Fraudulent referendum

Exactly jura! To reunite Ireland, Ulster would have to have a referendum as would the South and at the present time there isn't a cat in hells chance of Ulster agreeing on reunification! So,thanks to the arrangements made in 1922 we're stuck with what we've got! Not awfully sure that the South would want it either, bearing in mind the commotion it would cause!!! I too have Irish G.Grandparents, County Cork to be precise, but it's the North we're talking about on here, not the South!

I find it hard to comprehend Jura2 thinking. How she can possible think that an independent Country (as Ireland is ) can be a part of the UK by a merger of NI into Ireland.
Irish history is complexed enough. My view is simple if the NI electorate demanded a referendum to leave the UK and merge with Ireland, then it is the equivalent of a Brexit. What ever the NI electorate decides then having made a decision we should accept the result the majority decided

I don't think that Jura thinks that at all, MarthaB. But I'm finding this stuff about NI difficult to follow, so I may have missed a vital post...

Ireland will quite likely unite at some point in the future but that is entirely irrelevant at this time, there are far too many vested interests for that to happen at present. While Ulster is subsidized by Westminster for political gain nothing will change because most of that benefits Unionist voters. When the funding stops and they have to live in the real world a welcoming south will be much more attractive.
The way that 300 yr old battles are celebrated in the streets is a disgrace all in the name of culture, that must stop.

The only way to stop the marches is to legislate! I wouldn't want to be the government that endorses that!! The fallout could be violent to say the least!!
Of course NI may well rejoin the South at some future date by general consensus, but as these old hatreds run very deep, the prospect of that happening in the foreseeable future is virtually zilch!

Nothing to do with old hatreds, it’s the Protestants wanting to dominate the Catholics and it has no place on the 21st century.
We hated the Germans and Japanese 70 years ago and far greater atrocities were committed in WW2, a few decades later it wasn’t forgotten but most animosity was gone and well over half the cars on the roads are now German or Japanese.

a few decades later it wasn’t forgotten but most animosity was gone

But we haven't been fanning the flames for 300+ years, David.

And what I've heard and read over the past two years makes me doubt very much if animosity towards the Germans has gone

MarthaBeck - not sure how you got to that conclusion ???

As for your crossed out message MaizieD - sadly you are so right. Anti German comments and refs to the war, have been a common thread on Brexiter sites, and with Brexiters I've met. Young Germans find it totally incredible and very offensive.

My German friend, who has lived in this country for all her adult life, worked, paid taxes, was elected to the council of her professional body (in the UK) and has also been recognised by our local authority for her achievements as an elite athlete, has suffered racial abuse since the referendum, which she had never encountered in all her 25 years of living in the UK, to the extent that she has contemplated leaving the country.

Well done, Leave campaigners, you have pandered to the worst instincts of English nationalism. If I had voted leave, and was not a racist (for not all leave voters are racists), I would be thoroughly ashamed.

How would Northern Ireland referendum work?
Do you wish to leave the UK?
Yes
No.

If in the unlikely event of a yes vote would the south then hold their own referendum?

Do you (Republic of Ireland) wish to unite with Northern Ireland and become one country.
Yes
No.

If the vote is No
What then?

There has been threads on MN where MNers have suggested that a united Ireland would be in both North and South interest.
Where upon several posters from Southern Ireland have in 'MNers speak' retorted
NO - they have no wish to have Northern Ireland back!

Theresa May has been urged to confirm if ministers blocked MI5 probe into Brexit donor Arron Banks.

It has been claimed security services were prevented from ­investigating Mr Banks in 2016

www.mirror.co.uk/news/politics/theresa-urged-confirm-ministers-blocked-13525794

It has also been claimed that when she was Home Secretary she declined to act on proof of Russian money being used for political purposes in the UK.

The fraudulent 2016 referendum should be declared illegal and Article 50 revoked before any more harm is done to the UK.

Have I got this right. The Electoral Commission says that there is plenty of evidence of fraud, interference, foreign/illegal money and more- to make the result of the Referendum void.

But they cannot do so because the Referendum, by Law- was advisory- and the electoral commission cannot interfere with a non binding referendum ?!?!?!?!?!

This is totally crazy - and people still go on with 'the will of the people' and 'respecting the referendum' - sheer madness.

Seems also increasingly clear that the Police have been and are being, prevented from investigating? And people talk about 'Democracy?. Talk about banana Republic

I can assure you David, that hatreds in NI go far far deeper and far far longer than 70 years, much much further than anything felt for Germany or Japan . Even now children go to different schools, people live in predominately Catholic or Protestant areas, in many areas life is dominated by the division with neither side wanting to have too much to do with the other. You're right,there is no place for that in the 21st cent,but first persuade the two sides in NI of that feeling!!!!

Exactly Jabberwok those of us who have some understanding of NI know exactly how things are there.

The potentially explosive problem in Northern Ireland could be solved quite simply, by doing what the majority in Northern Ireland have always wanted, and the majority in the whole of the UK have also wanted for at least the last eighteen months- revoke Article 50 and Remain in the EU.

"We should not ask people to vote on a blank sheet of paper and tell them to trust us to fill in the details afterwards. For referendums to be fair and compatible with our parliamentary process, we need the electors to be as well informed as possible and to know exactly what they are voting for. Referendums need to be treated as an addition to the parliamentary process, not as a substitute for it."

David Davis addressing the HOC 26 November 2002 (Hansard col 201)

I actually agree with DD on this. I know the quitters like to say they all knew exactly what they were voting for "leave means leave" , "brexit means brexit" and all the rest of the nonsense, but how could they possibly have known ? It was utterly absurd to expect a simple answer to a very complicated question. It was a blank sheet of paper.

The extent of Russian-backed fraud means the referendum is invalid

blogs.lse.ac.uk/brexit/2018/11/14/the-extent-of-russian-backed-fraud-means-the-referendum-is-invalid/

Vote Leave has been fined £40,000 for sending thousands of unsolicited text messages in the run-up to the EU referendum.

The organisation sent 196,154 messages and was unable to provide evidence recipients had consented, as required by electronic marketing law.

They said Vote Leave claimed it had deleted evidence of consent relied upon to send the messages after the referendum in 2016.

ICO director of investigations Steve Eckersley said: “Spam texts are a real nuisance for millions of people and we will take action against organisations who disregard the law.

“Direct marketing is not just about selling products and services, it’s also about promoting an organisation’s aims and ideals.

“Political campaigns and parties, like any other organisations, have to comply with the law.”

It comes on the same day that Labour Leave were fined £9,000 for failing to disclose all donations to their campaign.

www.theneweuropean.co.uk/top-stories/another-fine-for-vote-leave-for-sending-spam-texts-during-brexit-campaign-1-5946375

Halt Brexit For A Public Inquiry

The UK's departure from the EU looms but questions remain about the legitimacy of the Referendum. The Electoral Commission said illegal overspending occurred during the Referendum. Were the vote/any subsequent political acts affected? Article 50 was triggered. Was the overspend known about then?

petition.parliament.uk/petitions/241848?fbclid=IwAR1JR-DJt0kt4KsdwMf-WVSpjdjASSSAqbga7uTfGZRH-M_nKdw5kMCd_4c

Vote Leave has dropped its appeal against a £61,000 fine for electoral offences committed during the Brexit referendum.

The fine was imposed on the group, which was the lead campaigner for a leave vote, last year after the Electoral Commission concluded that it broke legal spending limits by donating hundreds of thousands of pounds to another leave campaigner, the then 22-year-old fashion student Darren Grimes, founder of BeLeave.

Vote Leave appealed against the fine, claiming that its donation to Grimes had been signed off by the commission. Supporters of the group suggested, without evidence, that commission staff were opposed to leaving the EU and were persecuting leave campaigners.

However, in a statement released on Friday afternoon, the Electoral Commission said Vote Leave had withdrawn its appeal. “We found that [Vote Leave] broke the electoral rules set out by parliament to ensure fairness, confidence and legitimacy at an electoral event,” it said.

“Serious offences such as these undermine public confidence in our system, and it is vital, therefore, that they are properly investigated and sanctioned. We have been advised that Vote Leave has paid its £61,000 fine and look forward to receiving the sum in full.”

www.theguardian.com/politics/2019/mar/29/vote-leave-drops-appeal-against-fine-for-electoral-offences

6 posts varian on the bounce! Brexit seems to have given you a new lease of life.
?

You too Urmstongran.

So, Gove and BJ have dropped their appeal re the fraudulent extra 625.000 spent on the Leave campaign. I wonder why hmmmmm - I think we should ensure that it is not forgotten and links properly investigated- what have they got to hide - now they want the top post (*of forbid)

www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2019/mar/30/gove-johnson-under-fire-vote-leave-fine-appeal-dropped?fbclid=IwAR2TbHLyZWhSL6pIqNPF-f6GIjtG3QlTCdlXGKnSlBKOfEi2Qcvlotsn8Ro

Certain people have lot to say and most of it repetitious hot air...with links to more of the same.
Nothing they say will alter the outcome one jot.
I'd really not want to be in a room with such people, it's a recipe for high BP and a heart attack. The venom is palpable.