Latest from Ukraine

Pammie1

GrannyGravy13

According to Sky News President Putin is threatening to use nuclear missiles if Sweden and Finland join NATO…

No, he’s not threatening to use nuclear missiles - he’s threatening to deploy hypersonic and nuclear missile systems in Russia’s Kaliningrad exclave - between Poland and Lithuania. This would effectively end any thought of a nuclear free Baltic, as Russia has said it needs to ‘restore the balance’ and keep NATO away from its’ borders. It’s intended to intimidate Finland and Sweden into abandoning ideas of joining NATO as they would then have to live with nuclear weapons and hypersonic missiles close to home as a result.

This was sorted at the beginning of this thread?

Quite good. www.youtube.com/watch?v=dpHCAg-s1aA&list=PLFFlkwe10TJMu3PoOwHbYRdG_XqOYTYBq&index=13

I’m feeling so saddened by these events. This morning I watched the report on Mariupol and the whole city is devastated. Apparently about twenty thousand of it’s residents are dead. And now Putin says his troops must make a ring of steel that even a a fly can’t penetrate. What will happen to the remaining residents and armed forces?

It is so very sad for the Ukrainians and Ukraine.
If Europe doesn’t do something for a counter attack other counties will be invaded.

The remaining military are determined to stay till the bitter end maddyone
How much longer can the world watch the Ukrainians begging for more weapons?
Germany says it hasnt enough to protect its self, so it wont be sending any from now on.
I think they will provide financial assistance still though.

Boris was in India, trying to pursued them to stop sitting on the fence maybe?
I know they are going to buy the Russian oil that Europe wont be, and they already buy Russian arms.
You may be right mokryna

What will happen to the remaining residents and armed forces?
I heard on one news programme that many are underground and he plans to block them in where they will die.

Just barbaric and still he lies and calls it "liberation".
It's mass murder. The man is demented.

My question was actually a rhetorical one. I also think that the residents who are left and the armed forces who are in Mariupol will either all, or mainly die. They will starve to death in the underground cellars and catacombs, or they will be murdered and dumped in a mass grave. It’s too awful to contemplate. My heart feels like breaking when I think of this.

Why is the rest of the world letting this happen?

There was a really good piece on Today this morning by Fiona Hill*

www.bbc.co.uk/sounds/play/m0016pg8 around 1:40:30+

*Fiona Hill is a former official at the U.S. National Security Council specializing in Russian and European affairs.

DaisyAnne

There was a really good piece on Today this morning by Fiona Hill*

www.bbc.co.uk/sounds/play/m0016pg8 around 1:40:30+

*Fiona Hill is a former official at the U.S. National Security Council specializing in Russian and European affairs.

I got a report on voting in NI at that point, DaisyAnne, then seemed to go to sport.

Was it before those reports?

nadateturbe

Why is the rest of the world letting this happen?

I wish I knew nadateturbe. I think it’s all about nuclear weapons, but I’m not sure. How can we keep watching this on our televisions every day and do nothing?

It is maddyone, but exactly how much does the rest of the world let Russia get away with without deciding we must do more. Where will Putin stop if there is nothing and no one stopping him.

Sorry Maizie. Try 1:14:28, I think that will work.

Unfortunately most of the world doesnt see things from the wests point of view.
I wonder if Putin thinks if he carries on putting the pressure on Europe (over gas oil and arms etc.), the impetus to keep opposing him will fragment?

Why didn't Ukraine leader just agree not to join Nato, seems better than having to go to war. Now seems like Sweeden and Norway are adding fuel to the fire. Bound to piss Putin off even more. How about every country just doesn't go to war!!!

I think you mean Finland. Not Norway. Whole different country. Norway was a founding member of NATO.

Do you think Ukraine should just hand over a bit of their country to Putin? Surely that would be better than going to war?

Grannynebard

Why didn't Ukraine leader just agree not to join Nato, seems better than having to go to war. Now seems like Sweeden and Norway are adding fuel to the fire. Bound to piss Putin off even more. How about every country just doesn't go to war!!!

I think you will find that Putin would have invaded Ukraine whatever Volodymyr Zelenskyy had said or done. Putin had, and still has, his very particular agenda designed to keep him in power. Over-simplifying that isn't going to help Ukraine or any other country.

Kasperov, Khodorkovsky, and Bowden all people who have had close quarter business dealings with Putin, and actually know him (opposed to those who have only had diplomatic dealings with him) are categoric Putin only thinks in terms of power through conflict.
This war has been going on since at least 2014. There is NO way he would back off if Ukraine gave him what he wanted.

It's been very interesting for me to read what the ex pm of Finland says about the last 30 odd years of walking on eggshells politically, as they share a boarder with Russia.

I saw a news report today showing Putin attending church in Russia today. Church? Putin? The two words don’t belong in the same sentence.

No they don't Maddyone.

Sadly they do. The fall of Communism and the loss of the Empire that Russia had known shocked the county. Putin used the church to give cohesion to the state. Since Russia’s invasion of Ukraine, the leader of the Russian Orthodox Church has defended Russia’s actions and blamed the conflict on the West. However, some brave priests have spoken out about the part Russia is playing.

Whether they support Russia or not, surely the wholesale destruction of life and cities must make them wonder about their leader? They are a civilised and educated people so I can only think that somehow Putin has managed to block all the news that we seem to be getting. Disturbing.

I expect Putin has as much tight control of the Russian church establishment as he does of every other part of Russian life. They wouldn't dare speak out...

(This is what the tories would like for the UK, of course )

I'm afraid we cannot know nanna. The religious leaders in Russia are, I would guess, influenced by the limited and biased information they are getting like all the rest of the country is. The evidence we have seen in many countries over recent years and comparatively recent history shows that being "civilised and educated" does not stop people from holding extremist views. It's disturbing when we look at Putin's attack on western democracy but it's also disturbing when we look at attacks on that democracy from within the western democratic countries. It is not only in Russia where people think attacking others and destroying the democratic norms makes them stronger.

We have been through a minor version of government dictatorship during Covid when we had a night curfew and were only allowed to travel 5 kms. That was a Labour government of course. They tend to like controlling people. It went on for 2 whole years . Ridiculous when you have all the expense of night time helicopter patrols making sure the roads were empty. Not at all comparable with the dreadful Russian onslaught though the mindset of those left wing dictators is familiar.