Why are "Leavers" so angry?

No abbey I wouldn't and I'm one of the first WASPI women to be affected. There was absolutely no argument that the pension ages for men and women should have been equalised. Why shouldn't they be equal?

I wasnt talking about equality. I am pretty tired of this herring coming up. I too am one of those waspi women who has been caught by my pension age being moved three times . I am talking about the raising of pension ages from 65 to 66 and then 67 and 68 in close succession. That was the EU sticking its finger in.

"how could we possibly be better off if we left the EU?" This was what occurred to me in the referendum and no Brexiteer gave me a rational answer. They said it'll be sorted and not to worry about it. The reason they gave me for voting leave was that there were too many immigrants, we are swamped, etc. Now, these were all women in different groups I'm in, in the U3A mostly. Nearly all were professionals, highly educated and aged between 68-94. Out of 50 of them only a handful of us voted remain. None of them could given us any information as to what impact Brexit would have on the economy or what the economy would look like or how we'd get there. I was so extremely surprised that they didn't give a damn about the economy to ask the very basic questions it begged some answers for before voting one way or the other. Since then, I've become very, very, very disappointed with such highly educated professionals and almost all the politicians who failed to address this issue well before and after the referendum. They should have known better before they put it to people. Now I expect them all to put their hands up and say they made a grave mistake by not studying the pros and cons of Brexit and not debating it in the H of P before considering to put it to people. They should have been extremely well informed about the consequences and made the public aware of them too. As it happened, neither they nor the people possessed enough information to make an informed decision. Now so many politician know and they are trying their damnedest to stop this possible national suicide. Who says that anyone should carry out a plausible or bad decision just because they made it!? We do change our minds if we find out our decision wasn't right in our daily lives, no? We're human after all and allowed to make mistakes and learn from them if we can't rectify them. Also the majority isn't always right and any democrat knows that. That's why they are able to be open enough to change their thoughts and ways once new or better information lands in their hands. I'm still waiting to hear "how could we possibly be better off if we left the EU?" from all the Brexiteers. I'm open enough to rational answers to this question to become a Brexiteer.

I am sorry Graces GRan but you need to check your facts. the British government changed the pension rules to come into line with the EU

You see, there are lots of rules you think were made by the Tories ( which they were ) but they were made because we were in the EU. Pensions is one of them

I think you are possibly wrong on this, abbey. Pensionable age varies hugely across the EU member states and I can find no directives which prevent member states from setting their own pensionable ages.

What I can find is directives on the conduct of pension fund investment and transferability of pensions between member states for EU citizens not living in their own country.

If you have any different information I'd be glad to look at it.

If you take the time and trouble to look , you will see that ALL EU countries are coming into a common pension age within the same time frame as ours raises to 68. This was an EU directive. Got it now?

Yes, they do currently have a number of different retirement ages but they are all aiming at the same one as we are being pushed toward.

I voted to remain.
I am neither a drunk nor a scrounger.
I have worked hard for many years and was fortunate to receive my state pension at 60.
I always have and still do pay tax.
I guess I am not alone in that.
Do you think you might just have exaggerated a little with your sweeping generalisation?
Happy to accept a retraction!

You seem to have missed my post up-page, abbey, so I will post it again:

" There is a misconception that state pension age equalisation was required under European law In fact, there was a specific derogation for state pensions in Council Directive (EEC) 79/7 on the progressive implementation of the principle of equal treatment for men and women in matters of social security."

That is the Department of Work and pensions who are stating quite clearly that what you claim is a miscpnception. Or don't you believe them either?

OH for Christs sakes!!!!! I am not talking about the equalisation of men and womens pension ages. I am taking about the move fo pension ages toward a 68 for all - this is across the EU.

Why do you always have to bring in your misconceptions and try and make them stick?

You are wrong once again. You arent listening. You arent readong. You arent informed. Thats what a remain mindset does for you.

Angry - yes I bloody well am. Sick and tired of dealing with people who just do not get what is happening

I’m not posting on this thread any more.

Pity you're angry.
Have to admit I am a tad miffed at having such unjustified insults hurled at me.
OTOH your posts go to show that perhaps there's just a grain of truth in posts that say some leavers are the angry insult chuckers.

I am sorry Graces Gran but you need to check your facts. the British government changed the pension rules to come into line with the EU.

And on this sloppy reasoning you blame the EU and decide we must all change the status quo Abbey. The EU directive specifically required Member States to ensure that there was no direct or indirect discrimination whatsoever on grounds of sex. Maybe you disagree with this and would have voted against it but I have a feeling a majority would have been in favour, as was our government.

How member States did this was entirely up to them. The Waspie women are entirely a creation of UK government's and yes, it has been grossly unfair but it was not the EU, it was the UK government.

I will give you another one - then I am clearing off and you can be a nicey group of silly remainers together supporting each other - just like a convention of tarts.

The EU directed that cars should have weights and emissions criteria. To meet these many manufacturers had to remove the old spare tyre from the car and put those nasty little cans in their place ( first they tried thew safety tire but even that got too heavy .... especially since they love the Thunberg so much) .

So now we have those nasty little cans for punctures and if you want a tyre you have to order it separately and have it sitting in your boot taking up space.

Of course a lot of EU motor manufacturers lied about their emmissions and now we are all going to pay the price for that too .

The world will take care of itself. the soon she decides she doesnt like humanity any more the better in my view. At least we will get rid of you remainers.

Now I have to go to bed because I have to work my butt off to pay for the EU to be you wet nurse, unlike you crying remainers I suspect.

Instead of getting so angry, perhaps you could just
provide a link to support what you are saying about retirement ages accross the EU, abbey.

Message deleted by Gransnet. Here's a link to our Talk Guidelines.

Message deleted by Gransnet. Here's a link to our Talk Guidelines.

It's late. Off to bed and maybe before you launch into your next undeserved attack on us you might like to add more water.

Why give you a link? You wouldnt believe it if I stuck it on your faces. You would have to plead that it was false news or something. I have seen it being done above. If it doesnt fit your world view it cant be right can it?

Narow minded? Yopu dont even qualify for that label in my opinion - and mine is as good as any of yours!

So now we have those nasty little cans for punctures and if you want a tyre you have to order it separately and have it sitting in your boot taking up space.

Well, I've just bought a 2 year old French car and it has a nice, proper, spare wheel sitting in its boot...standard issue with this brand...

So sorry you hate us for pointing out that your not always right...

Ubndeserved mcem? You deserve all you get! I have had to put up with it for three years or more now. Time to give it back a bit.

@MamaCaz

Two years ago I had a car with a spare tyre too. I ordered it and paid the additional costs and tax for it. I buy new cars. Now I have a nasty can thing and I asked for a spare tyre and got one..... so when you pick up my old car you will say " but I bought a two year old car with a spare tyre in it".

It wont change the facts. It just means they are not in your experience.

Big mistake on our part, then, asking for evidence...

Just believe, everyone...

Message deleted by Gransnet. Here's a link to our Talk Guidelines.

I refer you to my post of 21.12 where I point out that I am not a scrounger, have always worked and paid taxes and still do. Hence my comment that your condemnations are not justified.