Another perspective on estrangement

Thanks for the praise DroppingIn - glad you’re in agreement!

Message deleted by Gransnet. Here's a link to our Talk guidelines.

Reported

Message deleted by Gransnet. Here's a link to our Talk guidelines.

Reported

Message deleted by Gransnet. Here's a link to our Talk guidelines.

DroppingIn

Message deleted.

Aww I’m devastated DroppingIn…to the (rotten 🤣) core, your opinion mattered so much!

Love your happy thoughts and sentiments that obviously keep you warm in winter…

I agree Pantglas that when discussing estrangement the use of the word typically is used by someone with no personal experience of or true understanding of estrangement. It's also typically used when unfairly apportioning all the blame responsibility on EP's.

@Luminance is worrying that so many trolls seem to agree with you and even mention you in their posts.
Am not implying anything, just telling it as it is.
If I were you I would be worried about this, surely.

Whenever I have time to sit down for a browse the comments seem to be gone already so I do not know what is being said there and wouldn't pay it much mind. Just adding to the discussion my own observations, by no means are they one size fits all but worth consideration when advising others I feel. Notice carefully I did not make any distinctions and my thoughts were applied to any relationship at all, not parent/child estrangements.

I’m estranged from my mother, I feel completely justified, and I don’t want to build bridges, or negotiate any kind of reconciliation ever.
But I do think that I was probably a pretty difficult child/teenager, and the reason I don’t ever want to have anything to do with her, isn’t because I was seriously abused in any way, it’s because I don’t like her. I don’t like the kind of person she is, I just think she’s really unpleasant, and that’s putting it nicely.
I’ve taken criticism, I don’t defend myself, it’s very personal between her and I, I don’t want anyone to take sides.
I think every estrangement is different, and no one should judge.

Thank you Sara, you are absolutely right every estrangement is different. And though judgements are easy it is wrong to judge anyone whose personal experiences you are unaware of and that goes for any situation in life.
You have been candid about your reasons for your estrangement and though I am sure there is more to it, you don’t owe anyone an explanation, as you say you don’t want anyone to take sides.
The blame game is lazy and hurtful to those who already blame themselves more than anyone.
Take care 🌺🙏🏾

That's a very candid post Sara which I think shows that your decision to estrange your mum and never wish to reconcile, has been the right one for you.

I don't believe that the genuine posters here on GN, be they EP's or EAC want anyone to 'take sides'. We come here for a variety of reasons; for support, advice, to know we are not the only one and sometimes just to vent.

We don't come for a pitched battle with EAC if we're EP's and I don't believe that the vast majority of EAC who post here do either.

You're right Sara every estrangement is different, and no one should judge, which is what I as an EP and so many others have been saying for years.

I hope that the naysayers who've been disrupting this forum recently read your post, it might carry more 'weight' coming from you then it does coming from us .

Thankyou Smileless and Babs for your understanding, I know Smileless and I come from different perspectives, but that doesn’t make either one of us wrong.

It’s not something I casually talk about, even within my close circle of friends there is a degree of disapproval from some people, only a few days ago a friend of more than fifty years was suggesting I was being a bit unreasonable. I don’t try and defend myself, because I think for a lot of people, there is no defence, family is family, you take the rough with the smooth.

My husband and I have known each other since our teens, and he knows how she was, and despite the fact that she was vile to him, he kept visiting her up until earlier this year, when her behaviour towards one of our children was the last straw for him, and also for our son.

No one is a winner, but since the day I made my decision, I’ve felt nothing but freedom and relief, so my only regret is that I didn’t do it twenty years earlier.

You and I have talked a few times here on GN Sara and I know that until recently your DH was visiting your mum with the children, but this has now stopped.

I know and understand that you wish you'd estranged her long before you did but don't have any regrets, just enjoy the freedom and relief that you have now.

'Merry Christmas' to you and your family .

@Sara, there are never any absolutes with estrangement no hard and fast wrongs or rights but a lot of grey areas, and we navigate our way through these as best we can. You did what you had to do, don’t look back, look forwards, you have people around you who love you so you have a great deal to be content with. I ceased to use the word happy years ago, and I refer to words like contentment and calm which I can now enjoy since our estrangement.
Am sure you would agree that these feelings are priceless.
Have a good xmas 🎄

Thankyou Smileless, I hope you and your husband have a happy Christmas, despite everything.

Luminance

I would offer my opinion on family estrangement. When family relationships dissolve into arguments they enter a debate phase. In any given debate, participants are stating their truth. If we look at any debate logically we are given to understand that truth exists on both sides and emotionally healthy people are able to see the truth in each others words and feelings and come back together again at some point in the middle with both admitting their inadequacies and moving forward together. Estrangement it seems to me happens when one party has confused "truth" for being "right". This attached their opinion to their ego and their pride will not allow a moments reflection. Typically it seems to me that when I meet a person who confuses "truth" with being "right" and their pride will not allow any opinion that is not their own to go unchallenged, they often have estranged or failed relationships. Typically those I meet who have walked away from failing relationships in the form of estrangement are those who wanted to find the truth wherever it was in the middle and realised that was impossible due to the other persons misplaced pride and overbearing ego.

Luminance, I find this opinion very helpful! It's a pattern I can definitely see truth in when looking at relationships around me. It seems like an equally beneficial perspective when removed from the context of estrangement too, as far removed as working relations with a colleague! Looking for rightness rather than truth can easily cause difficulty landing on either.

A very helpful perspective shared in the OP too I think, ShropshireGal87. Especially the fact that there are EAC who initiate estrangement and still have to deal with the pain of being apart, with feeling sad when they see happy families on the telly at Christmas knowing it's an experience that can most likely never be theirs.

This is very logical and sound advice, but only if you actually want to save the situation, I didn’t want to discuss anything, I didn’t want to accuse anyone, or justify my actions, I just wanted out.

Babs, I’m pleased you have found contentment, you are right of course, lots of grey areas, but I know I’m lucky, good relationships with all my children and grandchildren, I try very hard never to respond to any circumstance as my mother would have done, of course I’ve made mistakes, but I’m very aware of how much I love them all, and how I would hate to lose them.

Exactly Sara.

That was in response to your post @ 22.10 Sara.

I don't think you can generalise. No one knows how you really feel or how someone makes you feel and if you have no chance to talk to each other honestly and listen estrangement stands. I will always miss my daughter whilst knowing we can't re unite. I have a picture of her smiling into the camera, a beautuful woman with a kind face. I look at that picture and that's how I want her to be. She has her reasons and I have to respect them and I do. I have good friends and famiily I love and a nice home and family, so in many ways I am lucky. 1 still have my moments though but have a few coping strategies and they don't last long. This forum has been a life line many times, knowing there's support.

Allsorts, until I stumbled across all of you, I thought I was the only one, yes people fell out with their families, but no one I have ever known has simply walked away from it all.
It’s been good to know other people have acted in the same way, that I’m not the bitch from hell, just someone who has had enough.

Does anyone else find boundaries in families a rather interesting topic? Many do not entirely understand what they are. Recently I was able to save a friend of mine regarding boundaries. Her son and daughter in law informed her they wanted Christmas morning this year for themselves. She was about to respond with how sad and disappointed she was that they wouldn't spend it with her as in previous years. I explained that this is what they would like to do and expressing your sadness and disappointment will be received as a guilt trip. They have set a boundary with you and you should not cross a boundary by making them feel dreadful. Instead you should set a boundary for yourself for your own feelings and wish them well of their morning then ask when they are free to celebrate with you. Sadness and disappointment can be aired to safe ears instead. We spend a great deal of times with our lives entwined with those of our children. When our children become adults we must all be responsible for implementing boundaries in the interest of healthy relationships.