Let's start a blitz on bad grammar - nationwide

Hi raggygranny. I think the religious divide was much greater in the 60s and 70s than now. The Freemasons hold their annual picnic at a Catholic school these days... my old headmaster would have been horrified to see his brethren mingling with papists!

Regarding haitch instead of aitch, I queried this at my lads' catholic primary school, and the headmaster told me that this mistake had been brought over to Australia by the catholic teaching nuns from Ireland. he had tried to eradicate it, without success!!

There is an opinion that this started at middle class catholic schools, but the one they went to was decidedly working class! It is across the board in catholic education.

''gone missing' What is wrong with 'disappeared'?

I am enjoying my visits to Pedants' corner...thank you

Yes, this is the one that drives me nuts! I think all shop assistants should be trained to say " No, you may not get it. It is my job to get it for you. You may have it, with pleasure."

That was in response to Gigi, btw. Other irritants are "amount" when used in relation to people - it should be the "number" of people, and the word "led" which has all but disappeared from the language as a result of almost everyone mistakenly writing "lead".

Quite apart from cutlery, have you seen how children and young people hold a pen or pencil these days? Their writing action is so contorted that they have to place the paper on which they are writing at a right angle or even more.

I spent hours of my first days at school learning writing technique. Which reminds me ...... never noticed how my grandsons write. Hopefully their mother will have dealt with such ugly writing methods.

Can't stand hearing that someone has "fell pregnant" surely one is pregnant or was pregnant.
I can't think how this expression has become such accepted terminology.

Sorry, I meant to say that table manners should be taught at home. It is certainly not up to the schools to do so. Perhaps the poor use of cutlery can be ascribed to some extent to the lack of families sitting around the table together for main meals. There again, I regularly see adults with the most appalling table manners so their children have little chance of using cutlery properly given the bad example of their elders.

Time to throw in the towel and retire to the shed with a bottle of gin - "INNIT" is now permissible as a scrabble word! No doubt it, and other linguistic horrors, will soon be in the Oxford English Dictionary - if they aren't already.

Wow, the connection between 'haitch' and Catholic education seems widespread, though I never came across it before. The nuns who taught me were not Irish - maybe that's why? And I agree with PoppaRob that sectarian divisions (and therefore sectarian remarks) were much more prevalent in the bad old days!

what about 'somethink' this has, at a stretch, a totally different meaning than 'something'.

It drives me mad when I hear the majority of people on TV and radio mis-using this word.

I remember (in the 70's) being berated by teacher friends when I said that their pupils will probably have difficulty learning grammar and spelling if they are not corrected, especially in written exercises. Oh no, they argued, their creativity is much more important.
I suppose we are 'reepin wot we sewed'.

My big hate is the expression 'I turned round and said'. I am always tempted to ask if the speaker had his back to the person in the first place!

I think it was George Orwell who wrote about how sloppy use of language leads to sloppy thinking and he was, undoubtedly right. Grammar is an important tool, especially in the written language, but also matters too in speaking. If "wrong" grammar doesn't obscure the meaning of what is being said, then only pedants should protest – even, although I hate to admit it, when perpetrated by television presenters. When it does obscure meaning, then it truly is a problem. However, Mrs DjangoDog is correct that most of these complaints are about vocabulary. While words do change their meaning over the years, we are losing nuances when words are used in a sloppy way, such as charisma to mean sexy, charming and popular, for example. Similarly, sayings and colloquialisms are also losing their distinctiveness. My pet hate is "in the firing line" for "in the line of fire" – both of which are massively over-used but mean precisely opposite things.

How lovely to have somewhere to moan. My bugbear is 'bored of' in place of bored with. Makes me cringe.

I have just joined Gransnet and have so enjoyed reading all the comments. I agree with them all. I have been bothered with them for years. When my husband was alive I would hear groans from the other room,thinking he had fallen or was in some distress only to find that he was listening to the radio and had spotted some grammatical error.
In1999 we bought the two volume OED and I was shocked at the "baby talk" words in it like "postie" for postman and slang . I notice "aint" is creeping in now. I agree with the writer who mentioned the odd way children hold pens. They do not seem to be taught how to write nowadays. I started off with pothooks and hangers and how to hold one's pen. and as to learning how to spell! The trouble is a great many young teachers have never been taught to spell themselves.

What a lovely idea, I love being a pedant!
My pet hates are 'tuh' instead of 'to', and 'thuh east' instead of 'thee East' (or any other vowel).
I think American films and programmes influence younger people!

Don't really care where or why it started-- I recoil every time I hear haitch. We were never taught this. Ugh !!!!

I agree with so many of the comments here. At the weekend I was glancing through a Next directory and there was a sharp intake of breath from me when I saw "Childrens' bedrooms" at the top of several pages (but not all). I can remember years ago reading my son's marked homework and the teacher has written "alright" in the margin - the exercise book went back to school with "all right" in red ink at the side of the comment. I was also appalled when I discovered quite by accident that he was writing "would of" instead of "would have" in his exercise books - it had never been corrected as far as I could see.

When I complained via e-mail to Sainsbury recently they responded with "till's" instead of "tills" - needless to say I replied and told them where they were going wrong.

I am 63 and I can remember quite vividly been told in English lessons that if we used a proper noun it always had a capital letter - even for things like French doors, Cheddar cheese, etc., - what happened to that?

I do sound like a grump, don't I?

...and "somefink"...whatever happened to th? My school teacher [early 1940s] would have screamed blue murder, and been ready with the ruler!

Mr Hawkins, my teacher in 1946, deserves a mention. He was strict and fair. The children respected him. I remember one "lesson" when I asked, "Please Sir, can I lend your rubber?" He replied, "No..." and then, after a very long pause, added,"but you may borrow my rubber."

I quite agree with most of your pedantic comments - particularly on the subject of 'haitch'. I understand that children are being taught this pronunciation at school.
I don't think anyone has mentioned another pet hate of mine - 'I was sat'/stood'.

Perhaps there is a certain luxury in discussing how 'the Queen's English' is pronounced.
Every time I hear my grandchildren with their New Jersey accent I am delighted.
'Hiya Grandma'
'How ya doin'?

Brings a smile to my face every time.

And what about radio presenters, particularly from BBC4 and The World Service who transpose nearly all vowels into an "ar" sound? A typical example is "This is the BBC Warld Sarvice"