The RNHS?

GG3 Don’t you think there’s a danger that if Royal Patronage was given, there’d be an unedifying outcry against it, on the grounds that a) they weren’t instrumental in starting the NHS and b) they don’t use it themselves?

That’s not an anti-Royal comment, nor does it imply that I don’t value the amazing work done by NHS staff of all grades.

I think you’re being very unfair to Grannylaine. Anyone who is self-isolating and adhering to the social distancing requirements is fighting the virus.

I did say Janeainsworth that it didn't have to be my suggestion but no one has come up with another one. Perhaps a medal could be struck rather like the campaign medals that are given for different theatres of war.

I really don't see what your points a) and b) have to do with it. In fact, I find this idea that royals should be involved in that way rather odd.

The Queen, whether you or I like it or not is the Head of state. No one expects the Head of State to be personally acting as a road crossing person before they award such a person with an award such as a medal. Nor would they be expected to have stood, week after week, in Wootton Bassett before they give it patronage. It's a bit of a straw-man fallacy as arguments go as this isn't about the head of state but the people going above and beyond and no, although I feel incredibly sorry for someone with the wretched disease, I don't think it compares.

Are you simply saying the NHS staff have not done enough - or more to the point will not have done enough, to be honoured for their role? That's an opinion but not one I would share and it would surprise me if many did.

Don’t put words into my mouth please GG3
Over and out.

And try reading other people’s posts before you go off on one.

I don't believe I have janeainsworth. Perhaps you would like to explain that accusation.

I texted my SIL to tell him thank you for what you are doing. His reply

It’s my job

Legend

And try reading other people’s posts ...

I did.

... before you go off on one.

I did not go "off on one" as you call it. The insults are certainly flying from your posts though, aren't they? I wrote a carefully thought out answer. It is, however, beginning to look as if your only argument is a personal one.

Resounding no from me.

So do tell ,how exactly is it an "honour" to rename it with a Royal in front of the great name it has had since its inception.Its not the ROYAL national health service its The NATIONAL HEALTH SERVICE . For the nation by the nation.The royals have begger all to do with it

.Honours are a bad joke these days or haven't you noticed.Given to crooks and folk who throw cash at the government in return for favours or actors and comedians and footballers .Royalty belongs in the past ,lets make that be the case soon..sack them all and make them earn their keep .The NHS could get what we save ..

I agree with you paddyanne. I'm a bit sick of the NHS - and in particular nurses - being patronised. There has been a practice over the years of politicians and the public in general singing the praises of nurses (having events like Nurse of the Year, and so on) but turning their backs when they ask for salaries in line with inflation, proper levels of staffing and decent working conditions.

It is great that people are now appreciative of what NHS frontline staff do but prizes, medals and gushing praise are no replacement for proper pay and working conditions.

I don't think the royal family generally uses the NHS and, in my view anyway, adding "Royal" to an organisation's title has little practical use for the organisation and is more a PR exercise on behalf of the royal family.

GGMK3
1. You propose to change the title of the NHS to the Royal National Health Service. Not many takers for that idea.
2. You then assume that no one wants to show any support for the NHS at 8pm" Perhaps you should wear a tag if you get admitted with the virus saying "Just do your job. It's nothing special "
3. I am baffled by this response as I worked at the sharp end of the NHS all my working life hence my comment that you were a bit muddled
4.Out comes the vitriol
" I have a feeling the "muddle" is your's GrannyLaine and it's incredibly disrespectful to those who are currently on the front line of the fight against the virus where you, currently, are not, from what you say "
I'm not sure exactly WHAT exactly you think is disrespectful as I retired far too long ago to be on the front line but each and every one of us, in all walks of life, are forming the battalions behind those front lines in stopping the spread by appropriate behaviour.

So GGMK3 it's never a good idea to try to make yourself look better by belittling others. I'm calling you out on it.

That is just a bad tempered point of view. Honours are given by the Head of State. All any of you who don't agree have done is spew bile against the existing system. I said it before, this is about honouring those on the front line, in some cases giving their lives. You cannot change the system so what and how would you honour them? It seems many of you would rather diminish the role these people are playing so you can spit your venom about something else entirely.

I think everybody who has had to work under pressure through this awful time, including delivery drivers, shop/supermarket workers, cleaners, etc, etc, etc) should be recognised and appreciated for what they have done.

However, I do think that hospital staff are especially deserving of gratitude. They have responsibility for people's lives and, in the current situation, they are working long, exhausting shifts with several of their colleagues off sick, seeing the most distressing cases - and, because of the nature of their jobs, having a very high risk of catching the virus.

A very practical way of "honouring" them would be to respect their professionalism and dedication by giving them a decent pay rise to make up for the several years in which their salaries have not kept pace with inflation.

There has been a practice over the years of politicians and the public in general singing the praises of nurses (having events like Nurse of the Year, and so on) but turning their backs when they ask for salaries in line with inflation, proper levels of staffing and decent working conditions.

You must recognise Eloethan that this is whataboutism. There is absolutely no reason why, when this historical event is over; when we count the missing in our friends and family, the country, headed as it is currently is, should not in some way recognise those who will, by then, have given so much. This in no way stops that same state giving the salaries and conditions in line with what we expect for everyone.

I do appreciate your honesty in the last paragraph when you give your reason for not agreeing with my suggestion - and it was only a suggestion - your feeling that it would be the Royal family using it as PR.

I don't see the way our state recognises people and organisations in this way - I treasure my father's medals for example and my brother treasures his medals and MBE, as the way they were recognised by the state as going above and beyond for their country. It is at least honest of you to say you would not do this because of your feelings towards the family of our head of state.

I looked up what a patron was before commenting and I don't find any of the definitions applies to the RF and their relationship to the National Health Service. They have never funded, financial supported or used any of its services, so no I don't think it should be the RNHS. Perhaps if they surrendered some of their wealth to buy essential equipment, or actually used NHS services I might feel differently, but whilst they subscribe to private health care they can stay away from our health service,

This was really not meant to be about the royal family and I can't see why you can't get past that. Our head of state is the Queen and until that changes, I think you will find things will go on much as they always have done. Bringing in what they do or don't do is just a "straw man" or "fallacious" argument. If you want to discuss the Queen's family, etc., then why not start a separate thread instead of beating this one up?

This was about how we might recognise those who have gone above and beyond what is normally expected of them after a time which is incomparable with anything except war-time.

I could understand if you were to say it's too soon to think about this; it probably is but state recognition is state recognition and we currently run the state in the way that we do.

Just to add a few facts rather than fictions. Wootton Basset was made Royal Wootton Bassett after the delivery of Letters Patent on behalf of the Queen. Old fashioned or a continuation of our history? I am sure that many will have a different point of view but that is really not the point. This is how we do things.

This was done on a "petition" from the PM, i.e., it was decided by the state. The Queen said it was "an enduring symbol of the nation's admiration and gratitude". The Queen will say what is agreed by parliament. It is nothing to do with the royal family, their wealth, the way they dress or whether they use the NHS. It is simply the way we run our state, who is the head of state, and whether our government decides they want to recognise people, groups, etc. after all this is over.

GracesGranMK3 the best thing that can be done to honour NHS staff when this is all over is to pay them properly, to invest properly in the equipment they need, to reinstate nursing bursaries and to make sure that all privatisation is stopped. I'm sure they would all see these things properly established than have any pseudo recognition or meaningless honour from anyone.

rather missing there

I don't agree trisher. Of course, I believe the NHS should be properly structured, properly paid with reasonable hours of work but that should apply to everyone. To me, that goes without saying and needs to be fought for politically.

You really don't know what anyone will want any more than I do. I doubt those whose antecedents passed down the Pip, Squeak and Wilfred medals from WW1 think of them as meaningless.

What Trisher said. Proper investment and burseries. Proper staffing and well equipped hospitals. That’s the way to show appreciation.

Opinion is overwhelmingly against the op's suggestion.
Instead being so defensive and telling everyone else why they are wrong I suggest you now back off and stop digging!

But that is what we should expect for all workers anyway Parsley3. It does not say you were there and went the extra mile.

Hear, hear mcem

To add insults and a guilt trip to all of us with worries, attempting to care for our physical and mental health I am hoping you will go further than an extra mile!

Er.. the NHS has not been properly staffed or equipped has it? A suitable reward would be to properly invest in it. Ask the NHS staff what they would like in recognition of their extra mile and they probably won’t opt for RNHS.

As I have said quite frequently now Parsley RNHS was only one suggestion. I would have thought that most people would agree the NHS needs a complete overhaul, that we pay people properly and that we equip them properly. However, could you tell me why that would stop us recognising those who have been on the frontline of this exceptional phase in our countries history as well?

The repetition of the idea that we cannot do both when the first should be something we fight for now and in the future is getting a little tedious now.