How to tell someone life is too short ?

That seems to be the crux of the matter.

You need to grieve properly for the loss of your love.
As does your son, I expect, in his own way.

Ladysuisei

@Grams2Five I’m confused. I don’t have a therapist and neither do I need one . The lady from Mind is a friend . lol 😂

Well then May I suggest to try one ? I assumed the person from the mental health charity was a counselor of sorts. You’ve been thu quite a time and there’s nothing wrong with therapy it’s very useful and you could likely benefit greatly from it.

The rest of my advice still stands. Did this friend mean this advice for you instead ? You cant control your son and his actions. Only how you react to them. Life is too short - it’s true. So don’t waste time in this constant state of panic and drama over your “looming estrangement “. Take a huge step back, accept that for this moment you still have contact with your son but not his pregnant wife and unborn child. Respect that is how he has decided for it to be right now and stop endless attempts at “reasoning” and really guilting him into forgoing the boundaries he’s. Set. It will surely backfire on you - all you can do - literally Al you can do is accept that he gets to call
The shots about is own family / his wife and baby. Stay calm, and respect the boundaries he’s setting and give the situation a chance to cool off. Anything else will
Only further bring about true estrangement. Your reminder that life is short - may well be taken by him as “yes life is to short to have some push the boundaries you set up time and time again to try to get you to remove them “. Whether you mean it as a lecture or simply “good advice “ it will 1000% not be received that way, as everyone here has told you .

@march it’s my family who are following suit . His father’s family is just his father and wife and they don’t have much contact. Actually knowing the theory that life is too short is quite meaningless when you’re in your late 20’s and 30 , well it was for me . I didn’t have a care in the world it was pre- anxiety. So it’s hindsight that’s giving me perspective here I think . I wasn’t going to mention this at the moment, I was just floating it as a possibility. Not now . I definitely wouldn’t pile more stress onto them at a stressful time . I know for a fact that my son is thinking of the here and now only , but once the baby is here family life will resume and he will have to live with the decisions he makes . If he tosses me into the trash can , well it will take me time to decide if I can trust him again for any possible reconciliation. He’s really hurt me and he underestimates the effect this is having on the family. I’m unwell, my dad’s unwell , my sister and BIL have lost interest in him . He doesn’t bother contacting his cousins who he was very close to . Also the child will at some point want to know why he’s only got half a family. They’ll have to bin their wedding photos for a start . Also the hurt this has caused my dad , who has provided my son and DIL with so much help over the years is unforgivable. So estrangement has a huge knock on effect and sometimes things just can’t go back to how they were before xx

Kindly given, good advice above, I think.

I think that the comment about life being too short was intended for you Ladysu.

Perhaps life's too short to keep putting yourself through an emotional wringer, every time you talk too and meet up with your son, especially as doing so is having a detrimental effect on your mental health and overall well being.

Coming to the realisation that life is too short is I believe, something that people need to decide for themselves. It isn't something anyone else can decide for them.

I do understand why you continue to speak too and see your son despite his verbal abuse, but maybe limiting contact to 'phone calls where his physical presence wont feel intimidating is worth thinking about.

Ladysuisei

@DiamondLily you’re right my son is throwing tantrums. Dang !
My life really is so empty without my love . I can’t believe he’s gone . There will never be anyone else so that’s potentially a long time alone



time alone

No, you’re right.

Spousal/partner bereavement is a pain like no other. It’s that your 24/7 person has gone.

It’s a case of getting through each day, to get through each night.

Don’t look at the future, just do the day.

Don’t get embroiled in other people’s dramas for now. Just do you.

Eventually, the brain fog will clear and then you can deal with other stuff.

Meanwhile, mourn your loss and sort out your home move.

Distraction is a great help. 💐

@sillawip actually re the August issue, I have self reflected so much and I realise that I was wrong. I’m not too proud to admit this . There have been numerous instances though , where my son has deliberately hurt me ( some of which involve my partner) . There’s a difference here I think . The August incident was a colossal disaster, mind you it could have been avoided had I known what his wife’s family knew . It wasn’t just her mum that was told it was the entire family - also had her mum taken me quietly to one side to explain it would have been easier. They blurted it out in the A&E waiting room . Now I’ve taken the whole incident on board and accepted I’m wrong . I’ve asked him if there’s anything I can do to improve the situation and he says no , so we have an impasse . An apology is all I can offer . Obviously I’ve not said anything about being taken to one side etc , that was clumsy of my DIL’s mother actually. If we had talked quietly I’d have taken it all in , not said anything then the whole incident would have been different. Many faults were made but I take full responsibility.
Can I add , I’d forgive them anything if we could move forward. I’m having someone to talk to about my bereavement xx

Ladysue I desperately want to just tell my son and DIL life is too short for all this crap , but I just don’t know where to start . Any ideas GNetters ? Thank you xxxx

Ladysue I'm going to focus on your specific question above.

To be honest I don't think there IS a positive way to say this to your son (or DiL) as things stand at present.

Looking at that statement from their perspective with their expressed boundaries as they stand at present, that comment sounds dismissive of their perceived concerns and just makes it look like you are not listening to them. You are basically saying that their views are rubbish!

Ofcourse from your perspective you feel that their views are "crap" but if you want any chance of getting back any kind of relationship with them and hopefully your soon to arrive GChild, then saying anything that gives that impression will just make them more angry/convinced of the boundaries they are setting; from their perspective they will be right as you will be seen by them as not listening, dismissing their views, wanting it all your own way.

On another thread you said that the calm strategy we discussed had worked when you saw your son. You said he was less verbally abusive and things were calmer (I know it did go a bit pear shaped when he talked about your partner's ashes, but overall it went better)

So I suggest you carry on with that calm strategy, not engaging in the angst, really listening, reflecting back to ensure he knows you have heard etc. This is not because you have to put up with verbal abuse; it's not because you are being "a doormat" etc. You are just not engaging in the angst but you are engaging in listening and hearing him; over time his anger may ease especially as he has said he "doesn't like what is happening" to you, and wider conversations may be enabled.

But at the moment "life's too short" really is not a helpful message to be giving

25Avalon
Sorry misunderstanding- the miscarriage was a threatened one . The baby is fine . Did I get that wrong ?
The only thing I can say is that we’ve all done and said regrettable things . I am capable of recognising the fact that no dispute is one way but in order to move on we have to agree to leave this behind I feel. Soon they will have their son , when I say the pregnancy had been difficult I mean my DIL hasn’t enjoyed it really, but my son continues to punish me ( it’s how it feels) . I feel that all things considered, we should be adult enough to be able to move on from this when it was caused by miscommunication and fear xxx

Oh, I’m so pleased that you can think that Ladysuisei - that is real progress in your thinking and it will make a difference. Being able to see things from someone else’s point of view is such a useful tool to have. And to hear that you are going to get some support for your bereavement too - well, I feel ridiculously proud of you!!

@smiles well life is too short for me . The way I feel is that I wish it was shorter than it will be without my love by my side .
It’s true , the second year of bereavement is worse than the first . I realise I have nothing. I’m torturing myself seeing my son I know but I miss him in my life so much it hurts . Having one child is a unique experience- I’ve put absolutely everything into bringing him up . He’s had all my love , my care , my consideration and we had a brilliant relationship. Things changed so much when my partner died . I’m never going to recover from this and even though I’m moving to a nicer place , I am dreading living on my own . I’m not coping at all well . I suppose I always thought my son and DIL would help me - this is what my parents did for their own families at times of need . It’s a shock that they don’t want me around ( I’ll get a bashing for that !) . They have a huge house with an attic that could be converted. ( more bashing !!) . My BIL was brought up with 3 brothers , his parent and his Nan in a small terraced house , so to me this is all pretty standard . My ex husband’s mum was about to relocate to our street but then his brother moved back in due to cancer . All my family have accommodated relatives in need . Now I’m in need I got me . It feels scary . I think a lot of this behaviour has stemmed from loneliness and fear on my part .
I will do my best to start living for myself, I know I have to . Once the baby is here I’m going to make more decisions about things as you know xxx

@VioletSky the fact that I apologised to 2 people isn’t indicative of how many people I’ve offended, it shows I’m happy to say sorry . Sadly you have offended people and I’ve never noticed any apologies. You’ve offended me for a start off and no apology have been forthcoming. So try not to be so rude

@stillawip
Yes I have insight and also I’m happy to apologise. I just wish my son would accept we can’t change the past only do better in the future.
I know I need help with my bereavement. It’s very difficult xxx

Smileless2012

I think that the comment about life being too short was intended for you Ladysu.

Perhaps life's too short to keep putting yourself through an emotional wringer, every time you talk too and meet up with your son, especially as doing so is having a detrimental effect on your mental health and overall well being.

Coming to the realisation that life is too short is I believe, something that people need to decide for themselves. It isn't something anyone else can decide for them.

I do understand why you continue to speak too and see your son despite his verbal abuse, but maybe limiting contact to 'phone calls where his physical presence wont feel intimidating is worth thinking about.

Good advice.

1 - I'm a bit confused, likely didn't read correctly. Is your dead partner the father of your son? If not, perhaps he doesn't have much vested in your partner's passing? Please forgive if I read this wrong.

2 - Of course "life is short", particularly to parents and grandparents, not much to children under late middle age. The message life is short was meant to you, "stop this nonsense, life is short".

3 - Apart from your son, have you never meant a tall person? I'm around tall and big people all day/ every day - workers and my slim quite tall brother. I hold my own and don't care if they're over me, they mean no harm, they're just tall. Don't make mountains out of molehills. As one daughter says; "get a grip".

SingcoTime

Ladysuisei

@VioletSky no matter what you say , there’s no reason why a 6”4 man ( my AS) should use intimidation and abuse towards his mother . You speak so often about your so - called suffering at the hands of a narcissistic abuser , yet here you are advocating violence towards a female!
You have immediately invalidated ANY further argument against abuse .
That’s disgraceful.

This is a horrific and uncivil post. In no way did she advocate violence. Dismissing her abuse the way you did, I am sorry but I think your son and DIL would be wise to stay low or no contact. Your lack of compassion is disgraceful.

Beyond the beyond that you complain about your son abusing you (not read how, nor is it my business) - yet are dismissive of abuse to VS!

"@march it’s my family who are following suit . His father’s family is just his father and wife and they don’t have much contact. Actually knowing the theory that life is too short is quite meaningless when you’re in your late 20’s and 30 , well it was for me . *

That's fantastic for you. I'm glad you didn't experience so much loss in your late 20s and 30s. That doesn't mean we didn't.

OP brace yourself, it's not going to go your way.

Re point no. 2 in your post Norah I was thinking along the same lines.

Maybe it's when we get older that we start think about life being too short. We've probably faced losing someone we loved because they've died, and there's nearly always the wish that we'd had a bit longer, said more of the things we're glad we'd said, and less of the things we regret.

Something to bear in mind as the baby's birth approaches is modern couples seem to be advised from all directions to avoid contact and visiting with outsiders until they are well and truly settled in their new routine. I found it very rude and hurtful when my nephew seemed horrified that I would drop a present off at their door (I didn't expect to see mother and baby). I understand where he was coming from now.

I do hope you will soon be looking at a picture of your grandchild and the healing process will begin.

@madgran hi - well I didn’t mean “ crap “ as in crap . In fact I thought this question would turn out to be slightly more lighthearted than it actually has been .
Having said that I’d NEVER refer to this whole time as crap . I’m still practicing my calm approach and largely, it’s working, I’m getting the impression that life’s too short isn’t a good thing to say anyway. I was talking about this issue with the lady from Mind ( someone has picked up on this and yes she’s a friend because I used to volunteer there when I was slightly less unwell ) and she actually said to me “ oh no life’s too short can’t you tell him this “ ! Hence me posing the question for opinions from those who are estranged.
It seems like this is perceived as quite a sensitive thing to say under these circumstances. So from a person not in this situation it seems like a reasonable appraisal , but not if you are in the predicament. That’s interesting. I certainly didn’t view it as something that might minimise my son’s difficulties at the moment. Good job I’ve asked - actually I don’t think my son’s views are crap at all but I do think he is taking it too far . If someone is unhappy about an incident which happened in the past there’s absolutely no way to change this . The only remedy lies in an apology and changed behaviour. Now if an apology isn’t “ good enough” what would you suggest might be . Other than time ? Sadly, everyone seems to focus solely on the fact that I said something which has upset my son but overlooked the plethora of ways he’s deliberately hurting me by way of payback . I find myself constantly trying out your technique of asking if I can do anything to help the situation, being told the situation hasn’t changed then I am remaining calm whilst he hurls abuse . Admittedly less abuse than a few weeks ago . He knew he’d get a reaction by criticising me over my partner’s ashes . He realises I’m devastated by this loss and he also knows that emotionally I’m not ready to deal with them quite just yet . It’s a form of denial. If I ignore the ashes I ignore the death . I know my partner would want me mentally well and settled in a safe home before I deal with this . He spent over 20 years looking after my wellbeing and I know where his priorities lie.
Just a question- do you ever think life’s too short would be useful or is the question not worth it ?

@Nell8 gosh I find that so bizarre ! When I had my son my entire family were in the relatives room next to the delivery suite waiting for his arrival! Pity it went pear shaped and we ended up in emergency surgery. I was out of it of course , but I know my family stayed all night till I was out of surgery and they all saw him in special care 24 hours before I saw him . I had a photo propped by my bed . My son doesn’t know all this - they don’t realise that both me and my sister’s children were a whole family affair . None of what you’ve described happened. I think it’s why I’m having a difficult time adjusting to being told they’re not accepting visitors. How odd xxx

@sago I can word this however I want to . Mind is a charity that I have volunteered for when I was well . The lady I refer to has since become a friend - why is that odd ?

@march - I don’t understand your reply ? I mean I didn’t have an experience of losing people to death in my 20’s and 30’s ( other than 2 grandparents) . Why does this require bracing myself? Am I missing the point ?

I've been in a similar situation to you and understand how devastated you feel. My strong advice is that you stop mentioning the "situation" to your son in any shape or form. Talk to him about anything but that. Make his visits to you be a conflict free zone - or he will stop coming. My suspicion is that his home life is very emotional at the moment - he doesn't want more of that when he sees you. You have done everything possible to improve things and got nowhere so let the matter go. I think that when things calm down during these visits he will voluntarily tell you what is really going on.
Also if he does become abusive tell him very firmly "Do not speak to me like that. Either stop it now or leave".
Please try to focus your attention on other family and friends now.

@DiamondLily thank you for some useful advice on dealing with my new situation.

I am sorry your husband has died too - it’s a heartbreaking time that needs adjustment. I am not adjusting. It was so sudden and absolutely shocking I still can’t believe he’s gone . This wouldn’t be happening if he was here because I’d be happy doing my own thing with him and if my son didn’t want us around well that would be that .

I will try to concentrate on rebuilding my life and see what happens. I’m not looking forward to living on my own it terrifies me actually. It’s just me and the cat . Xxx

P.S. my DIL estranged us shortly after DS had returned from a tour of duty in Afghanistan where he saw one friend killed and others badly injured. Thank god he came home injured and I felt very strongly at that point that life is too short and we should have been rejoicing as a family and not falling out. I didn't say that to her as she wouldn't speak to me and would have found a way of turning it against me.