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Islamaphobia is getting out of control

(764 Posts)
Whitewavemark2 Sat 24-Feb-24 07:13:37

We have Braverman and Anderson stirring up the most awful Islamaphobia.

I don’t think that we have ever had British MPs saying such racist and hateful rhetoric since Mosely. They are being backed by the worst sort of editorship. It is so redolent of the 20s and 30s.

Jewish and Christian leaders are calling for it to stop, as well as Tories who see this as a disaster for their party, as it will never ever end well.

Rory Stewart

This idea that “London is in the grip of Islamists” is deluded and it’s awful - an obsession that thrives among a bizarre and dangerous coalition. No conservative MP should ever be spouting this stuff.

growstuff Mon 26-Feb-24 20:55:16

Joseann

Re protesters at Waterloo, it looks like Liverpool Street had similar problems.
Note the masks too.

Maybe they didn't want to catch Covid. Those masks are hardly an effective disguise.

Joseann Mon 26-Feb-24 20:57:06

Joseann

Re protesters at Waterloo, it looks like Liverpool Street had similar problems.
Note the masks too.

Sorry, football fans at Waterloo. (Thought they might have been protesting about something?)

Urmstongran Mon 26-Feb-24 20:58:14

Mask wearers can now be arrested by the Police at a demo.
Good. It’s a start.

Iam64 Mon 26-Feb-24 20:58:56

Some of the recent comments about what it is to be Muslim tend to confirm the oP

growstuff Mon 26-Feb-24 21:00:52

Urmstongran

Mask wearers can now be arrested by the Police at a demo.
Good. It’s a start.

And if I just want to protect myself from Covid in a crowd?

growstuff Mon 26-Feb-24 21:01:19

Iam64

Some of the recent comments about what it is to be Muslim tend to confirm the oP

Well said! They certainly do.

Joseann Mon 26-Feb-24 21:03:50

growstuff

Joseann

Re protesters at Waterloo, it looks like Liverpool Street had similar problems.
Note the masks too.

Maybe they didn't want to catch Covid. Those masks are hardly an effective disguise.

If you'd said that about covid and masks in 2020, 2021, 2022, 2023 I might have agreed. But this was only a few months ago and I've not seem anynumber of mask wearers during my visits to Paddington, Heathrow or any travel hub.

Urmstongran Mon 26-Feb-24 21:07:11

Islam is not a race. It is not racist to criticise a religion.

growstuff Mon 26-Feb-24 21:13:09

Baroness Warsi and the APPG cross party think Islamophobia exists.

growstuff Mon 26-Feb-24 21:15:36

Urmstongran

Islam is not a race. It is not racist to criticise a religion.

There is only one race - the human race.

"Racist" has a specific meaning which covers hatred of people belonging to a religious or national group. Presumably you don't think anti-semitism is racist. By that reasoning, you obviously think that doesn't exist either.

Galaxy Mon 26-Feb-24 21:56:56

Is that the meaning in the equality act? I think those characteristics are seperate in that legislation

SeaWoozle Mon 26-Feb-24 21:58:23

Iam64
growstuff

There are those here who consistently show us who they really are.

Shameful.

Galaxy Mon 26-Feb-24 21:59:44

Or separate even if you prefer the correct spelling.

Callistemon21 Mon 26-Feb-24 23:09:18

growstuff

Urmstongran

Islam is not a race. It is not racist to criticise a religion.

There is only one race - the human race.

"Racist" has a specific meaning which covers hatred of people belonging to a religious or national group. Presumably you don't think anti-semitism is racist. By that reasoning, you obviously think that doesn't exist either.

That has already been discussed and biologically yes, but sociologically there are different races.

If there is only one race there would be no need for Race Relations Acts and ergo no-one could claim to be the victim of racial discrimination.

Callistemon21 Mon 26-Feb-24 23:15:02

The law recognises five types of hate crime on the basis of:

Race
Religion
Disability
Sexual orientation
Transgender identity

Callistemon21 Mon 26-Feb-24 23:16:32

Galaxy

Is that the meaning in the equality act? I think those characteristics are seperate in that legislation

Types of discrimination ('protected characteristics')
It is against the law to discriminate against anyone because of:

age
gender reassignment
being married or in a civil partnership
being pregnant or on maternity leave
disability
race including colour, nationality, ethnic or national origin
religion or belief
sex
sexual orientation

Yes, race and religion are separate.

Callistemon21 Mon 26-Feb-24 23:20:03

growstuff

Urmstongran

Mask wearers can now be arrested by the Police at a demo.
Good. It’s a start.

And if I just want to protect myself from Covid in a crowd?

There are still some people wearing those in shops; I did wonder if I should.

growstuff Mon 26-Feb-24 23:31:22

Callistemon21

growstuff

Urmstongran

Mask wearers can now be arrested by the Police at a demo.
Good. It’s a start.

And if I just want to protect myself from Covid in a crowd?

There are still some people wearing those in shops; I did wonder if I should.

I still haven't had Covid, so I haven't a clue how immune I am. I don't wear a mask outdoors, but I still have one with me and wear it in some places like crowded trains.

growstuff Mon 26-Feb-24 23:48:32

Callistemon21

growstuff

Urmstongran

Islam is not a race. It is not racist to criticise a religion.

There is only one race - the human race.

"Racist" has a specific meaning which covers hatred of people belonging to a religious or national group. Presumably you don't think anti-semitism is racist. By that reasoning, you obviously think that doesn't exist either.

That has already been discussed and biologically yes, but sociologically there are different races.

If there is only one race there would be no need for Race Relations Acts and ergo no-one could claim to be the victim of racial discrimination.

From a scientific point of view, there really is only one race. It is impossible to divide the human race into separate races because there is a huge overlap in haploid groups, although it was tried in the eighteenth, nineteenth and early twentieth centuries.

Racist and racism are modern concepts, which have generally been accepted, to describe discrimination based on (usually) physical characteristics. There's a good explanation in Adam Rutherford's "How to argue with a racist".

In any case, that's a red herring. Discrimination does exist. Anti-semitism exists, as does Islamophobia (whatever anybody chooses to call it). Ironically, Palestinians are closer genetically to Jews whose ancestry is in the middle East and round the Mediterranean than those same Jews are to Jews who have immigrated to Israel from Eastern Europe. Evidence suggests they have relatively recent (in terms of human development) common ancestry.

Doodledog Mon 26-Feb-24 23:56:01

We really are going to Hell in a handcart.

I've just watched Peston, on which Jon Ronson was a guest talking about conspiracy theories, and it was mentioned that something like 30% of people believe in the Great Replacement Theory (ie that white people are deliberately being replaced by people of other colours). I think that may have been in the US, but all the same. 30%. It's insane.

Galaxy Tue 27-Feb-24 06:13:22

Why wouldnt they though? I imagine if you are unable to believe much of the information provided by the likes of the BBC, told you are stupid for the way you vote or the paper you read, all sorts of odd things might look appealing.

growstuff Tue 27-Feb-24 06:51:02

Galaxy

Why wouldnt they though? I imagine if you are unable to believe much of the information provided by the likes of the BBC, told you are stupid for the way you vote or the paper you read, all sorts of odd things might look appealing.

So where would you find believable information?

Galaxy Tue 27-Feb-24 06:55:24

That's the problem. People end up in echo chambers or dangerous places but I cant really say that its their fault. Someone has just quoted Biden on another thread, am I supposed to see that as a source of wisdom? Or take it in any way seriously. I am not having a go at that poster it's just there is a limit to the nonsense people will swallow.

Chocolatelovinggran Tue 27-Feb-24 07:35:02

I carry and read a Bible and sing hymns and have never been arrested for these activities ( although my singing might incite violence amongst those with delicate ears) . Does it happen a lot where you live Freya?

Galaxy Tue 27-Feb-24 07:36:47

I am not sure 'this thing that people are claiming to happen has never happened to me' is that helpful. All sorts of things havent happened to me. I believe they exist though.