Corbyns Inertia

Little chance of me finding renewed vigour from my exhaustion .Jen

thegreatcritique.wordpress.com/2017/12/27/addressing-the-myth-of-old-labour/

An interesting article about the labour leaders and the party they led.

Corbyn has announced he is staying as leader untill 2022, sorted then.

Democracy is a process indeed:

www.facebook.com/RTUKnews/videos/1861692740787267/

So Corbyn as made his position clear- no second referendum, we are leaving.

www.markpack.org.uk/153567/jeremy-corbyn-not-advocating-second-referendum/

If you want to remain, then I'd say you only have one choice to keep up the fight, and that is for the 63% of Labour voters who want to remain to give up Labour and join Lib Dems in droves, or the Greens- then urge them to join up.

THE ONLY WAY FORWARD - and Starmer, Chuka, Emily and more should do the same- cross the floor. It was good enough for Churchill- so they can do it too.

Who is Martin Odino?

Primrose. I read the article by Holden, and another that I found. However, I didn't find them as convincing as you do. I don't have time to go into detail, but, in the meantime, you might find this report interesting:

The Great Train Robbery hummedia.manchester.ac.uk/institutes/cresc/sites/default/files/GTR%20Report%20final%205%20June%202013.pdf

Among other things it points out that the franchises are set up in such a way that they pay nothing to the Treasury until the latter years of the franchise, so they take their 'profits' early on and are free to walk away with very little penalty when their payments are due to start (which is precisely what Virgin/Stagecoach have just done with the East Coast franchise and what the previous franchisee did before the line was run by the state. It also happened with other franchises, Holden has run two on behalf of the state)

There's a lot more about funding and the hidden subsidies to the franchisees.

And some information about CRESC, which produced the report. Just in case there is any suspicion of bias. (Yes, the report was commissioned by the TUC but anyone who might accuse academics of writing what the report's commissioners want to hear would be grossly maligning the academic community)

www.cresc.ac.uk/

I read it differently.
"We are not advocating a second referendum" is not saying we will not have one.
It's just saying we are not planning for one at the moment.

He also did not say he would be leader in 2022. It's amazing what people can read into things. He said he could keep up the party's momentum until 2022 if that's when the next election is, as he's fit enough.

That RT video is good but Campbell knows they can't do it yet until signs of the public wanting to stay are better than just over equal. May will definitely lose her job if she does.
Corbyn and his front bench are still trying too get EU countries on their side, for jobs and equality. They can't go against the perceived will of the people yet, and don't need to.
People still don't trust Campbell, anyway.

I have no issue with changing the way franchising works but that's not what McDonnell is suggesting.

He's talking about renationalising.

So Corbyn is again sitting on the fence

And that's what 76% of the population want, primrose, so you're in the minority once again.

weownit.org.uk/public-solutions/support-public-ownership

I would agree with the pollsters you've chosen Jen.

"Populist thinking has a superficial attraction"

Which pollsters, primrose? You'll find quite a few polls on the link I've given.

"We are not advocating a second referendum" is not saying we will not have one.

It's just saying we are not planning for one at the moment.

Very true. It's the same elusive rhetoric when he spoke of the historic student debt.

When Corbyn said "I will deal with it" that too was ' not saying' I will deal with it. It was just saying we are not planning to do so at the moment . hmm

It's all very well using Psychobabble but eventually it comes up and bites you on the backside because nobody knows where you sit but assume the splinter from sitting on the fence is getting deeper.

Labour are supposedly a ' government in waiting' when will the voter know what the Labour policy is.

I agree with jura 2 for once and the only party that has declared it's stance is the LibDem Party.

theconversation.com/search/result?sg=8ed9efcb-fcdc-4bb8-87c2-a94522c16834&sp=1&sr=1&url=%2Fwho-dodges-more-questions-theresa-may-or-jeremy-corbyn-the-verdict-is-in-78955

Interesting research.

ah POGS made me go all warm and fuzzy that ;)

"Corbyn and his front bench are still trying too get EU countries on their side, for jobs and equality. They can't go against the perceived will of the people yet, and don't need to."

Ah, ' the will of the people'.

That has been the term that has aroused so much indignation, nastiness and bile since the referendum, even when the word 'percieved' is used.

As a Remain voter I accept the democratic vote went against me but I don't believe the Labour front bench have accepted that . If they did they would not be elusive over stating whether or not they would call for another referendum , they would accept 'the will of the people' surely .

You appear to be hedging your bets there, too, POGS, by criticising them whichever way they choose.
Just shows they are better staying where they are.

Not me ' hedging my bet ' durhamjen.

I would not 'criticize them ' if they supported the referendum result and declared / stated where they stood instead of facing two ways to appease who, what , where they are at the time it appears .

The will of the people voted us out. The Libs are against us leaving and say so, Corbyn and his baby front bench are not in or out, Corbyn wants out, some want in , I would like to know the will of the Labour front bench , are they with their leader or not.

He's talking about renationalising.

Yes, I know that, Primrose but I think his grounds for saying that are not particularly convincing and, the conclusion of the CRESC report is that the Train Operating Companies (TOCs) are, in effect, taking public money to distribute as profit (not revenue because they don't earn enough from fares etc). Which is a not very satisfactory state of affairs.

Was hoping for a response...

Interesting article in politics .co by Jonathan Lis. Addressing Corbyn’s stance towards Brexit
Some extracts-

“Whilst many labour voters voted to remain, there are swathes of seats particularly in the North and Midlands who voted emphatically for Brexit....... it would have been extremely difficult for Labour to tell those voters that their concerns were being disregarded or their votes ignored. ......their Electorial geometry was always going to require a fine balance and nuanced tone.”
But sitting aside whilst the government self destructs has certainly not done Labour any harm and recently “labour has dramatically changed its rhetoric”
Since Starmer declared labour’s support for the status quo, the direction has been one way, usually arriving at a particular destination way befor the Tories eventually arrive.

“Labour’s soft Brexit stance is now unmistakable”
“Labour has decided to move slowly and ambiguously in order to keep all of its voters onside.
“Whilst Corbyn once talked of leaving the single market whilst putting jobs first, he now recognises the incompatibility of a jobs-first Brexit which leaves a single market and keeps thousands of jobs”
Not possible.
However “ultimately (Corbyns) views are irrelevant, he is allowing Kier Starmer to chart a soft brexit course.

Corbyn is following Napoleons advice not to interrupt the enemy whilst they are making mistakes- he is playing a long clever game, that in the end could benefit us all.”

Have you noticed that it's always Keir Starmer who goes to talk to EU officials for the Labour party.
Often Corbyn and Starmer together but always Starmer. They are definitely planning Labour strategy together.

As Stamer is the shadow brexit secretary he couldn't be left out could he