That man Dawkins

Looking at the same link:
www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?terms=Militant%20Atheist
it appears the atheists on here are either moderate atheists or healthy atheists but none are militant atheists. Perhaps we can lay that one to rest.

Was it bags or anno who introduced us to Ship of Fools some time ago? Can't remember now.

Not me. I will look for it though.

Http://ship-of-fools.com

No, it wasn't me either. Never heard of ship of fools. Might go and have a look though.

yuck. Wish I hadn't bothered.

Did you bother to search the forums and find those which discuss serious matters? Anyone could say the same thing about this site after taking a superficial glance. There are light hearted sections, serious sections, support sections, reports and much more. The level of debate on theolological matters by believers and non believers is much more in depth than anything to be found elsewhere.

No, Elf, I admit I didn't look further than the first page. It was off-putting to me. Perhaps you could highlight a few of the articles most interesting to you? I'd have a go at reading them if you did. When you're typing in the gransnet comment box on a thread, if you scroll down a bit you'll see a bit entitled "Links". It tells you how to make a link for posting in the box. Essentially, you just put two square brackets either side of the link text ...

Thanks. I'll try that.

If you go to community - that's the forums, you will find they are divided into various sections. The one called 'Dead Horses - endless no resolution discussions' is the place where matters such women's equality, all matters relating to gay life and homophobia, civil partnerships, abortion, rape and so on are hotly debated. There are also some threads in Purgatory which would be of interest. It's a huge site and quite fast moving and many interesting threads are now in Limbo but still accessible.

I feel that it's well worth spending a bit of time on here if only to see the range of opinion from Quaker to Orthodox to Atheist and all points in between.

On the subject of different types of atheists, whether moderate, healthy or militant, I was amused to read that Dr Sachs called that man Dawkins a Christian atheist as opposed to a Jewish atheist. His argument was that Dawkins was being anti-Semitic when he described the god of the Old Testament as being the nastiest figure in fiction. He claims that this viewpoint is from a Christian perspective as Christians think that their New Testament is better than and supersedes the Old Testament. He adds that this is why so many Jews were persecuted in the Middle Ages – presumably by Christians not atheists of any sort. That Man's reply was that he wasn't anti-Semitic just anti gods and points out some example of the OT god and his endless smiting – Amelkites, I think.

I thought the OT and NT god were supposed to be the same one. Ditto god and Jesus (plus Holy Spirit). From the Christian, not Jewish point of view, of course.

I was singing 'Jerusalem' this morning (I often sing hymns when I like the tunes) and I began to wonder about militant Christianity. What was the the sword going to be used for, I wonder? Then we have the Salvation Army, and Onward Christian Soldiers - all very militiaristic.
Christianity was imposed throughout the world very much in the way attempts are being made to impose Islam,by violence, with the odd bribe (we'll build you a school/hospital if you embrace Christianity).
I don't think most dictators have persecuted people for their religion, but for their opposition to their rule and political beliefs. Stalin happened to be an atheist - Hitler wasn't (although JW's were very badly treated).

Blood and Fire - Sally Army motto. Is Jerusalem a hymn? This was discussed on a previous thread but I don't remember which. Just asking..........

Well, it is religious and I can sing it, so that makes it a hymn for me. I think many hymns began life as poems and then somebody set them to music. Does it matter

Not really.

I also like to sing Jerusalem - and yet, if you think of the words, it is a very scary, nationalist/ fundamentalist song indeed (:

I wonder about Sachs... Chief Rabbis are generally less... daft.

I agree, feetlebaum - I thought he came over as very woolly-minded and the scientists really wiped the floor with him!

My lad teaches Study of Religion at a local Catholic high school, and has invited all sorts of religious leaders to talk to his class. They liked the Rabbi best, and the Imam least, because the rabbi had a great sense of humour and really understood how to give an interesting talk. I suspect the Imam was a bit defensive, but perhaps it was just luck of the draw - another would probably have been good. They liked the Greek Orthodox too.

Always was surprised, ever since I was a child, that people would turn to or away, from religion, because of the personality or behaviour of a vicar or priest.
And where I lived in the UK, it was like musical chairs - people travelling from village to village to attend another Church with a vicar they preferred. Our local chap was very much against the ordination of women - so he attracted a like-minded crowd- whilst the locals who felt differently travelled to another village who had a vicar who was very much pro-women.

When I was a student, some of the funniest (and most ribald) people I knew were Church of Scotland trainee ministers. Extremists never have a sense of humour.

Believe it or not, I had a very dear teacher friend who was a born-again Christian. She didn't push her religion and I didn't push my atheism. She was one of the kindest people I have ever met - I think her sweet personality probably pre-dated her conversion by Billy Graham.
I have never doubted that there are very many sincere believers, in all kinds of religion, who are very good people. Ditto atheists.

Granjura I couldn't agree more! I must admit to having moved churches once even though I was living in the same town, but as I've got older I've come to the conclusion that though I prefer a particular kind of worship (bells and smells in my case) it really doesn't matter. The university chaplaincy here offers both a guide book and a guided tour of churches for freshers so they can find a church they feel at home in. Mixed feelings about that!

Why do you have mixed feelings, Lilygran? Sounds like a good idea.

I met an R.C. nun on a training placement many years ago. She was quite devout, but had a brilliant sense of the funny side of life and we spent a lot of time laughing till the tears ran at all sorts of silly things. She certainly changed a few of my perceptions about nuns.

I was taught by nuns and we had another order to do the domestic chores. The academic nuns were, on the whole, a po-faced bunch, but the others were very jolly. They used to organise slides on the playground for us in the Winter.
In primary school, we had one lovely nun who showed us great warmth, but she was moved on because she was allowing herself to 'love children more than god'.

The person who first made me wonder about the universal wrongness of abortion (as we had been taught) was a Catholic nun. She said she could imagine cases where it was justified.