Touching a stranger's baby

Craicon is right. This friend is trouble capital T. No boundaries, no intuition no empathy. I'd be outraged, frightened and angry if I was the parent and she had her hands on my child. All other posters agree as I do - keep away, this will result in some heated argument or even violence and you will be dragged in. She was kind to you once - just play back how you feel now she is back in your life to the two years when she wasn't - as you say huge relief without. Kindly but firmly drop this one and forge new relationships. She sounds dominant and you are heading for an abusive toxic relationship if you don't escape. Good luck.

It's a real sign of the times but unfortunately it's not acceptable to touch babies - I would always ask if the parents minded first of all and then only if it was an appropriate sort of situation. It's very wrong to pass a comment like your friend did. New parents have a tough enough time without outside criticism and we never know a persons circumstances. As for your friend it's a tough one but maybe start standing up to her when she says or does things you don't like. Sometimes friendships come to a natural end - sometimes they endure maybe nobody has ever pointed out her unacceptable behaviour before and they need to.

Shared memories are not a reason to stay friends with this person. She was so wrong touching baby and saying what she did. Do you really need this person in your life...I think not.

It's entirely up to you to decide whether you want to stay friends with this person or perhaps limit the sort of social engagements you share with her but it is absolutely not OK to touch a complete stranger's baby, especially a very young baby. It's almost a passive aggressive form of assault. You can admire or smile at a stranger's baby but you do not touch the baby.

As other posters have said, not a very appealing friend but that is your call.

I hated people touching my babies without asking, and that was nearly 40 years ago. Things have moved on, and now people are even more sensitive about such things. However, the real problem here is your relationship with this lady. I get that you appreciated her response to your son's death, but I think you need to limit time spent with her. You don't need to 'cut her off', but just don't be available very often. Also, for your self-respect, do tell her if she does or says something unacceptable. If she decides not to speak to you, so what!

Barmeyoldbat and sarahellenwhitney I did realise when we resumed our friendship how much I enjoy the parts of my occasional visit to her when she drives me around the lanes in the glorious countryside where she and I grew up.
Craicon I have searched for old friends on social media without being able to find any - just a couple of people I knew but not closely, who I don't feel a real connection with.
Springy Chicken Yes, I'm making up my mind to tell her when I'm uncomfortable with her behaviour in future.

I certainly wouldn’t touch a tiny baby in this manner but I have touched babies hands when they are sitting up and reaching or waving or peeping round bus seats So guess I m a monster too ?never thought I was though

Actually, my friend and neighbour can be rather 'forward' at times.
A couple of weeks ago in the supermarket, she had been served and wanted me served next.
She threw all the items the woman in front of me had put on the conveyer belt back into her trolley, and started putting mine in their place.

I remember when our daughter was 3 months old we took her and my Mum to Gran Canaria for a week. We never gave it a thought that some people might think it wasn't the right thing to do as we travelled all the time. We just took all the baby stuff with her and thought it would be good for her to have a bit of winter sun. Somebody on the plane made tut-tutting noises and said she thought it was scandalous to take such a small baby abroad on a plane. I didn't say anything but I was seething! she had a lovely time and was perfectly fine with three doting adults to look after her. She was being breast fed at the time so there was no problem with diet. In fact, she gave her first giggle while sitting on the sofa in that apartment! We heard it and wondered where it came from! She is 31 now and a seasoned traveller!

Certainly no to the touching and her remarks about the baby being out late sound more like my mum's generation. As far as the friendship goes these old friendships can be difficult and I understand your reluctance to let go of the only person who remembers you when young. I have one friend like this, we lived in different countries for many years and wrote letters to each other. When she came home we sort of picked up where we had left off. What we do is meet occasionally for lunch and sit for a couple of hours and discuss family, friends, old times etc, it is comforting and we then part perhaps not to meet for another six months or more. Cut back on the social events and try just visiting each other if you don't want to let go of what sounds like a difficult friendship.

Granny3rose, there is an issue with your friend touching the baby but there is also the issue of you not feeling that you can say what you think to your friend.

She didn't apoligise to you last time you became upset with her but she waited to your son died so she could turn up uninvited like a guardian angel and made you feel you had to renew the friendship. Her behavior didn't change.

I feel you should start quietly saying what you think when these things happen as you did when you put the phone down. You could be seen to be condoning her behavior if you don't say anything. If this means you loose her friendship it will be a great relief again.

Well, there’s no harm been done. If it was me I would just quietly walk or turn away so as not to be involved, and pretend it hadn’t happened. (Been there, done that) It’s up to the parents to tell her off. We lose friends as we get older (quite a few of mine have died) and personally I need my friends, (they do come in handy !!!!) So unless she’s driving you nuts I would ignore the bossy behaviour. I always do a pros and cons list if I’m unsure about something.

I don't think it should be discounted that the friend came straight away when OP's son died.
In my experience, that counts for a lot..

The last thing you need is a domineering 'friend', the way you write you do sound quite timid and slightly frightened of her, which makes this friendship sound slightly one sided. Totally wrong to touch the baby and then to critics the parents. In your position I would try to see less of this woman, you sound far too nice to have her as a friend.

School reunion pages on Facebook are a great way ton find old friends too. Look up the name of your junior/senior school - someone will have set up an “Old friends of such and such a school”

The urge to tickle a baby under the chin I huge, but never without permission. I think it's largely generational, as my grandmother and her peers would happily do this, but not acceptable nowadays. I am sure she meant nothing by it, but you are unlikely to change her.

Granny3Rose I am aghast, like the respondents I have read on page one so far! My reaction was going to be like sarahellenwhitney;
"Who needs a friend like that. You admit she dominates you so why tolerate her." Then you said about your son. I am so sorry to hear you lost a son, that is the hardest thing in life I think, to lose a child.

I think the advice here is brilliant (as usual) and I would just say to her "Nowadays" before saying "People don't do/like it if you...."

I do think that this friend may have bullied you all your life to the point that you are used to it. My own feeling is that as we get older, we need (well, I need) people around me who are caring and supportive and try to understand my feelings. Maybe, try to be a bit distant from her, reduce the number of contacts and have other friends for more regular contact? I have very few friends left from my younger days, but I have enjoyed meeting new people and making friends. I hardly see people now as I can't get out. Strangely, this is quite calming. I had some friends a bit like yours but not as full-on, and they were heavy going. I think having a small circle of really trust-worthy friends is good even if they live a long way away.

On Babies; I am just like, NfkDumpling don't touch babies or dogs without permission! Moreover, don't touch expectant mums' baby-bumps! Some people seem to think it's ok to do that too!

Good luck! You're a good person, you don't deserve to let her walk all over you. You needn't be too assertive and cause a rift, but maybe, gently protect yourself by saying your feelings in a calm way and then reduce your contact.

nanaplenty. Quote ' unfortunately it is not acceptable to be able to touch a baby'.??why? Would you want just any one. ie persons' you were not familiar with touch your baby.?It is a natural instinct for many myself included to want to have touch with a baby and know only to well the feeling as my family live the other side of the world.

Nitpick48 Thanks for that. It's very true. I will think on it too.

I’m with NitPick on this one Granny3Rose I was getting a little concerned with the amount of advice to drop your friend. I do think though that you should try and say something if she behaves in an unacceptable way. Given that you are 1 1/2 hrs away do you meet that often and is it yours, hers or neutral ground when you do meet? At the end of the day I feel that if you want to keep this friend you should do but try some damage limitation. Baby touching and criticising parents is a definite no no. Good luck.

If I see a baby a bit older than the one in the OP, I have an urge to gently squeeze a lovely chubby knee.
Perhaps I should be locked up with Bluebelle . Perhaps I'm broody.

I wouldn't do it without permission, though.

Fine to speak but never touch without parental permission.

I hink its very wrong of your friend to do this and comment on the baby being out with its parents none of her business to be honest.
When we go to visit my DGD or GGS both 3 months old now I would never dream of picking them up or going near their cribs without the permission of their mummy.

Oh I don’t get this at all are you saying don’t offer a finger or touch a baby’s hand without asking permission what a strange lot we have become I would never never touch a small baby, or a sleeping baby and I would never make remarks to a parent, and I would never touch a baby of the face tummy body or anything like that but the thought of not accepting a little hand held out to me , fills me with cold dread
As for dogs the only reason I d ask permission is cos I don’t want to get bitten ?

her behaviour re the baby is entirely wrong, but she is not your responsibility to police, nor to protect should anyone react loudly and aggressively to her interference, as they well might.
Pregnant women and their children are finally not generally regarded as being available for petting by strangers, but it was commonplace and unremarkable previously. If your friend has chosen not to learn then let her take whatever results arise from her actions.
Plenty of people have friends who remain so more by association with previous times then because of a great deal of personality in common. I don't think you should drop her because of her behaviour in this instance, but if she ever asks your opinion don't hesitate to be honest