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Speaking the truth about brexit

(543 Posts)
varian Sat 04-Jun-22 19:39:18

Sir Anthony Gormley whose mother was German has just applied to become a German citizen and of course an EU citizen. He tells the truth about brexit. It is time more public figures told the truth about this self afflicted disaster.

www.theguardian.com/artanddesign/2022/jun/04/antony-gormley-to-become-german-citizen-due-to-tragedy-of-brexit

Urmstongran Tue 14-Jun-22 07:58:16

No idea what the new laws cover. You could Google it I suppose if you want to find out? That the DUP say it is enough for me. Brussels has no choice but to make EU/UK trade difficult - anything even remotely seamless and it'll have another 27 'exits' to deal with.

growstuff Tue 14-Jun-22 08:03:50

OK! I did the research myself. The new laws were all caused by Brexit and relate mainly to medicines, food, plant and animal health. The laws aren't "new", but ensure that Northern Ireland continues to have the same access as the rest of the UK (therefore no change), whilst ensuring that they don't enter the single market. The only effect on Northern Ireland is that it can't export/import from to/from the EU without checks. The same kind of laws have had to be introduced in the rest of the UK, which is why there's been an explosion in red tape. Has the Telegraph reported those?

Whitewavemark2 Tue 14-Jun-22 08:04:08

The EU allowed a part of the territory of a 3rd country to be inside the Single Market (for free) to prevent an Irish land border and all they asked in return is to respect the Single Market rules.

growstuff Tue 14-Jun-22 08:06:39

I did Google it and found it.

I can't believe that anybody would accept anything the DUP says!!

The EU hasn't made anything more difficult. Its hand was forced by the situation and has had to issue the laws to make trade between NI and the rest of the UK seamless.

Maybe you're the one who should check what the DUP says and the Telegraph reports.

Urmstongran Tue 14-Jun-22 08:06:55

I wish we’d gone WTO. Placating the EU has been a fool’s errand but we are where we are. And toughening up. At last.

Urmstongran Tue 14-Jun-22 08:09:14

The ROI was happy with electronic monitoring (trusted traders etc) until the EU pointed out that a border in the Irish sea was a long step to a unified Ireland. That’s what this is all about. The long game.

growstuff Tue 14-Jun-22 08:09:45

The UK isn't "placating" the EU. The UK made its own decision and is whinging about the inevitable consequences. The EU is being the adult in the situation and having to deal with the fall out.

growstuff Tue 14-Jun-22 08:10:50

Urmstongran

The ROI was happy with electronic monitoring (trusted traders etc) until the EU pointed out that a border in the Irish sea was a long step to a unified Ireland. That’s what this is all about. The long game.

So you would want to turn NI into a smuggler's paradise?

Jeez!

MaizieD Tue 14-Jun-22 08:21:21

growstuff

What do the new laws cover?

And where did that weird snippet of 'information' come from?

NI are doing very nicely out of the NIP. The only people who don't like it are the DUP. Johnson is just pandering to the ERG.

growstuff Tue 14-Jun-22 08:23:50

MaizieD

growstuff

What do the new laws cover?

And where did that weird snippet of 'information' come from?

NI are doing very nicely out of the NIP. The only people who don't like it are the DUP. Johnson is just pandering to the ERG.

The only source appears to be the Telegraph.

MaizieD Tue 14-Jun-22 08:26:23

Ah. Overtaken by faster typers.

I really don't know why we bother to respond to such nonsense, though.

Whitewavemark2 Tue 14-Jun-22 08:32:37

MaizieD

Ah. Overtaken by faster typers.

I really don't know why we bother to respond to such nonsense, though.

Exactly. Other threads can be included.

vegansrock Tue 14-Jun-22 08:36:20

No response from the Brexit cult followed as to why no action on animal welfare standards apart from to make them lower - we were promised they would be higher. Makes me hate this Brexshitter government even more.

RichmondPark Tue 14-Jun-22 08:37:35

anything even remotely seamless and it'll have another 27 'exits' to deal with.

Unlikely once they look at the state of our economy compared to nations within the EU.

growstuff Tue 14-Jun-22 08:47:26

MaizieD

Ah. Overtaken by faster typers.

I really don't know why we bother to respond to such nonsense, though.

Maybe in the hope that such misinformation gets stopped in its tracks and doesn't enter the mainstream as the truth.

volver Tue 14-Jun-22 08:54:13

Maybe in the hope that such misinformation gets stopped in its tracks and doesn't enter the mainstream as the truth.

This. Definitely this.

Whitewavemark2 Tue 14-Jun-22 09:01:16

volver

^Maybe in the hope that such misinformation gets stopped in its tracks and doesn't enter the mainstream as the truth.^

This. Definitely this.

True. But flogging dead horses often springs to mind.

volver Tue 14-Jun-22 09:16:17

We're always being told that there are many people who read and don't post (Hello to you all ??‍♀️) I always hope that some people see all the posts and take a broader view, not just believe the rot churned out by the apologists for this government.

DaisyAnne Tue 14-Jun-22 09:26:22

RichmondPark

*anything even remotely seamless and it'll have another 27 'exits' to deal with.*

Unlikely once they look at the state of our economy compared to nations within the EU.

Quite. From the outside looking in which other countries would like to be the UK right now?

We were not a "great power" anymore, even when we joined the EU. The whole point was to be part of the world's largest trading bloc and second-largest economy.

What we did have was soft power that we had honed for centuries. This government have now thrown that away too.

We now look more and more like a banana republic.

Allsorts Tue 14-Jun-22 09:40:08

Your truth isn’t what most of us sees. Look at the countries in debt, Greece, Portugal, a list of them, just Google it. I believe in sound facts, sure Brexit needs tweaking, every transition dies and everything worth while,

volver Tue 14-Jun-22 09:41:36

Do we need to have the "truth is absolute" discussion again?

Brexit needs tweaking. That's a corker.

growstuff Tue 14-Jun-22 09:58:43

Allsorts

Your truth isn’t what most of us sees. Look at the countries in debt, Greece, Portugal, a list of them, just Google it. I believe in sound facts, sure Brexit needs tweaking, every transition dies and everything worth while,

What do you mean by "most of us"?

growstuff Tue 14-Jun-22 10:02:28

Nobody's denying that some EU countries have economic woes, just as the UK does. That's because they're sovereign countries and behave independently of the EU most of the time.

The "truth" about the 4,000 new laws in NI is somewhat different from the one which the DUP and Telegraph would like people to believe. That was the only so-called "truth" I was challenging.

Petera Tue 14-Jun-22 10:57:37

Allsorts

Your truth isn’t what most of us sees. Look at the countries in debt, Greece, Portugal, a list of them, just Google it. I believe in sound facts, sure Brexit needs tweaking, every transition dies and everything worth while,

The UK debt is just over 100% of GDP, the average EU debt is just over 75% of GDP.

Of the 27 EU countries, 7 have a higher debt to GDP ratio, 20 a lower. Just Google it.

Can we tweak Brexit in the direction of the EU performance?

growstuff Tue 14-Jun-22 11:04:49

Japan's debt is 266% of GDP. I've never read that Japan is about to go bankrupt and collapse.