Manchester Synagogue Attack

Galaxy

Because of course others aren't in an echo chamber of their own.

I think most people are capable of independent thought actually. Trying to shut people with different views down achieves nothing but to make threads more confrontational.

Galaxy

Because of course others aren't in an echo chamber of their own.

Their own echo chambers reverberate with a force 6 or 7 at least on the Richter Scale the merest whisper of Farage and the effect is so strong it can open up a chasm so deep it could swallow the capital

I’m away, intermittent WiFi, so caught up two days of comments here.
It’s fraught isn’t it, Polarised shouting and too little calm reflection on the awful events in Manchester.
I’m aware skim reading several pages may have left me with incorrect impressions. I’m also influenced by having direct knowledge of some members of the synagogue

Thank you from me to grannygravy and Oreo, to Galaxy . Why is it we still have posters labouring to stress criticising Netanyahu isn’t anti semitic. Theshocking idea that Keir Starmer can’t be independent or unbiased because his wife is Jewish.
Heaven help us

TerriBull

Galaxy

Because of course others aren't in an echo chamber of their own.

Their own echo chambers reverberate with a force 6 or 7 at least on the Richter Scale the merest whisper of Farage and the effect is so strong it can open up a chasm so deep it could swallow the capital

I don’t buy it. I don’t think there really are echo chambers. I think different topics draw people with strong views about that topic. It’s not an organised movement of right v left, or whatever other grouping you care to name.

I agree that it isn't about left and right, I am not even sure those terms mean much anymore.

www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/ceq2e9x19g8o

That was 1500 police not able to offer protection to our Jewish communities. I do hope those arrested for wilfully breaking the law won't be expecting sympathy when they show zero empathy or respect for a community grieving.

Babs, your posts are kind and fair, more than can be said by some who have their own agenda. Best leave them to it.

Just for the sake of clarification, do some posters still conflate being anti Netanyahu with being anti-semitic?
Perhaps I am mis-reading a post upthread.

I suggest anyone who is confused as to why this thread became very unpleasant should go back to the very first page and see how very quickly the distress for those affected by this horrible attack became a reason to start linking it to Palestine and the terrible events of 07/10.

Maremia

Just for the sake of clarification, do some posters still conflate being anti Netanyahu with being anti-semitic?
Perhaps I am mis-reading a post upthread.

The words of some suggest they do.

Allsorts

Babs, your posts are kind and fair, more than can be said by some who have their own agenda. Best leave them to it.

The only agenda here is sympathy for the Jewish men murdered and injured in Manchester.There simply is nothing else.
Posters can criticise BN all they like, but it would be better on the Gaza thread wouldn’t it.
This attack does have much to do with the situation between Israel and hamas, as the perpetrator was influenced by extreme Islamist propaganda according to police and his Syrian father endorsed hamas many times.
Jewish people are shocked and hurting that this has happened and mentally preparing for more.

sunami

Maremia

Just for the sake of clarification, do some posters still conflate being anti Netanyahu with being anti-semitic?
Perhaps I am mis-reading a post upthread.

The words of some suggest they do.

No, they just don’t.

Perhaps I'll do as you suggest foxie, and look back to the beginning to see who first brought up the subject of Palestine.

Oreo

sunami

Maremia

Just for the sake of clarification, do some posters still conflate being anti Netanyahu with being anti-semitic?
Perhaps I am mis-reading a post upthread.

The words of some suggest they do.

No, they just don’t.

I cannot agree with you. I've seen the evidence with my own eyes.

Oreo

I just knew something would happen today, the blatant and the half hidden anti-semitism started days after 7th October 2023.
Started with two cars full of Muslim Palestinian supporters driving around Golders Green aggressively shouting abuse at Jews and waving Palestinian flags.They were arrested and probably just given a warning.It all continued from there ever since leading to today.Just thankful that the responders were ready for it.Despicable and disgusting indeed ferry.

It was Oreo who first brought it up, as per above, on the first page.

Alluding to October 7th followed by the first demonstrations at Golders Green.

Totally clear.

And I have to say, very pejorative: you appear to be conflating us ordinary Gaza supporters who have great sympathy for whats happening in Manchester

With those early extremists, which I find most offensive.

Yup, you started it?

I strongly believe that it isn't just for Jews to speak out against antisemitism, but that non-Jews need to speak their minds too against the hostility shown towards Jewish people.

foxie48

I suggest anyone who is confused as to why this thread became very unpleasant should go back to the very first page and see how very quickly the distress for those affected by this horrible attack became a reason to start linking it to Palestine and the terrible events of 07/10.

Unfortunately Jews in this country know for a fact that hate incidents towards them increased a lot since 7th October hamas attacks in Israel, within days in fact.That and the killer was named Jihad, so there is definite linkage which simply cannot be denied.

Wyllow3 I find your posts very very peculiar given that a terrible thing has just occurred and both I and several members on this thread are Jewish.Don’t you possess empathy?
‘Yup you started it’ ….is that really what you want to say?
Started what btw, stated honestly the incidents that are affecting and worrying British Jews ever since 7th October, the second anniversary of which occurs in a couple of days.

escaped

I strongly believe that it isn't just for Jews to speak out against antisemitism, but that non-Jews need to speak their minds too against the hostility shown towards Jewish people.

Thank you! Yes definitely, every little helps and is much appreciated.😃

Erm... Oreo ....just above you said

The only agenda here is sympathy for the Jewish men murdered and injured in Manchester.There simply is nothing else

Then I pointed out you were the first one to stray from that....so now you return to

"Unfortunately Jews in this country know for a fact that hate incidents towards them increased a lot since 7th October hamas attacks in Israel, within days in fact.That and the killer was named Jihad, so there is definite linkage which simply cannot be denied."

His name was given to him by his Dad, it wasn't a chosen name x years ago, I dont think he was a Jihadist in his cradle?

I have limited empathy when someone has just contradicted themselves then hits out at me to try and cover it up.

It’s all linked Wyllow3 and am amazed that you refuse to see it.

Wyllow3

I have limited empathy when someone has just contradicted themselves then hits out at me to try and cover it up.

Listen to yourself!
I have neither contradicted myself and neither am I ‘hitting out’ at you, rather am trying to get you to understand that the antisemitism has ramped up since two years ago, leading to what’s just happened at the synagogue.It’s linked.I would say you’re showing zilch empathy not limited.

Iam64

I’m away, intermittent WiFi, so caught up two days of comments here.
It’s fraught isn’t it, Polarised shouting and too little calm reflection on the awful events in Manchester.
I’m aware skim reading several pages may have left me with incorrect impressions. I’m also influenced by having direct knowledge of some members of the synagogue

Thank you from me to grannygravy and Oreo, to Galaxy . Why is it we still have posters labouring to stress criticising Netanyahu isn’t anti semitic. Theshocking idea that Keir Starmer can’t be independent or unbiased because his wife is Jewish.
Heaven help us

Thank you, very kind.

Oreo

escaped

I strongly believe that it isn't just for Jews to speak out against antisemitism, but that non-Jews need to speak their minds too against the hostility shown towards Jewish people.

Thank you! Yes definitely, every little helps and is much appreciated.😃

This report may be of interest, Oreo

[[UK Parliament
committees.parliament.uk/writtenevidence/135727/html/
Below is an excerpt:
An independent review by Dame Sara Khan on Social Cohesion and Democratic Resilience, published in March 2024, highlighted the importance of social cohesion and the challenges faced by various communities, the Jewish community being one of them. Khan mentions in her report that: ‘Hate crime figures ending in March 2022 found that despite making up less than one percent of the total religious population, antisemitic hate crimes accounted for 23% of all religious hate crimes in the UK.’[1] Unfortunately, antisemitic hate crime has increased sharply in the UK since the start of the most recent war between Israel and Hamas.[2] In 2024, The Community Security Trust (CST) recorded the highest number of antisemitic incidents since it began collecting such data, with Jews subjected to antisemitism in public spaces, educational settings, workplaces and more. This has had a profound effect on individual wellbeing, on the Jewish community’s feeling of safety and on social divisions.

Frightening times.