Does anyone believe BJ has any intention of negotiating a Deal with EU?

So who is going to pay for the higher wages? Individuals or councils? The owners will simply walk away, if they don't make enough profit and councils are already putting up council tax above inflation to pay for care. The families of individuals will squeal if their inheritance is reduced. So what's the answer?

I honestly can't see wages rising significantly. The availability of care, especially in the home, will become even more difficult to access and standards will fall. There simply aren't enough people with the right qualities and skills in the UK to do the work.

Just seen suzie's post and realised mine is a duplicate.

I know little directly about care homes but from what I read and the contributions from suzie and growstuff who clearly do know more, the sector is in crisis and when the economic system is basically right wing and profit oriented, you NEVER get a solution that involves raising the wages of the workers.

I suppose workers going on strike is a possibility but let's think back to the 1980s..... a strike in the care home sector would be a moral dilemma for the workers and I can just see the feast of headlines in the tabloids!

I seem to remember that recently there was a suggestion that the companies who run care homes might start operating in Thailand where there is supposedly an abundance of low paid workers?

The alternative which seems to me unsaid but there in the suggestions of others is that the UK has a raft of what might be called shirkers who earn lots from cash in hand jobs and who should be forced to work in low paid jobs instead of living a 'creative lifestyle'. Who are these people? I've never met one and the supposed remedy involving them smacks of forced contraception for the unintelligent recently suggested by a lackey of Dom. Lovely.

Growstuff- indeed- who is going to pay for the higher wages- and how much will be carried through to the customer?

Personally, I think what they want is to open up to very profitable automisation- it is a vast multi billion industry waiting to happen. The same technique described by Chomsky is being used. Take away cheap labour- within a short pace of time, it turns into a disaster- and the door is open to privatisation- or in this case 'robots'. Simple ... in a way.

My post is about industry and farming. Not Care Homes, of course.

POGS- here you are- this is where my info re Brexit job losses comes from

smallbusinessprices.co.uk/brexit-index/

Urmstongran '' Ask jura2 why she’s bringing it up ad nauseum?''

Considering I've been off the Forum for a while, lol ...

The problem is, that many Brexiters thought that after Jan 31st- 'Brexit would be done' - and many of us warned that it would not be and take years- and will probably not be done by Dec 2020. And yet, most of us believed Boris, having signed the withdrawal agreement, would stick to what he has signed up for and would honestly do his best to secure a Deal.

It is now abundantly clear to many, if not to you- that he has no intention to adhering to the Withdrawal Agreement- and is doing everything he can to derail all attempts- with the intention of going for No Deal at the last minute- throwing is hands up and say 'oh we did our best (ahahaha) but the EU just was intransigeant and refused to play (our silly) game...

No Deal would leave us with WTO only- and WTO has warned that this would not be possible.

And you wonder why we bring the subject up 'ad nauseum'? We are in a really weak, destructive and disastrous situation right now. But keep waving your dream of a blue passport ...(it will make no difference, for sure).

Iain Dunca-Smith has now come out with this gem- oh the irony 'It is time for Experts to take over Brexit matters as there are problems ahead'

No poo Sherlock

I think in Japan they are already using robots in care homes. Alexa embodied, ugh.

jura2 I did only mean on this thread (about care homes). I know you went AWOL for a while (I recall you wanted to ‘ban’ yourself so that you wouldn’t be tempted to come back!). I did in fact say ‘hi’ and that it was nice to see you posting again but got no response.

Sorry to be pedantic but yes you did mention care homes earlier on this thread!

message jura2 Sun 23-Feb-20 22:17:09
Here is a square circle for you to solve. How can UK unemployed fill in the 10s of 1000s of vacancies in care homes and agriculture then- if we don't have any unemployed???

Away from care homes and back to the OP.... about Boris & deal or no deal with his negotiating team.

I think Boris is right to set a final date. If he didn't the EU would dilly dally to suck more cash from the UK!

It is Deal or No Deal.

Prefer the first but ready to go for the latter.

Your choice EU.
?

'' I did in fact say ‘hi’ and that it was nice to see you posting again but got no response.'' yes you did- and it was nice, thanks. Didn't realise you expected a response.

Did you not say that had very low un-employment now? In which case, how can the small number of unemployed fill the vast number of vacancies which need filling right now- and which will vastly increase in number as and when Priti Patel's new immigration rules are put in place?

As said, Schrödiger's immigrant- who at the same time, takes your job and remains idle and sponge on the system.

No Deal will hurt all- but would be much more of a disaster for UK.

I find all this jubilant lip smacking at the prospect of the rapid decline of the UK very distasteful...

I fear we will get no deal by default. BJ has lost interest now there is nothing tangible that he can 'win'. He may have teams of people working away but his leadership skills are poor and he has no appetite for detail. I think their work will dwindle away and away and fade out out with a wimper. More hasted careers.

jura2 Mon 24-Feb-20 10:13:29

'POGS- here you are- this is where my info re Brexit job losses comes from'
----

Thank you for replying and ' confirming ' I was correct in my thought as to who you were quoting from .

However my post Mon 24-Feb-20 00:01:27 asked you:-

' What do you know about ' Small Buisiness Prices ' as a company to which I believe your post of 21.58 is quoting from?'
----

Do you have any knowledge who is behind ' Small Business Prices'?

No, I do not- honest answer. do you? Always happy to learn.

Ha! I think POGS is about to jump on you from a great height, jura

smallbusinessprices.co.uk/about/

MaizieD Mon 24-Feb-20 17:01:16

' I find all this jubilant lip smacking at the prospect of the rapid decline of the UK very distasteful...'
-

That is a statement that can be attributed to those on 'BOTH ' sides of this ruddy argument.

I'm not lip smacking, POGS, I'm bloody devastated.

Regarding care homes, the large for-profit providers came about because Mrs Thatcher didn't like local authorities 'trading with themselves' in terms of both providing the homes and financing the care.
Now austerity cuts have left local government with no money with which to pay the higher costs needed to pay care workers a respectable wage.

[Wasted of course, not hasted in last line of my previous post!]

Maizie d

You don't need to use silly emojis to make your point.

As I was the one to mention where Jura was quoting from do you not think I did not due diligence and read their site which says:-

WE ARE AN GENERAL BUSINESS INFORMATION-ONLY WEBSITE AND NOT AUTHORISED OR REGULATED BY THE FCA.

I know there are so many political organisations, foreign countries who hide behind what appears to be credible sources I was interested to know if Jura had any information further to the site.

I found for example some of the comments interesting:-

'You are completely right, also they don’t say how many are lost by nothing to do with Brexit. It’s become boring the doom and gloom they constantly print. To date none of there peddling has been right.'
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'Please do not post inaccurancies or lies as it only gives unionists anmmunition and defeats your intent. Michelin is listed in this list and they have ? denied they are making redundancies due to brexit. I am a remainder and a yesser and do not condone this. Have you double/triple checked before posting?'
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' Can you tell me when you started counting the job losses and business closures? Was it from the date of the referendum, the date the tories won election on promise of referendum or the date the referendum result was announced?'
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' Since Brexit was announced The amount of people unemployed as decreased through all these job losses that must’ve been more jobs created. There for brexit it was a good move to get the the country in employment.'
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' 669,855 new companies in 2018, up 4.6% on 2017
– Record-high 217,000 new London businesses
– 1 million more UK companies now compared to 2013'
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'You need to full publish the quotes from the employers and the full statistics. Because you ideology with this is INCORRECT
you cannot blame all of these job losses on Brexit. From your stats in this article Many and too many to mention have been losses due to the Influx of EU cash to reduce that industry to zero in the UK by moving it to the EU. I strongly suggest you check it all out. Oh are you receiving any form od cash from the EU to produce this as propaganda.'
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' House of Fraser lost 12,500 jobs?
How did you arrive at that?

Number of employees: 6,000 direct, 11,500 concession according to Wikipedia'
---

To be fair there were plenty of comments in the opposite direction but I apologise to no-one for wanting to know the true source of where and whom information comes from.

I am not accusing neither any GN poster nor the company of being Underhanded, politically motivated, being a political organisation, I simply like to know the legitimacy of a source I am being asked to accept as factual evidence. Don't you?

I think these care packages need cross-party discussion & agreement don’t you winterwhite? It affects us all, one way and another. It can no longer be underfunded & a political football.

Cross party support ??? .Urm your leader doesn’t even allow his nodding dogs to have opinions on anything so the idea he’d want to discuss it cross party ????The truth is he doesn’t give a flying gig about social care and knows even less.

Fig <sigh>