The UK population is in decline

growstuff

I don't suppose you happen to know how many females are signed up for the apprenticeships Freya?

No I don't, not in the know re intakes. Personally I know one young lady who is an Engineer and one who has nearly completed
her Engineering degree. Looking at the local area at least 7, already qualified, and holding high profile jobs, one of whom is chair of Renewables in our area. At a local skills fair, for 14 to 15 year old females , interested in STEM a huge employer in the area , lauched a program specifically for women to help more of them into engineering, especially in the renewables. They also stated "we employ above the national average of female engineers who are spearheading decarbonisation research". So certainly here females are being encouraged to choose engineering.

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Freya5

growstuff

I don't suppose you happen to know how many females are signed up for the apprenticeships Freya?

No I don't, not in the know re intakes. Personally I know one young lady who is an Engineer and one who has nearly completed
her Engineering degree. Looking at the local area at least 7, already qualified, and holding high profile jobs, one of whom is chair of Renewables in our area. At a local skills fair, for 14 to 15 year old females , interested in STEM a huge employer in the area , lauched a program specifically for women to help more of them into engineering, especially in the renewables. They also stated "we employ above the national average of female engineers who are spearheading decarbonisation research". So certainly here females are being encouraged to choose engineering.

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Sorry as usual didn't read your quote properly, but at least you're aware of girls being encouraged into apprenticeships .

Freya5

Freya5

growstuff

I don't suppose you happen to know how many females are signed up for the apprenticeships Freya?

No I don't, not in the know re intakes. Personally I know one young lady who is an Engineer and one who has nearly completed
her Engineering degree. Looking at the local area at least 7, already qualified, and holding high profile jobs, one of whom is chair of Renewables in our area. At a local skills fair, for 14 to 15 year old females , interested in STEM a huge employer in the area , lauched a program specifically for women to help more of them into engineering, especially in the renewables. They also stated "we employ above the national average of female engineers who are spearheading decarbonisation research". So certainly here females are being encouraged to choose engineering.

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Sorry as usual didn't read your quote properly, but at least you're aware of girls being encouraged into apprenticeships .

One more addendum looking at the website, it states"there are female students in apprenticeships at the Instute, including in the trades."
Oh dear, have gone on,but at least it makes people aware that in our little corner we are have been quite ahead of the times.

Freya5

growstuff

I don't suppose you happen to know how many females are signed up for the apprenticeships Freya?

No I don't, not in the know re intakes. Personally I know one young lady who is an Engineer and one who has nearly completed
her Engineering degree. Looking at the local area at least 7, already qualified, and holding high profile jobs, one of whom is chair of Renewables in our area. At a local skills fair, for 14 to 15 year old females , interested in STEM a huge employer in the area , lauched a program specifically for women to help more of them into engineering, especially in the renewables. They also stated "we employ above the national average of female engineers who are spearheading decarbonisation research". So certainly here females are being encouraged to choose engineering.

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But they probably wouldn't have come through the apprenticeship route. Thanks for answering anyway.

Casdon

I presume the vast majority of immigrants came to the UK either as students or to work though Grantanow, so isn’t a relatively small number in Scotland due more to there not being so many students there and less jobs offered to them?

Exactly. The SNP has failed to develop employment opportunities.

Grantanow

Casdon

I presume the vast majority of immigrants came to the UK either as students or to work though Grantanow, so isn’t a relatively small number in Scotland due more to there not being so many students there and less jobs offered to them?

Exactly. The SNP has failed to develop employment opportunities.

I don’t know enough about Scotland to comment on that, I don’t know if they are already self sufficient in the areas of work that migrants do elsewhere in the UK or not.

The first women engineers graduated in the early 1960s. I can remember several at university with me then.

In the 1980s and 1990s. I worked with quite a number of women with engineering degrees. Career paths were certainly more difficult, but there were plenty of female graduate engineers.

DD started with a degree in acting and then did a OU degree in science and engineering in her 40s.

We have just returned from a coach tour to Germany and almost every coach had a at least one female driver, away from home for over a week, just like the male drivers.

The fact that some GN members haven't seen and do not know any female engineers (graduate or apprentice trained) doesn't mean that there are now a lot of them about.

Maybe what Peter Costello, our then treasurer, said ‘ one for mum, one for dad and one for your country’. That was in 2002, and a ‘baby bonus’ accompanied it. Have to say I thought it was a bit odd at the time. Still, it probably worked short term.

As @Terribul states many of the reasons women are opting to be childfree or to have less children are economic. Mainly the astronomical cost of childcare and housing in this country. However birthrates are in decline across Europe, including the Scandi countries where childcare is much cheaper and there is not the same housing crisis.

There are other reasons which have less to do with economics than with personal and ethical choices.

Climate activists do not want to bring more consumers and generators of waste into a world that is already over burdened and contaminated. They fear for the future of their children in such a world.

Some women just do not want children for health related or personal reasons. They look at "family life" and think it looks like a lot of hard work for no special reward. Having children does not serve their needs.

The stigma against women who choose to remain childfree is rapidly disappearing and old fashioned. I can remember a friend of mine telling me (1960s) I would be a "lonely old maid" if I didnt marry and have children. The attitide towards childfree women then (from those who had children) was one of pity because they had no managed to attract a partner. Now it is more likely to be a deep envy for loss of a lifestyle that was sacrificed on the altar of breeding the next generation.

Almost all my closest friends and family from childhood onwards have been single and childless.

I had 2 aunts, both born before 1920, who were single, childless and had successful well paid careers, one in the civil service, the other held a senior nursing position. Neither of my sisters has had children, my closest friends from school, university and several from work have remained single and childless.

It has never occurred to me to ask them why they are childless. I wasn't really interested. I do know some would have liked to marry and have children, because they said so. DD decided when she was 4 that she didnt want children when she grew up and decided at 20, she would prefer to live alone and not have a partner. She said (quite correctly) that she was too uncompromising to sustain a relationship.

I cannot remember all this poking and prying and deploring unmarried women. I was brought up just to accept people for what they are,

The fact that some GN members haven't seen and do not know any female engineers (graduate or apprentice trained) doesn't mean that there are now a lot of them about

We have two in our family (graduates) now but I remember few young women on engineering degree or HND courses in the mid-1960s, just one of two at our College of Technology then, (I was in a different department).
There may have been others in other areas of the country of course.

M0nica I can recall a time when people might have referred to your aunts as "maiden ladies" or old maids. You never hear these expressions now and they come across as so old fashioned. Relics of a time when woman felt thay had to "wait to be asked" by a man.

The aunt who never married because she was too uncompromising sounds like me. I just found that I had no wish to live on intimate terms with any one person for the whole of my life. My grandmother said I was so choosy that if I wanted a man I would have to knit myself one!

I was never a great fan of knitting.

I think my main point remains. The UK would have a declining population without significant immigration to boost numbers, especially at the younger age range. Without immigration there would be fewer workers to do all kinds of necessary jobs (including in the NHS and care sectors) and pay taxes to support public services. This has consequences: the UK culture will change over time and cultural differences will impact on politics. Governments have been slow to respond - partly because they fear the voters - and have failed to develop housing and other facilities to meet population increase from immigration. The Tories weaponized immigration in an attempt to hang on to power while doing nothing.