he was Hercules - he was more like 4 though, and had seen the film. I don't have a philosophy though - do any of us? I just think for myself.

Glorianny

Smileless2012

I very much doubt that a 2 year old as soon as she could talk would declare that she was a boy. She'd have no concept of what being a girl or a boy means. Do you have a link to anything that supports this has ever happened *Glorianny?

Oh dear, I've asked a question. I do hope that doing so wont be misconstrued as bullying.

Sorry real case, real child, friend of my GD. Saw him at toddler groups. Lovely parents a bit overcome but doing their best He has a sister 2 years younger who is a happy girl.
Course there isn't a link. It's real life.
Believe me or not. I don't care. But it says something about a philosophy when the only response is "that couldn't happen".

He's changed his name to a boy's and is accepted at school as a boy.
What the future holds who knows? But his childhood has been as happy as the parents could make it.

But that may have nothing to do with any concept he may have of gender.

It could be that, at 2 years old, he has seen a new sister arrive on the scene, everyone cooing and making a fuss of the new baby girl.
So his toddler mind decides he wants to be a girl like her because he thinks they love her more than him.
Perhaps he's had his nose put out of joint, poor little boy.

Best to use a common sense approach first rather than think he wants to change gender.

So we have
It couldn't happen
Don't know what I would do
I'd stop it, like I'd stop a child running across the road.

Strange how you are happy to proletise about what language should be used, how wrong organisations are, how children are indoctrinated, but have nothing positive to offer parents struggling to cope with transchildren

What are you offering them Glorianny. I would like them to have support which is based on long term research as at every step of the way it has gone wrong. Puberty blockers are harmless, oops that's not quite true, social transition is harmless oh maybe it isnt.

Sorry Glorianny I'm confused. If he has a sister who is a happy girl 2 years younger, the sister is only a baby so what does that have to do with it.

You said at 2 years of age this little girl declared she was a boy so no, I don't believe it and it has nothing to do with a philosophy, it's beyond reasoning that at the age of 2 a child would know the difference between being a boy and a girl.

A very articulate toddler indeed Doodledog.

Callistemon21

Glorianny

Smileless2012

I very much doubt that a 2 year old as soon as she could talk would declare that she was a boy. She'd have no concept of what being a girl or a boy means. Do you have a link to anything that supports this has ever happened *Glorianny?

Oh dear, I've asked a question. I do hope that doing so wont be misconstrued as bullying.

Sorry real case, real child, friend of my GD. Saw him at toddler groups. Lovely parents a bit overcome but doing their best He has a sister 2 years younger who is a happy girl.
Course there isn't a link. It's real life.
Believe me or not. I don't care. But it says something about a philosophy when the only response is "that couldn't happen".

He's changed his name to a boy's and is accepted at school as a boy.
What the future holds who knows? But his childhood has been as happy as the parents could make it.

But that may have nothing to do with any concept he may have of gender.

It could be that, at 2 years old, he has seen a new sister arrive on the scene, everyone cooing and making a fuss of the new baby girl.
So his toddler mind decides he wants to be a girl like her because he thinks they love her more than him.
Perhaps he's had his nose put out of joint, poor little boy.

Best to use a common sense approach first rather than think he wants to change gender.

Baby arrived quite a bit after he'd announced he was a boy.

Not a lot of language requirement. I boy! or more usually xxx(girls name) boy!!!