Support and friendship For Those Estranged

Oh yes, well done with your singing Smiles xx

Like others I also worry about putting a foot wrong with our non EAC. They are totally different from our EAC but when it’s happened once, there is always the fear it might happen again. Estrangement robs you of underlying security. A minor disagreement leaves you feeling anxious.
Having said that I recognise I feel v ambivalent about EAC now. Grateful not to be living with the drama as others have said. Deeper concern is for gc who live not knowing their extended family. Don’t like drawing comparisons with H&M, but felt sad to see the royal cousins all at BP garden party together today, and H&M not there. So much is lost when E happens, regardless of the rights or wrongs of it. But then maybe H&M don’t care. Bluesky- is early days for you but I promise it does get easier until it no longer hurts. Hard to believe but true!
Great to hear about your singing Smiles. Well done to you all on Sunday!

Spring I feel the same about my son's 3 boys as they don't know they have 2 cousins. I have the last picture of my sons to oldest on my mantle with pics of my daughter's boys. Her eldest asked me once who the boys where so I told him their names but didn't say they where his cousin's as he knows what cousins are as he has 2 on his dad's side. He asked if I played with them and said no I didn't see them . I know one day his brother will ask the same question. I couldn't imagine not growing up without my large extended family. I knew all my great aunts and uncles,2nd and 3rd cousins . Saw my aunt's ,uncles and cousins every week and my nan who I stayed with during school holidays. Plus I was her carer from aged 11 when she was ill. 2 aunts who didn't work looked after during the week and dad took me on a Friday night and fetched me on Sunday. I shopped and cooked for my nan. She had an outside loo. Very chilly in the winter and no electric light I had a candle and matches . But it didn't seem odd it's just what I did. I was the oldest grandchild and only girl for 19 years.

I got asked the other day what would I do if my son turned up . I said either hit him or hug him. But thinking about it I would just look at him and let him speak first. But I know it will never happen. And decided last year to let go of ever seeing him again and feel happy with my decision. I can't and will not live with what ifs or if onlies . Since moving here I have a home again as after my husband died our home was just a house . He was my home. I am happier since my move than I had been since he died. Even what my son has done is nothing compared to my husband dieing . And the grief I feel daily for him . I can and will never forget or forgive my son and daughter in law for the last 4 years and my son killed any trust I had in him. I also realised they have turned into my in laws only difference is I don't hate them like I did my in laws.

My grandsons will have forgotten me by now as they where 4 and 2 last time I saw them and never met or know the name of their brother. My son was so cruel not even telling me when him was born or his name. I have given him one as I can't think of him without one.

We all have to come to terms with estrangement and it's hard. And it's a horrible thought we have to protect ourselves from the hurt our children put us through. But we live in a throw away society I didn't realise until it happened to me parents are thrown away as if we are past our used by date.

That's the feeling Whiff, used and returned, I have served my usefulness to them and now I'm older my purpose is gone, what happened to the love?
I don't know why I have been discarded, so I can only surmise its the above !

Morning everyone. It was lovely when we arrived at our lodge yesterday, we even sat outside for a while and enjoyed the warm sunshine.

Mr. S. took advantage of the weather and sorted out our small garden area because we knew the weather was going to change.

Don't feel guilty because you don't like your D very much Bluesky. I don't like the person our ES's become very much either but still love him; that's what unconditional love is.

Putting ourselves at risk of more pain by ever having a relationship with him in the future, just isn't a viable option. He almost broke us as individuals and as a couple and that's not something we could ever risk again.

DS asks me to read through his work with a critical eye Yogin, so I'm happy to oblige, and at least this time he broke a life long trend of leaving everything to the last minute, and finishing in good time.

It sounds as if you're having limited success with the pigeon proof bird feeders. They're not daft are they, when it comes to working out how to get to the food.

Estrangement robs you of underlying security. A minor disagreement leaves you feeling anxious. So true Bridie, and not just with any other children you may have. It can also affect relationships with other family members and friends too.

If anyone reading this, is experiencing a sense of insecurity with their other children, and it's possible to have a conversation about it, please do. It really does help to take the edge off those worries.

It is a shame that our EGC miss out on seeing their extended family, not just GP's but cousins, aunts and uncles too Spring.

I used to get asked that too Whiff but haven't been asked for a while. My answer is I have no idea what I would do if he turned up and like you, I know it will never happen anyway and I don't want it too.

If my overall feeling was that I don't want him in my life, I never want to be in a position of telling him so. In spite of everything, I wouldn't want to do to him what he's done to us.

How do you trust anyone when they have nearly destroyed you?

I don't think you ever can again sadly, Allsorts.

I don't think you can either Bridie because it isn't just our ability to trust that's been damaged, it's our self worth.

Our lack self confidence which feeds into the fear some of us have experienced of losing our other child(ren). Something we'd never have considered if we'd not been estranged by their sibling(s).

It's hard to have the feeling of security with our other child(ren) that we once had. We can't reassure ourselves that all will be well because we've been loving, caring and supportive parents because that's how we'd been with those who estranged us.

This living bereavement isn't just about learning to live without the child whose estranged us, it's much more than that. It's also about living with the scars that the lies that have been told about us have left behind. It's about rebuilding our self esteem, and understanding that it really doesn't matter if there are some who refuse to believe our account.

We know the truth as do those who have estranged us and for me, I would rather live with the pain and misery of the truth, than the pain and misery I've caused with lies.

It's also about the void, I don't know the whys and wherefores of why I have been estranged, despite trying to have the conversation , silence, no explanation, nothing,
It leaves you in nomans land.

We know there have been lies from what our DS has told us Bridie.

Why do some EAC refuse to have that conversation? Why do some refuse to offer any explanation for their decision, opting for silence?

As far as our ES is concerned, I don't believe for a moment that he could ever look me in the eye and lie about what me or his father has done to justify being estranged.

I wouldn't be at all surprised if that's the case for you Bridie and all of the other parents who've been estranged, and never told why.

I agree Smileless, I sometimes think there isn't actually a reason, they just can no longer be arsed with me!
If so , just tell me and stop breaking me down day after day !

Very good post Smiles and of course I agree with it all. Lies were told about me, no doubt lots I don't know about. When my DD was still allowed in their lives, they said something about me and my DD said that's not right, mum would never do or say that!.

Scenarios were swapped from one person onto me. When my estD re-played one scenario, I said that wasn't me, that was you! her H was the one turning the stories around and placing them onto me. My estD had just given birth so wouldn't have been able to remember.

All great posts . I know my son couldn't have said what he did in his email or letter to my face as I would put him right on his lies and assumptions. That's why he took the cruel and cowardly way out. It is horrible to realise just how cruel and cowardly he became. His lies and assumptions didn't just hurt me but my brother and his children as well. My daughter had washed her hands of him years ago down to her sister in law. Also his letting me down and being late to pick me up . He knows what I am like about time . I can't abide being late and always at least 30 mins early for any appointment or when I went to the station for my train I was over hour early. He also knew I can't bear last minute cancellations as it's sets my anxiety off. Which I didn't know what it was until my HPX diagnosis and described how certain situations make me feel and how my body reacts to others with HPX.

I would rather have the silence I have than verbal abuse and lies. He must have taken great pleasure in dishing it out but he wouldn't like to be on the receiving end of my replies.

What does hurt is we were always able to talk about anything . At least my daughter hasn't changed and I know how lucky I am with her and her family.

But like all of us we are no longer the parent our estranged children knew as they are not the children we knew.

Estrangement has made me stronger but also less tolerate of bad behaviour from any source. Moving here made me more confident perhaps that's what my son and daughter in law didn't like but I neither care or have any intention of changing.

I gave up on a 5 year friendship last year before Christmas because I don't do one way friendships. And that's how it became so when I told her it would be the last time we spoke she blamed me saying you have changed. I said of cause I had changed as I was finally happy and had a home again and living the life my husband wanted for me. I told her the problem was she hadn't and was still stuck in the same rut she had always been in. But I am glad I did it. I have to many real friends who I who I care about and they me . Friends here and in my real life. The past is gone it's the now and future we need to concentrate on. No what ifs or if onlies.

Good afternoon everyone.

It’s been a bit full on this week, with DS and DIL etc over from America - I’m, quite honestly, worn out with trying to be jolly and positive.🙄. My son just keeps telling everyone how strong I am - but I’m not feeling it some days lol

Goodness, the expectations our kids put on us is heavy at times.

To make matters worse a friend, who has been a real friend since DH died, had a heart attack yesterday.☹️

She’s in hospital, seems sort of ok, but waiting to see what the hospital are going to do.

Jeez, it seems to be something every day.🙄

But, hope everyone is having a good day. x 💐

So very sorry to hear about your friend DL. Hopefully she'll make a full recovery x

DiamondLily that's what we do we put a brave face on for our loved ones when inside we are a crumbling mess. My children always told me they where proud of me and never thought I would cope without their dad. I wanted to shout but I am not coping and I hate this life. It's not what we planned. But of course they could never know. And I don't know about you but it was exhausting in the early months and for me years.

When they found out on the 14th anniversary of my husband's death how I really was they both said why didn't you tell use you weren't coping. Usually they text on the anniversary of his death and I always said I was fine . But I wasn't for 14 years I relived the last 2 weeks of his life it was like watching a black and white film. If I was with my mom and dad then just my mom after dad died on the date I had to tell her not to mention his name or cry otherwise I wouldn't stop crying .

My daughter phoned on the 14th anniversary and I couldn't pretend anymore. And it all came out. She told me I should have told her. Explained why I couldn't as I was protecting them from me. She phone her brother and he said the same thing. I vowed that day never to let it effect like it did and only on the anniversary I could be a sodden rag if I needed to.

No matter how old our children get we want to protect them. I asked my daughter after the estrangement if she wanted to know anything about her dad we kept secret as that was one of the things my son had a go at me about. But she said no as she knew dad didn't want them to know. And it was his and my choice.

Even though my children were 20 and 16 I tried to be mom and dad to them looking back that was stupid but grief makes you think and do strange things.

Sorry about your friend I hope she is being well taken care of and they will find out why she had a heart attack. And gets the help she needs.

Yes, Whiff, you are right. I try to protect them from how I’m feeling a lot of the time.

The problem is that DS lives thousands of miles away, and I know he frets if I’m unhappy. Living that distance away means he feels helpless.

DD is under a lot of stress with this never ending court case, and I don’t want to add to that either.

My friend phoned this morning. They seem to have sorted out a plan of action, but it’s unclear how long she’ll be in hospital. Still, sounds positive.

Ah well, time to press on - DS and DIL are rocking up this afternoon, so time to put on my positive face lol 😉

Hope everyone has a lovely day. x 💐

Morning everyone, hope you're enjoying the bank holiday weekend despite the weather.

When the sun is shining it's lovely here. We took our dogs out for a lovely walk yesterday afternoon. I love to see them running off their leads and they were tired and happy when we got back to the lodge.

A lot of children here with it being a bank holiday and half term. Our neighbours have three of their GC staying, the youngest at 20 months is gorgeous and a proper handful. All three have beautiful red hair and are keeping our friends busy.

Their antics are keeping us amused and she told me yesterday that she hopes their caravan will survive all the charging around and climbing. It made me think that neither our lodge or home would be suitable for little ones, and how different they would both be if we'd had GC coming to visit or stay.

Had things turned out differently, we probably wouldn't have our lodge as we bought the original static caravan so I could get away from the village where we used to live, and we'd never have moved. We did a lot to that house as we'd never intended to leave it and had got it just the way we wanted, only four years
before we eventually left.

It's funny how things work out in the end isn't it and how a particular event completely changes the course your life takes.

Good news about your friend DL. Hopefully she'll be back home soon and well on the road to recovery. It must be frightening to go through something like; a stark reminder of one's mortality.

Morning all

Beautiful sunny morning, hope it stays that way as meeting a friend at 3pm for a concert in the park. Joey will have to wait till then for walkies, I'll go an hour earlier so he gets a good walk first. Reluctantly I will do my weekly shop at Lidl this morning, I'll be very annoyed if it does rain this afternoon, meaning I was in Lidl when it was sunny!

Meeting my sister tomorrow at Bluewater for lunch and little shopping.

Seemed to have cracked the bird situation. Moved all the feeders around, so the pigeons can't get to them easily and now getting lots of little birds; family of bluetits, robins, blackbirds, sparrows, it's lovely. I can hear an unusual bird, making a sound like a woodpecker as they peak the tree, but it's their song, anyone know what that could be?

Good to hear your friend has recovered DL. I was told some terrible news yesterday; one of my fellow instructors [not yoga] decided to end her life, only 32yrs. I would have thought with having such an active job in health & fitness it should also calm your mind too. When I'm feeling low, I do an hour of yoga or/& teach a yoga class and the world seems a better place again.

Enjoy the long weekend all xx

So sorry to hear about your fellow instructor Yogin one can only imagine what must go through someone's mind to end their life so young .

Mr. S. said your bird could be a Great Spotted Woodpecker, if it's making a repetitive harsh, single note. If it's a song it could be a Black Cap, a small bird with quite a sweet song.

I love being here at the lodge because we see and hear a variety of birds, including an owl that we've heard every night since we arrived. Being at the coast at home, we tend to only hear the gulls, which I love and still smile to myself first thing in the morning when I hear them.

When we were in the process of buying the house, I used to tell myself how lovely it would be when we moved, to be able to hear them and be safely away from our ES and his wife.

We get fabulous views of them from our roof terrace. It's our only outside space and when they fly across, we get a great view of them.

Sunshine and showers here. Mr. S. has just given the grass around our lodge another cut. I love the scent of freshly cut grass, something else we only get here. We're very lucky to live at the coast and have somewhere in the country to enjoy too.

Hi everyone. I too hope you’re all having a restful bank holiday - although what does that mean once retired! I’ve just officially hung up my boots….not yet got my bus pass, but glad to be sorting things out pension wise.
I agree Smiles - estrangement has caused us to make different life decisions too. Not least to squeeze every ounce of happiness out of life we can. It took a while to come to terms with what felt like a body blow, but now we’ve accepted there will be no return to what once was, it’s like a massive page has been turned.
Lies were told about us too….or maybe I should say a narrative formed from our EC’s perspective that we had no opportunity to challenge. After 2 years their best friend uncovered the lies, and now is no longer in touch with them. All incredibly sad. I am not an expert and don’t know why some people do this - create false narratives - but we know from the media some (not all) people do. Sometimes from an unconscious need to be a victim, but in such scenarios there is always more than one victim.
Glad you are having a lovely time with your family DL, and making memories. I agree you don’t want to burden them or give them cause to worry, esp as they live so far away. I hope the day is more than a positive face for you though. Glad you have your yoga to keep you cheerful Yogi, and enjoy the concert. Fingers crossed for no rain!

I think as you say Spring that some have the need to be seen as a victim and I suppose if an EAC's asked why they estranged their parent(s) there's also a need for some to 'create a narrative' by way of an explanation.

Good afternoon all.

Sorry to hear about your friend, Yogin ..awful when someone that young is in despair. 💐

Yes, some people do need to create a false narrative - I suppose it removes any feeling of guilt, if they can throw themselves into “playing the victim card”. They’re deluding themselves though - because they know the truth, deep down.

But, perhaps you need to pity people that constantly throw themselves into the victim mode.🤷‍♀️

Anyway, I’m ploughing on, knee deep in Americans lol - I love seeing them, but, I’m starting to feel the strain with sometimes just wanting a quiet day.😗

My (American) step grandson and new husband want to take us all out for a meal tomorrow to celebrate their marriage. Great, but I still can’t keep down anything but a jacket potato and salad, so not really looking forward to it. Still, I’ll have to do my best.🙄

My neighbour/friend is quite upbeat. She’s got to go to a major central London hospital tomorrow for some heart procedures to be done, and then, hopefully, she can come home.

Anyways, all have a good rest of day x💐

Yoga, so sorry that young woman took her life, you can only guess her state of mind, so young too. I feel for her family and friends because they won’t know peace.
The reason EC tell lies is to put themselves in a good light, to justify their decision to estrange us as it’s such a big thing. I think eventually people
see the truth but it adds even more heartache. I wonder often why she had to do it.

We’ve recently helped non EAC with deposit for a house. Not much but happy to do it. Initially we kept enough money aside for EC so we could be fair to all children and maybe one day give it them. Now I feel differently. They don’t choose to be part of the family. Our other children invite us round for meals and plan days out including us, because we have lovely times when together. We laugh a lot. They check in on us roughly once a week or so. We all live independent lives but enjoy being together. Why oh why has our EC removed themself from this? I will never understand why, but I do feel sad they are (in my view!) missing out on so much, but I can only assume because they continue to be estranged, that they are happier. I really hope so, despite missing them so much.