SUPPORT for all living with estrangement

Oh Derbyshirelass what a palaver! I think in your position I would have said no... but then the thought of seeing the GC is very tempting, I understand. My worry for you is that they have you where they want you.

I also think we have to be careful of our younger son's feelings. Like you, my older son has been (not nice) to my younger son, meaning that my younger son wants nothing to do with him. I don't know the extent of how (not nice) he has been, but trust my youngest as he's easy going until you've gone too far and then you've probably blown it. (Not experienced that myself, but observed!)

I remember the story of the Prodigal son. Not wanting to preach at anyone, but it could be worth a mention that the loyal son was quite put out when the not loyal son was welcomed back.

If my not loyal, not nice or kind son does ask to come Christmas day the answer will be no as his unvaccinated status (and accompanying outspoken views!) will upset the other guests. I would very much love to see GC, but at what cost?

Yes I am thanks Whiff. Had a lovely afternoon making mince pies and listening to Christmas music. Mr. S. has put up the outside lights including our rather large stag, who is so bright, you can probably see the lights from space.

I think we're lucky too. ES is only in touch with his brother who never really mentions him at all now, thank goodness so no mind games for us to play either.

Mind games are vicious to the point they can take over your lives. The people that play them are excellent at getting who they want to join in. Avoid playing to the very best of your ability and hopefully it will get easier to walk away and not 'play'.

Mind games are one of those things where everyone is a loser. Pay backs, regardless of how well deserved, are never worth it when it comes to family. At some point, your estranged loved one might even come to realize you won't be controlled by their games. Might.

The challenge to not react and tolerate other's peccadilloes is a lot more fun and can even be rewarding.

I totally agree with the above comments re the mind games. Took us a while to realise what was happening, but now we are definitely off the pitch as far as our EC is concerned. DBL - really feel for you. So awful to be caught off guard, and because life with estrangement means we tend to walk on eggshells anyway, we can easily find ourselves overcompensating to try to keep things calm. All we can do is learn for the next time. Been to a funeral today - good to be reminded that life is precious and to be enjoyed. Everyone carries some loss in their life, but if we can make peace with this, it doesn’t have to hold us back from enjoying what is good around us.

Mind games take up so much emotional energy don't they Spring. Always on your guard, trying to second guess what may or may not be said and then wham, you get thrown a curve ball which takes you completely by surprise.

I must say DSL that was one hell of a curve ball.

A grey but mild morning here this morning. We have our first concert tomorrow afternoon so I need to get my books sorted out, the carols clearly marked in the correct order.

I've noticed that the concert is described as 'A pleasant Sunday afternoon with the Celebration Choir'; no pressure then.

Will have a practice later and then put it one side.

Yes Smiles it was a quite a curved ball. Just goes to show......you never know what the fates have in store for us. I was taken aback and thrown off balance but I'm ok now. You can't keep a good woman down for long. ?

I never expected 2021 to be as difficult as it has been, thank goodness it's nearly over. I certainly never anticipated that my relationship with my son would become as fragile as it is now. I fondly thought our family was rock solid, that the death of my husband and my sons' father had strengthened the bond. I never thought my DIL would tear our family apart. I made her welcome, treated her like a daughter. It was like inviting a viper into the nest.

Hey ho....lesson learned, chalk it up to experience.

Really bad fibro yesterday. Trawled round Sainsburys, could hardly crawl out of the car when I got home. Rested on the sofa all afternoon, had a good nights sleep and now I've bounced back. Much better today.

This weekend taking it relatively easy, get the rest of the Christmas decorations up, wrap the presents.

I write in a daily journal. I gave myself a strong pep talk this Morning, wrote down my goals for next year. If full estrangement happens after Christmas well so be it. I am not going to waste any more time fretting and worrying about something over which I have no power. I'm not going to let anything they dream up stand in my way next year. I will worry about the things which I can control, all the rest can go.

I lived for 67 years without grandchildren and 33 years without my eldest son. I am sure I can manage the next stage of my life without them if I have to. It wont kill me,

So the plan is, finish the house and then get it on the market. In the meantime, I shall just coast through Christmas. Ignore any shenanigans and just enjoy the festive season.

I'm done with sadness and sorrow, time for a fresh start. I will need to step out of my comfort zone and it might be a bit scary. Scary or not, I need to take a leap of faith and jump in.

Ladies......keep your peckers up. Enjoy the spirit of Christmas, find peace and harmony where you can.

Well, I phoned my eldest son on tuesday night as he was hurrying out with my grandson. Infact, I found out later that they were off to the carol service at the school. I wasn’t sure when they break up for christmas and when I looked the carol service came up. I am presuming that they went to that. He quickly said he would phone me one night in the week and I am still waiting. Also he mentioned that he was going to their holiday place on wednesday morning to get it ready for the family gathering at christmas. Well, no phone call has come my way. So to hell with it. I am going to try and speak to him soon and I am going to ask just what the hell I have done to be treat like this. I am fed up with it all now. He (they) can run for the hills because I feel like I have been treated shabbily for long enough and I will be better off mentally, backing away. The cards are wrote out with cash and vouchers in them and ready to go. At least my youngest son will be home some time christmas week for a short break. Today I am putting the christmas tree up and try and get myself cheered up. Sorry for the rant and thank you for reading.

Purplepixie, you are left in the air really. Do hope you get the opportunity to talk to your elder son, meanwhile you have your younger son home soon, it must be so nice having him stay with you and get some quality time.

Pixie......that's awful. So unfair to leave you in the air like that. Unfeeling and callous. A quick phone call is surely not too much to ask for but clearly it is as far as he is concerned. Shameful.

I don't blame you for wanting to "have it out". I would be inclined to feel the same. At least you would know where you stand.

Just concentrate on your younger son.

Smiles.....meant to say good luck with the concert tomorrow.

Do take care of yourself DSL. Clearly all this stress, and may I say BS as far as your son and d.i.l. are concerned is affecting your health. Make sure you do take it easy, what doesn't get done or finished today will still be there to do tomorrow.

I would have similar thoughts at the beginning of our estrangement. We once had a life without him, and we can have one without him now.

Such a cowardly way of avoiding the issue Purplepixie.

If he doesn't contact you, have you thought about leaving it? That could be a first step to "mentally, backing off". You have been and continue to be treated shabbily.

Thanks DSL I'm going to go and practice all 7 of the anthems and carols we have to sing for the last time, then save my voice for tomorrow.

I usually sing with two other ladies and microphone during the morning service as there still aren't many in the congregation, but I'll decline tomorrow so my voice is well rested.

Just having a rest now. Smiles. Nowhere near finished but I have to admit I do feel dreadfully tired. Nothing that a fortnight in the Bahamas wouldnt cure. Fat chance. ??

Pixie.......I m inclined to agree with Smiles. Whilst my first instinct would be to pick up the phone and blast him, actually I wouldn't do it. Hard as it is I wouldn't give in to the temptation. I would do just as Smiles suggested. Just leave it hanging in the air, gently back away and mentally prepare yourself.

This has been my modus operandi with my son. Time and time again I wanted to have it out with him but I managed to restrain myself. I have deliberately played it very cool. It's not an easy thing to do.

As Smiles and others have said, not knowing is very difficult and without doubt it is very stressful. Knowing that's it's over would at least give you closure. I can see there is value in that. It means you have a starting off point to heal and rebuild.

Playing the waiting game and living in limbo is soul destroying but on the plus side, it does buy you time. In time the situation might improve, in which case, playing it cool will have paid dividends. If not, then at least it's given us time to "harden our hearts" a little and prepare ourselves for the rift.

Smiles hope you raise the roof today with your performance. Once you start singing any nerves will go. Enjoy yourself I am sure the audience will. ?. I realised my bungalow looks drab without Christmas lights . So will get some in the sales after Christmas ready for next year. Like the sound of your stag .

Purplepixie I saw your painting on the watercolour thread. You are very talented it is beautiful. Sorry about your son. It's awful how our adult children can treat us with such disregard. I am very glad to have zero contact don't know how I would be able to cope with these mind games some of you are having to put up with.

DerbyshireLass hope you are feeling better . Moving was the best thing I have done in years. Ok lost my son and grandson's. But that's not my fault. Where I used to live we had lived in the same village( called a village but not a cute country village) mind you 10 mins walk and it was all countryside. Since 1980 and only moved a few roads away in 1985 to the house I sold.

As soon as I decided to sell I detached myself mentally from my home . I rattled round it. It was very big. Ironically both my children had wanted me to move closer for years. Once I found my bungalow that was it the house didn't feel like home.

I soon realised that hadn't been living my life for years as I always put others first. But since moving I am living my life to the full. The first night here had the best night's sleep for years. I can say I haven't been happier. Yes I miss my son and grandson's but his choice. I will not let it stop me living the life I want.

You think breavenment and estrangement is stressful. Buying and selling a house is horrendous. Never again.

Yogin glad to read you have exchanged and got your Christmas tree. You can now enjoy your last Christmas in your home.

After spending the day with my daughter and grandson's seeing Father Christmas . I realised how much my son and daughter in law never trusted me with my grandson's.
I was thinking about it after we had lunch and my daughter took her eldest to the outside play ground and I had the little one on my lap. Never once was I left alone with my son's boys even at their house ,never changed a nappy or baby sat them. And yet my daughter and son in law have trusted me to look after their boys. Not together as that would be to much for me as the youngest is only 1. But looked after them for hours separately. Feed and nappy changed both since babies.

Feel like I should have realised years ago but because of living so far apart was happy just to be with them. It's only when I moved I began to notice more. But again was happy as I saw both families weekly.

Looking back I think it was only once my daughter in law had her first child she started bring her crocheting with her to do so she wouldn't have to talk to me.

Well hope they had a good laugh at how clueless I was.

On a brighter note seeing my brother and sister in law before Christmas. They are coming to stay the night don't know when but that doesn't matter. They should have exchanged on their house on Friday but there buyers solicitor was a pain. Should be tomorrow. Then move out on Friday and into my sister in law's dad's . They will coordinate his and the bungalows exchange the same day with completion a week later . So they should move in January.

Can't remember if I said I went to my exercise class party on Thursday. There where 2 other classes there. It was lovely. We sat at our own group tables. It was lovely getting to talk to my exercise buddies and meeting the other instructors who take the other classes. Plenty of tasty food and hot drinks. We played skittles,egg and spoon obstacle course and a quiz we came third every time but didn't care we had fun. My daughter gave me a lift there and one of exercise group gave me a lift home.

Off to the AF clinic this afternoon. If they are happy with me on this new heart tablet they will discharge me into my GPs care.

Tomorrow busy day off shopping in the morning then U3A Christmas meeting after lunch. Group singing for us then mince pie and tea afterwards.

Have a lovely day everyone. ?

You sound so happy and contended whiff, you have pulled your life together despite your estrangement and that takes strength of character.
Smileless I hope your concert goes well, enjoy ??‍?

What a lovely post Whiff. Great to hear of all your doings. I agree with Birdie you have definitely built yourself a wonderful new life. You are an inspiration.

Smiles.....good, luck today. I am sure you will be fine, that those early nerves will soon disappear.

I used to sing in a choir, perhaps that's something I could resurrect. And I was thinking about U3A too.

I am definitely going to make a determined effort to get out and about next year, will probably start with joining a gym or some exercise classes. I am going to make my health my top priority. Everything else stems from there really doesn't it.

Smiles, you are right I feel:my health has taken a real battering again. Being my husbands carer really took its toll and just when I felt I was starting to improve the issues with my son and DIL have knocked me back. But I'm determined to get healthier.

Like you Whiff I seem to have been putting myself on the back burner all my life. Always being a people pleaser and neglecting my needs and wants In the process. Not any more. Time to start living for me.

I finally got all the decorations up. I did struggle a bit but took my time and I am pleased I made the effort. I too could do with some out side lights. I have a small Christmas tree in a pot, I might just see if I can manage to do that. I can't really reach the eaves etc. Last year I put lights round the windows from the inside so I might just do that for this year.

Need to put the house to rights now, have a good tidy up, then make a start wrapping presents. It's all go. ?

I honestly never imagined I would be posting on this thread......
My DH and I had been planning to move to a town where my dd lives for 18 months now; she was fully aware, been involved in all our plans.
7 weeks ago we went house hunting, she’d already shown my DH the houses we were interested in from the outside when he was down there helping her with her house.
We arranged to meet for a meal, she texted to say she’d been in contact with someone with COVID.
For the next 5 days we either had no response to texts or just two or three words, I was worried sick. We then had a call where she said she didn’t want us living anywhere near her, intimating we would poach her friends (we have absolutely no idea who her friends are!), and we weren’t to move there.
Since then I have heard nothing. She hasn’t replied to my two brief messages asking what on earth have we done wrong.
DH is getting some messages from her, she doesn’t mention me and ignores anything he says about me.
I am at a complete loss, heartbroken. We’re not having Christmas this year, this has been the final straw after a hideous 18 months in which I lost both parents and had a dreadful time with a sibling whose behaviour has been outrageous.
I honestly struggle to get through the day.
We’re still intending to move but DH has major surgery this week.
DS has been brilliant thankfully but lives a long way away.
Sorry for the lengthy post, I’m lost.

BlueBalou I am sorry to hear about your daughter. Especially with your husband's surgery coming up and the 18 months you have had .

It is hard to get through everyday at first especially as you don't know why she suddenly doesn't want you to live near her. Why on earth would you want her friends? That's a very silly thing for her to say.

You say you are still intending to move will it now be closer to your daughter or are you moving elsewhere?

I moved over 100+ miles to live closer to my children 2 years ago. As you may have read my son decided he wants nothing to do with me. Which is his choice.

But I still have my daughter and family.

But I don't regret moving here. I am happier and at peace . I can be me and people like me . Made a new life for myself.

But only managed to find peace with what my son has done because of the unending support , understanding and friendship I found here.

Your post wasn't long you should see some of my ramblings. You can pour your heart out here I have and found I am not alone. You aren't alone . There is help here for you.

Hello Whiff and thank you.
We’re still going to move, living here isn’t practical as a mile and a half from nearest village, very poor bus service and DH can’t drive at the moment.
She’s said she doesn’t want us anywhere near her so looking elsewhere. Perhaps will look at north Wales?
I want to be able to walk into town and not having to drive everywhere.

Perhaps Aberystwyth or Llandudno? I don’t know those places at all really. Want to be near the sea I think.

What on earth is it when DCs suddenly turn against you for no apparent reason?

Thank you Whiff - watercolour painting is so therapeutic. My story is similar as my DIL never let me feed or change my grandson until they desperately wanted to go away and I had to stay at their house the weekend. I was there from friday to Sunday night and my grandson survived! She did make a big thing of making out a rigid timetable of feeds and sleep which I did stick to religiously. As they got older then it was her parents who did it all. I think their parents were ill and that is why I got the job. They used to “forget” to inform me when it was sports day or the christmas carol service. When I think back I might as well have been a stranger.

BlueBalou what can I say? I hope your husbands surgery goes well. They hurt us so bad. I haven’t seen or had any contact with my daughter in 7 years! It hurts like mad as I have to drive past her house to go to the shops.

I just cannot fathom these kids out at all.

My youngest son is phoning tomorrow and hopefully coming home one day next week for christmas. I do not know what I would do without him.

I see christmas cards that say mam and gran and I know I will get none of those from my daughter. Yesterday when I was out shopping I watched as a mother and daughter did their shopping together. I came home and cried. We did that once in the past.

I did put the christmas tree up and I’m glad that I did now. It’s no Chatsworth tree but it fit in our little sitting room a treat. Us warriors have to keep going but it is hard at times. I would never have put my mam through the misery that I am feeling every day. Take care. ?

Who is the present for Pixie? It is a very nice tree.

Blue Balou, So very sorry your D is behaving in such a cruel way at a time when you need her most. Much as I want to move I think it’s got to be to a place that ticks all the boxes. Forget what your d says you should do, do what’s best for you two. You don’t want to be stuck in the middle of nowhere, somewhere with all the amenities you want, your daughter has the problem, let’s hope as it’s recent she will realise how hurtful she has been. I have no support from my d, she estranged me but my son isn’t far away and is a lovely son, , I do not ask for help but would in an emergency. You have to do what’s best for you two. Don’t think it’s you, it’s not, there are so many in this position lots on here for support. It’s early days though so there’s hope. Try to enjoy Christmas, you have your lovely husband so be happy you have each other, I miss mine so much.

BlueBalou Is your daughter having a nervous breakdown do you think? Her behaviour seems so strange on the basis of what you have told us, that it does seem as if it might be worth trying to establish more detail rather than taking her at her word and moving elsewhere. I am so sorry that you are dealing with this after everything else you have had happening in your life recently [flowers