and it ties us to the EU indefinitely.
The Irish backstop could be the least of our worries.
May's WA must be rejected completely. It is an incredibly complicated document leaving hardly a subject not covered, and everything in it has been designed to be beneficial to the EU.
I doubt if any MP has read it from cover to cover. Nearly every paragraph is cross-referenced to a Treaty, Regulation or Directive, and each one has to be looked up, read and understood before moving on. It takes hours.
So says John Ashworth in his article This EU-written Withdrawal Agreement is toxic from start to finish
www.conservativewoman.co.uk/this-eu-written-withdrawal-agreement-is-toxic-from-start-to-finish/
It is a very revealing article, written by someone who has made an effort to link the words to the many treaties, acts and sub-paragraphs which determine the UK's role after a decidedly dodgy exit (or non-exit as it transpires) from the EU.
It is very worrying.
He concludes
During any transition period, we would not be classified as a ‘third country’, so although technically one could claim that we had left the EU, in practical terms, we *wouldn’t have done so – rather the opposite*
We would effectively be controlled by the EU to such a degree that we might just as well shut our Parliament down
We would finally become a ‘third country’ on 1 January 2023, as it is doubtful that the EU would consider an extension other than on the previous transition terms, which would essentially mean that we would still not have left the EU in any meaningful way
We would still be paying our ongoing fees, at full rate, to the EU. The EU would still control our fisheries and our armed forces and we would still be subject to the European Court of Justice, with our Parliament still essentially sidelined. No one in their right minds could want us to be in such a situation
We do not want Brexit in name only (BRINO) which is what the WA will give us, if our only request is the dropping of the backstop.
Boris, must be careful. May's WA is a non-starter. Farage, in waiting, understands that the WA has to be rejected - in full.
joelsnan you are implying that somehow the U.K., Germany, France and Italy are all the same in terms of manufacturing. They aren’t. UK governments have not supported manufacturing in the same way as other similar nations. It is disingenuous to suggest otherwise.
crystaltipps
I agree UK have not supported their industries as much as they potentially could this since Margaret Thatcher’s dream of turning UK into a service provider rather than a manufacturing base.
I also agree that a number of governments have paid little attention to manufacturing as it was not regarded as a major revenue source but forgetting all of the social and employment support it provided within the communities in which it was based.
However, the UKs need to comply has also held it back when other EU countries have often ignored the EU competition directives to support their industries and UK will not.
Major assemblies are often manufactured in close proximity to the car plant, sometimes on site, the components that go into them could come from anywhere and they have their own JIT needs. Electronic systems very often originate from far eastern countries, low tech parts from a wide range of sources.
Good oh.
The government caved in at 1.20 this morning over the Lords filibuster.
Stop no deal has won! For now.
What you forget is that although we buy/sell a lot of goods to/from the EU, we are not tied to these arrangements once we leave. I doubt there is very little that cannot be sourced elsewhere at potentially more favourable rates. The rest of the world do not exclusively rely on the EU and manage to live and trade well
Yes, Joelsnan
It seems lots of Remainers don't understand that or don't have the capacity to imagine a world outside the EU, which works very well for countries not bound by the Brussels strait jacket and enormous fees.
Growstuff, in reply I'd say many Remainers go in for hysterical hyperbole. Some are past masters in wild negative speculation and painting their predicted end-of-the-world scenarios whenever they can.
In turn, I wonder why you seem to follow me around only to use disparaging and pejorative language in reply to my posts?
I wish someone would point out some of the hysterical hyperbole posted by remainers.
Check some of the rabid leaver posts like firecracker 's accusations of traitors and treason and show me anything remotely as ott!
mcem
Sadly there are some on both sides subjected to the condition known as ‘selective cognition’. Whereby they only see and here what they want as it reinforces their ideologies and prevents the stressful need to re-evaluate.
Well who knew I was a Rabid Leaver lol, I just thought I was a Gran who voted Leave and expected the Government to follow through on their promises Deal or No Deal, I don't care now I just want to Leave the EU fullstop.
www.facebook.com/Channel4News/videos/821651028297456/
will you take responsibility for the consequences - for your kids, family, grandkids, neighbours? Will you take a share of the massive lies- because when you knowingly stand up by those lies, they become yours too.
Perhaps we should have a register, so that the ones who voted Leave and would still want to do so, even though they now know the consequences- will be the ones to go without the drugs and treatments if and when they require them.
Same as people who refuse to be Donors should be last on the list to receive organs, if and when.
jura2 - off topic but I completely agree with your comment re. donors - IMO if a person is not willing to donate their organs, they should not expect to recive them, either.
Jura do you really believe this rubbish you post.
yes, thank you. Do you?
Terry Christian was censored by twitter for posting similar ideas to jura2
To be denied medication due to ones voting history......really ?
jura2
Are you for real?
Why not be fair and register all sides and for each lie each side is proven to have told or believed we could take them out and publicly flog or tie them to a dunking stool. Does that sound good to you?
the ones who voted Leave and would still want to do so, even though they now know the consequences- will be the ones to go without the drugs and treatments if and when they require them
What a disgusting thing to write jura
Are you by any chance related to the awful Terry Christian who was condemned by all sides for his view?
Intellectually and morally it's not a good idea, GG13; it has obvious implications for refusal to treat other conditions. But as an emotional, kneejerk reaction it has some appeal...
Message deleted by Gransnet. Here's a link to our Talk Guidelines.
jura2 you cannot be serious ( one hopes not!)
If you are not an organ donor, not allowed a transplant?
If you are a Leave voter, put at the bottom of the queue for any surgery or essential medication.
Ye Gods!
Still, the other ‘liberals’ on this site may agree with you,
humptydumpty does for a start.
MaizieD wants to agree but can’t quite bring herself to.
Who else agrees I wonder? ( This should be interesting.)?
JN, that's some insult you threw out there.
Lessismore
Shouldn't that comment be directed to Jura2 and MaisieD or are you also in agreement with their sentiments?
The hatred of some Remainers towards Leavers on here is unbelievable at times.
sentiments or not , to suggest people change their user names to those creatures is very , very nasty.
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