When sexism and ageism combine...

Language is important and misogyny is rife. I do pull people up on it. I would have asked the instructor publicly why he was referring to me as young lady. Then he may realise. People working with the public need to be very aware of terms used. I work at a University and the latest change we had, our name on the headed paper now has an option for “pronouns used”. I think this is very respectful and fully support it. Why not? So I have my pronouns used: she, her. It is rude to address a male customer as Sir and a female one as luv. It is almost always women who are put down and unless we pull people up on it we are accepting the casual sexism.

I think every one is obssessed with Isms these days so much so that many feel nervous of upsetting people. I think if the shop worker had called you old lady then that is ageist but lovely is a term used widely by lots of younger people. Golf is a sport where women are tolerated because the men like to have 'mens' time on the course and women are a nuisance. Classic case was my brother played a round of golf with a woman and as she stood up to the ball, he advised her on her stance and advised her to use ladies clubs and not the men's ones she had. She replied it was ok she would be fine. This instruction continued to the next hole when she did a drive out of sight and straight into the hole. She went on to complete the course under par. It transpired she was in the England womens golf team and she had a scratch handicap. I love that story. Anyway good luck with the golf and forget about the terms of endearment.

As long as they don't call me mate or try to be patronising I'm fine! I get really annoyed if a young person tries to teach me to suck Eggs!! I was looking at some plants one day at a market stall and a very young man was trying to tell me about how to repot a plant heeven called it by a wrong name! I didn't bother correcting him!

So there's several posters now telling us to not worry about it. I'll not be paying much attention to somebody whose post includes the line Golf is a sport where women are tolerated because the men like to have 'mens' time on the course and women are a nuisance.

I'm never bothered about what names people call me as long as it's not nasty. I'm just grateful to have someone talk to me.

Dont ever underestimate what people call you. Of course it has meaning and if you don't want to be patronised inappropriately ...say so.
Keeping silent through fear is what is allowing 'woman' as a concept to be replaced by the misunderstood variously used term 'gender'. Gender being a feeling that we identify with feminity that trumps biology. ...those denying or defying this are labelled transphobic...cf JKRowling et al.

I have no issues with what I’m called unless someone is being unfriendly. It would bother me if I was in a golf lesson and others had priority attention over me because I was older or female. In New York, when buying tickets, we were asked if we were wiser citizens which we loved! If I was being called young lady and I didn’t like it, I would say, the first time, please call me Freda and I’m sure he would. Having said that, there are plenty of things that happen that I am disappointed or upset by and so I sympathise with faringdon59 as this is one of those things for her.

The way people address one another always expresses power differentials, sex, class, age whatever. In Austen’s book “Emma” the awful Mrs Elton addresses Jane Fairfax as “Jane” rather than “Miss Fairfax” and this is seen as dreadfully insulting. But these things change over time. In my youth, neighbours and shopkeepers and so on rarely used first names. It was always Mrs So and So. And children never did unless the honorary “auntie” was put first. My daughter once called her great grandmother “ Lil” and was put right. “What is this Lil?” It’s “Nan” to you! To her children she was “Mum”. Her husband was the only person still alive to call her “Lil”.

Oh dear! I wonder if I have annoyed many people in the past.

As a teacher and having great difficulty in remembering names, I referred to all male members of staff as 'Sir' and all females as 'Miss', just as my students did. I cannot remember any of the staff being upset and when I had the occasional comment from students, I explained that as I had difficulty remembering names so I took the easy way out to help things along. All my students understood as i was constantly getting names wrong in class so it was just a giggle.

I don't mind being called 'love' or whatever, although I can see why many do. When I first moved to Wales, I was chuffed the first time I was called 'bach'. When I was at uni in Edinburgh, I was often called 'hen'. My much older brother in law calls me 'young lady' . I think he can't remember my name most of the time, bless him.

Can’t stand interacting with checkout staff so I always use either self scan or self checkout wherever possible which avoids anyone addressing me at all!

Waiting to get into a shop recently with hubby. We are in our sixties. The door person said loudly she was letting this young couple in. I felt so patronised by her.

I’ve had some nasty things said to me in my time, particularly when I was working. I mean really horrible things, not just what you might call sexist remarks which never bothered me. I worked in a man’s world and was on occasion spoken to (insulted) as a man might be. So now if someone calls me ‘love’, ‘pet’, whatever, I’m delighted by their friendliness. It doesn’t make me feel patronised or that they are being over familiar. I couldn’t care less if a man is called ‘sir’ and I’m not called ‘madam’, though I confess to loving being addressed as ‘ma’am’ by Americans! There are so many things in life to worry about. I don’t feel this is one of them. Does your blood pressure no good! Try being called the c-word, as I have, and compare being called ‘young lady’, which at 70 I wouldn’t mind! I just get on with life and as another poster said, ‘don’t sweat the small stuff’. Smile and carry on!

I agree totally

They used to called endearments now as soon as one says “ you alright love” or “ excuse me dear” it’s taken as an insult, all the PC brigade using and their isms I find insulting.

Jo1960

I agree totally

I was trying to agree with a comment up thread and failed miserably! My DD just rang to say my GD has Covid & they're isolating, my back is spasming & the dog's had the runs all over the yard. I think I'll give up before anything else goes wrong!

Yeah, all this feminism stuff. I don't know why we bothered, it's not like it's important, eh?

Let's just not let it bother us

I have always objected to "young woman" or "young lady" because in my family and I think not only in mine, it was used by my father in particular as a form of rebuke when my sister and I were children.

Addressed as either young woman, or young lady we knew we had done something the grown-ups disapproved of.

I believe this usage was fairly usually in Scotland.

I have a name and a style and I see no reason why I should not be addressed as Mrs + surname, or failing that by my given names and surname.

However, it has been common in Britain to address women and girls as hen, duck, love, lovey, dear etc, for years and this will only change if a sufficient number of women object to this usage every time it crops up.

When working in outpatients, it was very easy for us to say "take a seat over here, sir" - for often we did not know the names of patients whilst they were waiting. It sounded polite and respectful.

However, there is no "english" equivalent for a lady. In America they would say "take a seat over here ma'am" and it sounds perfectly OK. But in the UK this just sounds wrong.

What would us ladies like - do you mind being called madam? It is nice when shop workers address us by some name or title - but what exactly do we want (assuming they do not know our given name).

What annoys me most about this post, is what the OP doesn’t say anything to the so called perpetrators but comes on here to moan about it. If you don’t like it say something about this silly first world problem

Personally I don’t mind I fact I am guilty of calling everyone ‘love’. However reminded me of my dad years ago....didn’t mind what he was called so long as it wasn’t late for dinner!!!!

Why not just call the instructor young man, lad, mate, sunshine or whatever. This politically correct tightrope is a nightmare.

The only name that ever really upset me was 'F..ing lamp post", as in "Look at that f...ing lamppost". I was a 5" 8" 14 year old at the time... I remember loving being called 'dearie' when I came back to Aberdeen aged 11 after a very difficult year. It felt so warm and welcoming. I did blanche a little when my fiver was referred to, by a shop assistant in England, as 'that f...ing Haggis money'.

I don't like being called "my dear", I find it very patronising, but I have yet to think up a good retort, so I usually grin and bear it.

I agree with you faringdon59. It only dawned on me recently why being called 'young lady' on occasion made me squirm a bit, then realising that I am now at 'that age' and being pitied, mocked, patronised, belittled - which is it? Some little words are so packed with connotation. There are differences in how men and woman are addressed, which just perpetuates the inequality. I also hate 'my good lady wife', but am ok with 'the boss'! ? It is right to speak out because sometimes people need educating about the language they use. My 2 year old grandchild corrects me when I say 'sweetheart' and 'darling' and tells me to use their correct name! Sir/Madam is ok I suppose and at least suggests respect, but why use any form of address at all if you don't know someone's name?