Man made famine - the world should be ashamed

However, there is a world of difference between famine brought on by natural causes, the economic system, the result of war etc and a famine that is a deliberate act of war and entirely within the remit of a government - members of whom have declared genocide on a group of oppressed people.

Famine is famine and in this day and age all famine is human-made. The niceties you worry aabout completely elude me, famine is as much genocide in Somalia as in Gaza.

But we can all wring our hands and donate a few quid, butthe question is 'How do you stop it'. Everything else is irrelevant

What we thought of Israel as a civilised country has shocked so many with its use of starvation as a weapon of war and the unrelenting killing of the innocent.

M0nica

^However, there is a world of difference between famine brought on by natural causes, the economic system, the result of war etc and a famine that is a deliberate act of war and entirely within the remit of a government - members of whom have declared genocide on a group of oppressed people.^

Famine is famine and in this day and age all famine is human-made. The niceties you worry aabout completely elude me, famine is as much genocide in Somalia as in Gaza.

But we can all wring our hands and donate a few quid, butthe question is 'How do you stop it'. Everything else is irrelevant

There would be no famine if Israel had not enforced a complete blockade.

Not a single person would have died from hunger.

That is the difference, and I am surprised that the difference has eluded you.

A military chief in Israel wants Netanyahu to take the hostage deal and cease fighting.
He says the IDF soldiers are exhausted and want no more killing.

Israel will not and cannot continue with Hamas in Gaza. The problem is for Israel to solve. Germany will have to accept that the two State solution is not going to work.
If any country takes on Israel, don’t expect a complacent target. Israel is fighting for its survival.
If the accusations of widespread famine are true, how many Gazans should have died by now of hunger? 2 in every 10,000 daily is one estimate. Leaving 9,998 not?

Quote AGAA4 Mon 25-Aug-25 09:47:05
A military chief in Israel wants Netanyahu to take the hostage deal and cease fighting.
He says the IDF soldiers are exhausted and want no more killing.

This may be true or not, a statement from one person doesn’t mean true, he will have support of his claim and we will know

ronib so you think two people dying of starvation is acceptable? People can live for a long time on little food but will be suffering.
Not getting enough food causes extreme pain and exhaustion.
The weakest will die.

None of this war is remotely acceptable. It is a further shame that Western democracies have not been able to show real leadership and initiative instead of taking pot shots from the sidelines.

ronib

None of this war is remotely acceptable. It is a further shame that Western democracies have not been able to show real leadership and initiative instead of taking pot shots from the sidelines.

It is no shame at all that European democracies have been unable to solve the Gaza disaster. Failure to stop something, doesn't mean that those trying to sort the problem are failures that they are in no position to solve

Foreign governments can do all they can to intervene, but unless those taking part are prepared to co-operate there is nothing anyone can do to stop them.

The fact of the matter is that the only people who can do anything to stop these famines are those directly involved in them.

A non-famine country, but look at Ukraine. Trump is determined to get his Nobel Peace price and he has been talking Putin now, for nearly 8 months. Where has it got him? absolutely nowhere. This problem he was going to solve in 24 hours. Why? Because Putin is determined to conquer Ukraine and take it over, full stop and Trump is in no position to do aanything to change Putin's mind

The same basic reasoning applies in Gaza. The only solution is military operation. Troops from NATO, possibly, or Saudi Arabia, or Dubai, actually invading Israel and stopping the genocide.

There is no other way. They have all been tried.

Invade Israel yet again

It just feels all very wrong Monica. I think Trump has limited influence over Netanyahu and it’s a case of waiting to see next moves in the coming months.
Technically at the moment, there is no genocide in Gaza and I hope it stays that way.

Trump has huge power over Netanyahu if he wants to use it. If he stops sending military and economic aid, which has been over 310Billion dollars since the creation of Israel, more than any other country, Trump would have Netanyahu at his mercy. With regard to genocide, I think that will be proven once this terrible war is finished which is a good reason for Netanyahu to continue it.

I wouldn't want Israel to be invaded. Netanyahu was unpopular with the Israelis even before this war and is even more so by many.
I wouldn't want those who are against this extreme regime to suffer.

If a foreign army went into Gaza and chased the IDF back to Israel that would stop this but I don't think that will happen as it could cause a world war.

If

Quote foxie48 Mon 25-Aug-25 12:02:45
Trump has huge power over Netanyahu if he wants to use it. If he stops sending military and economic aid, which has been over 310Billion dollars since the creation of Israel, more than any other country, Trump would have Netanyahu at his mercy. With regard to genocide, I think that will be proven once this terrible war is finished which is a good reason for Netanyahu to continue it.

Many here claim genocide has been proven.

Genocide is being proven on a daily basis.

foxie48

Trump has huge power over Netanyahu if he wants to use it. If he stops sending military and economic aid, which has been over 310Billion dollars since the creation of Israel, more than any other country, Trump would have Netanyahu at his mercy. With regard to genocide, I think that will be proven once this terrible war is finished which is a good reason for Netanyahu to continue it.

Trump is never going to try to stop Netanyahu, he loves what he perceives to be ‘strong leaders’ but which most other intelligent people might perceive as ‘bloodthirsty despots’. And he is first and foremost a business man - though in actual fact he was never a very successful one - and wants to invest in a new Gaza, with five star hotels, casinos, and without doubt a golf course.

Smileless2012

Genocide is being proven on a daily basis.

Indeed.
With even allies in the West now distancing themselves from Netanyahu and calling him out.

Israel murders four more journalists this morning in a strike on Gaza's Nasser hospital.

(Presumably Israel will tell us that Maryam Abu Daqqa was a Hamas commander too)

They then murdered the first responders who had gone to help people

190 journalists have been killed by Israel in the last 22 months.
To kill journalists is a war crime.
20 people were killed in an attack on the hospital.
Israel said they were targeting just one with no evidence that they were involved with Hamas.
Israel's killing spree goes on.

ronib

It just feels all very wrong Monica. I think Trump has limited influence over Netanyahu and it’s a case of waiting to see next moves in the coming months.
Technically at the moment, there is no genocide in Gaza and I hope it stays that way.

If your baby dies of starvation I'm not sure the technicalities would give you much comfort.

ronib

It just feels all very wrong Monica. I think Trump has limited influence over Netanyahu and it’s a case of waiting to see next moves in the coming months.
Technically at the moment, there is no genocide in Gaza and I hope it stays that way.

Things may feel wrong, but this is real-politic. the simple fact that however much you may want to do something, on many occasions you can't and have no alternative other than to stand by and watch as people suffer

Anniebach

Quote AGAA4 Mon 25-Aug-25 09:47:05
A military chief in Israel wants Netanyahu to take the hostage deal and cease fighting.
He says the IDF soldiers are exhausted and want no more killing.

This may be true or not, a statement from one person doesn’t mean true, he will have support of his claim and we will know

Just like Israel had support of its claim that Hamas were using hospitals as a base. But did they? I remember a photo of some guns the Israelis released, but BBC have never been able to verify either the photo or the Israeli claim of Hamas using the hospitals. Neither has any international healthcare worker reported seeing evidence of this.
It is very prejudiced to question picture after picture of starving children, adults, horses and those statements of Israeli commanders which contradict what you want to believe while at the same time repeating any official Israeli statements as if proven fact.

Quote valdavi Mon 25-Aug-25 14:26:01
Anniebach
Quote AGAA4 Mon 25-Aug-25 09:47:05
A military chief in Israel wants Netanyahu to take the hostage deal and cease fighting.
He says the IDF soldiers are exhausted and want no more killing.

This may be true or not, a statement from one person doesn’t mean true, he will have support of his claim and we will know
Just like Israel had support of its claim that Hamas were using hospitals as a base. But did they? I remember a photo of some guns the Israelis released, but BBC have never been able to verify either the photo or the Israeli claim of Hamas using the hospitals. Neither has any international healthcare worker reported seeing evidence of this.
It is very prejudiced to question picture after picture of starving children, adults, horses and those statements of Israeli commanders which contradict what you want to believe while at the same time repeating any official Israeli statements as if proven fact.

I have seen three photographs of children sadly suffering from a serious , physical health illnesses., photographs of 2 starving Israeli hostages , horses ? ? Pass .

I would like to suggest that posters who want to refer to someone else’s post just say bloggs’ post at whatever time and date . Rather than type out in its entirety bloggs’ post, before responding at the very end in a few short words.
It’s confusing., as in some cases it’s easy to think the poster has had a mind change, IYSWIM.
It would also save the responding poster a lot of time too.

silverlining48

I would like to suggest that posters who want to refer to someone else’s post just say bloggs’ post at whatever time and date . Rather than type out in its entirety bloggs’ post, before responding at the very end in a few short words.
It’s confusing., as in some cases it’s easy to think the poster has had a mind change, IYSWIM.
It would also save the responding poster a lot of time too.

silverlining48 I can't agree with you. Sometimes the post referred to is several pages back meaning everyone has to scroll back to find it. Use of the quote function is better as that post is then contained in its own separate box as yours is in this post.
I doubt anyone is typing out whole reams of other's posts they'll be using copy and paste, but I agree it can be difficult to separate out the various contributions. If C&P is preferred putting ^ at each end of the copied text (no spaces) puts it into italics showing a quote. eg It’s confusing., as in some cases it’s easy to think the poster has had a mind change, IYSWIM.